The Elusive Big Brake Upgrade Revisited

[offroadkarter]

My body is ready for the approaching shitstorm...


Upon my daily trolling of google, I came across this guy with a 745i in the netherlands who fit euro E38 4 piston brembo calipers and rotors to his car.

Off the top of my head, a stock e23 front rotor is 11", the e38 rotor he used is 12.7". The E38 brembo caliper is a lot larger than our calipers also.



http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...diagId=34_0516


I know no other caliper will fit the e23, but I've seen multiple people in Europe CNC machine brackets to fit whatever the hell they want to the front of these cars. I talked to one guy who made brackets to fit 330mm rotors and 6 piston calipers using the e32/34 style bolt spacing, and here we have someone using the factory E38 parts. He even included a picture of the adapters he used to make it work.



The rings are used to center the rotor, I'm not sure what that tiny bracket is for.


Stock brakes



E38 conversion




Here is the forum I found this all on

Translated to English

745i project page translated to english


If we can crank out custom diff mounts and A/C compressor brackets, this should be a walk in the park. I'm going to hunt for more documented examples and see what people are coming up with.

[SicStang03]

The guy that made my coilovers made brackets to fit his car. XYZ Racing 330mm 6 piston caliper front and 4 piston rears. I gave up on brake upgrades. I never race the car so what's the point ? Stock brakes work good for me. I spent some extra money on some good pads and called it a day.

[offroadkarter]

The guy that made my coilovers made brackets to fit his car. XYZ Racing 330mm 6 piston caliper front and 4 piston rears. I gave up on brake upgrades. I never race the car so what's the point ? Stock brakes work good for me. I spent some extra money on some good pads and called it a day.

I talked to that guy on facebook before about his setup, I wish he'd make a few more sets.

[8991XJ]

Paul at Moosehead Engr on mye28 was up for making some brackets but it never materialized. Maybe he needed a donor e23 to work on.

I know need a better set of front brakes and if no brackets show up the next set of pads will not stop the car when they are cold but that should help a lot for when I work the car. The twisties can wear out the brakes on my car.

[offroadkarter]

Paul at Moosehead Engr on mye28 was up for making some brackets but it never materialized. Maybe he needed a donor e23 to work on.

Think it'd be worth me PM'ing him about it? I know they made that kkk27 to tial wastegate adapter once.

[Hit Man X]

Granted I will probably never use them, I will buy a set of brackets (or two) to make a minimum order go through for you. Just will not pay up front.

I have E23 V8/12 rears now, next I need some really good pads.

[offroadkarter]

I'd like to do a rear conversion to, I just want to see if I can come up with something for the front.

[CMG]

Think it'd be worth me PM'ing him about it? I know they made that kkk27 to tial wastegate adapter once.

I just heard he is working on a better second version that he plans to sell soon

[offroadkarter]

I just heard he is working on a better second version that he plans to sell soon

On brake caliper adapters? Or the tial adapter? Because I already bought a S3 TCD kit to solve my not enough boost problem...

[SicStang03]

The mooshead tial adapter was made to fit e28 chassis and would not work on e23... ask me how I know.

[offroadkarter]

If that guy who made the adapter for the 330mm brake kit doesn't remake those, I might come up with a solution. If ever figure this out, I'll update.

[sully32]

The mooshead tial adapter was made to fit e28 chassis and would not work on e23... ask me how I know.

Fits perfectly on my E23

[SicStang03]

Fits perfectly on my E23

The must have revised it. How long ago did you buy? I told them it didn't fit and they bought the unit back from me. I provided pics and everything.

- - - Updated - - -

If that guy who made the adapter for the 330mm brake kit doesn't remake those, I might come up with a solution. If ever figure this out, I'll update.

I reached out to him and he said he gave up on the car and sold the brakes. If he still had them he could have made a run at some. too bad.

[sully32]

The must have revised it. How long ago did you buy? I told them it didn't fit and they bought the unit back from me. I provided pics and everything.

I bought it last year but I have no idea how old it is, I bought it second hand from someone who had it on his E28. Fits great, downpipe works great.

[CMG]

Supposedely he has a guys m106 manifold he is using for the template, hopefully he's revising the fitment problems.

[SicStang03]

I bought it last year but I have no idea how old it is, I bought it second hand from someone who had it on his E28. Fits great, downpipe works great.

wierd, I wonder if the revised to work on both chassis.

Here is a pic of how mine didn't fit. Wouldn't even go over the studs. Even if it did, the WG would never be able to fit with that angle.

[CMG]

Making a bbk for the e23 is not hard just costly. If trying to do front and rear it could cost maybe $2000 to do it right. Then you have to deal with wheel fitment issues sometimes, and brakes could even take more to warm up for day to day driving. I saw an e38 oem brembo set on ebay for $600. There is also the oem brembo e31 fronts which have same pattern as e28 iirc. There is an old school brembo bbk they used to sell for e31 that can be used on e28. If i were to do a bbk i would probably get new aftermarket larger calipers and brackets to fit and just match that with an existing bmw rotor. Throw in a brake bias adjuster and done. That's the kind of thing i'm doing on my 240 but don't think i would try on the e23.

[Hit Man X]

Agreed, stay away from the odd (expensive) calipers. The BMW and Porsche ones just make the cost silly, plus the acquisition of said calipers is a PITA as they are not common.

13" C5 Vette twin piston PBRs up front stopped my '01 quite well with the Z51 suspension. Those with E32 V8/12 rears are probably more braking than 95% would ever need.

C6 Z06/Grand Sport fronts are six piston and about $650 for a pair... NEW. SRT8 Brembos off say a Challenger or 300, are sub $800 front and rear used. Heck I think Nissan 350Z even had optional Brembo brakes as did Subaru STI back when I owned my WRX in 2002.



As for me, next pad swap will be to the Porterfield R4-S and my braking upgrades will be finished. I just have some low dust Wagner pads all around now, SS braided lines, flush annually, reman calipers on all four corners, and still using the E23 solid rears as too lazy to swap in the E32 stuff (I do love my E32 trailing arm upgrade though).

I will still buy a set of brackets or two for the GP to help.

[sully32]

wierd, I wonder if the revised to work on both chassis.

Here is a pic of how mine didn't fit. Wouldn't even go over the studs. Even if it did, the WG would never be able to fit with that angle.

Here are some pics of mine mounted for reference:







Your adapter is decidedly different since mine has a v-band clamp for the WG.

-Shawn

[Hit Man X]

Yup, v-band is what I figured the difference was between them!

I am waiting for a 3D printed proto of TCD's bolt on Tial conversion if anyone is interested.

[8991XJ]

All this specific turbo talk in a thread about e23 brake upgrade? Can we get a new thread for all this off topic stuff, I don't need no damn turbo, my car was built right the second time before it was sold new.

[Hit Man X]

I love your Hartge

[8991XJ]

But I do need bigger brakes. This thing is fun blasting the twisties but sometimes I have to slow down again and again. Stock brakes don't do that.

[Hit Man X]

Agreed! You will use this upgrade, most will not (myself included).

[8991XJ]

Yes, that turbo spool up really kills the 745i from being an apex strafing machine. Highway...well that is completely different.