NEW! EUROSPORT Supercharger kit (Dyno)

**euro4life** · 10-31-2003, 10:05 AM

Josh is finally finishing up his supercharger project! It has been in the works for what seemed like forever. We were all anxious to see the results...

Check these out.

Specs:
96 M3 3.2
Supersprint exhaust
Supercharger System
Tuned software
Runs at 8psi and peaks at 8.5psi

303 ft lbs/343 rwhp on Chevron 92 octane

*veeeerrry late edit* 'twas 91 octane, not 92.

They are going back to the dyno to do some more tuning this and next week.

For the short story and a link to the dyno graph follow this link:
Eurosport Twin Screw Supercharger Kit

They estimate the availability date to be March 2004

**///M3ryder NY** · 10-31-2003, 10:13 AM

WOW, Verrrrrrrrrrrry interesting!

**mikeinsanmarcos** · 10-31-2003, 10:14 AM

: Amazing numbers... will this be CARB certified? Ballpark price?

**blackm3** · 10-31-2003, 10:43 AM

Hm...I read somewhere JConforti was working on SC kit...is this the one?

**chisau** · 10-31-2003, 10:44 AM

Probably a stupid question, but is this Stimpee's project??

**///M3ryder NY** · 10-31-2003, 10:49 AM

Well, Josh isn't Steve, so I would have to guess no! But what the hell do I know...?

**DocWyte** · 10-31-2003, 11:00 AM

That looks great! Wonder when the OBD! system is coming out...

**chisau** · 10-31-2003, 11:01 AM

I only say that because I thought that there was a relationship there between the two of them. I thought that I heard that 'Stimpee's' project was going to have Jim C's software.. What the heck do I know? All I know is that the more these type of options become available to us, the more I do not want to sell my car! More competition means better prices and hopefully higher quality products based on mistakes made by other tuners. We all have got to love this stuff. I've been on the fence with this whole forced induction thing. I've prefered to put money towards a new home, business, etc.. Areas where I can actually benefit financially. Now that things are different for me, I am getting ready to take the plunge.. Bring it on tuners!! Off-topic, but has any one else heard about AA's Vortech upgrade and the possibility of there being an upgraded Rotrex unit?? Probably rumors on the Rotrex deal, but I'm still curious..

**ADVANT123** · 10-31-2003, 11:39 AM

Things in the world of F/I for BMWs just got very interesting.... With so many options becoming available, whats a guy(or girl) to do?? That Eurosport Kit looks very interesting indeed, and since Jim C. is behind it, i'm sure it will be a quality piece. However, since Jim C's name is associated with this project, I'm sure the price won't be cheap.

**blackm3** · 10-31-2003, 11:50 AM

I was going to pull the trigger on the cam kit, but with this coming out....hm....

**97Msedan** · 10-31-2003, 12:03 PM

Price?

**M Rob** · 10-31-2003, 12:17 PM

Uh, oh....I assume OBDI is gonna be available too?

**Jim Conforti** · 10-31-2003, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by ADVANT123
Things in the world of F/I for BMWs just got very interesting.... With so many options becoming available, whats a guy(or girl) to do?? That Eurosport Kit looks very interesting indeed, and since Jim C. is behind it, i'm sure it will be a quality piece. However, since Jim C's name is associated with this project, I'm sure the price won't be cheap.

ADVANT123,

Thanks for the props..

Things I'm associated with are quality for one reason.. I don't
GET involved with anything that I don't think IS quality.

But please let me clear something up.

My "involvement" with anything isn't what makes it expensive.

My "involvement" isn't about the money.. because if it was I
wouldn't have left my career as a computer consultant.

What's been lost as "internet communities" now multiply is
that for the first 3 years, my involvement was "free" to the
car owners and funded solely by ME. People forget the BMW CCA
functions where we "gave away" chips and tuning, generally
for a "thank you" and sometimes for a drink at the bar.

I guess you could say it bothers me a bit, because
In this world you can either INNOVATE or IMITATE.

You can either figure it out first, or wait for someone else to
figure it out and then COPY it.

INNOVATION costs money.

IMITATION doesn't.

If you look throughout industrial history, you'll see it.

As to why INNOVATION costs money? Because the cost of
business.. the cost of figuring something out.. comes at the
price of the many EXPENSIVE failures that no one ever sees.

Like the Rotrex charger we played with back in the late 90's.

Where do you think the money for all the R&D comes from?

It comes from a company (or in the case of the Rotrex, out of
Josh's pocket.. and my pocket)

We still have those chargers somewhere on a shelf, collecting
dust and grime. Want a paperweight?

Yet, people buy something from the copiers based upon "price".

Hey guys, I hate to tell you.. but the copiers will always be
cheaper than the guys who innovated the original design.

The kicker of a question is:

What happens one day, when the innovators get sick
of doing things that get copied??

Well, they stop innovating.

They pack up their marbles and go play somewhere else.

Let's forget the S/C for a second. Let's talk about putting M50
manifolds on later motors... who figured out how to do it and
still pass emissions? Who designed the plate that connects
the emissions hoses/etc?? JOSH did.. (from Eurosport).

The tuning on the M50 manifold/cams kit isn't just about
"air/fuel ratios" and "power" but also driveability.. things like
smooth idle when coldstarting and stalling when coming to
a stop had to be handled at great use of time. I know because
I spent a good month working it all out.

Now suddenly, others copy the idea, but somehow the copies
are more novel than the original.. BULL!

Back to Supercharger kits.. not to put words into either Josh's or
Stimpee's mouths, but both kits are novel, and both are aimed
at different initial markets.

Josh's kit is being setup for later OBD-II E36's.. Stimpees for
the earlier OBD-I E36's.

Where each of them goes from there is up to them.

SO, who wants to make me a bet on how long it takes some
other company to copy either Josh or Stimpee and then say
that their product is "superior".

I figure 12-18 months from release of the first kit.

Jim

**Silex** · 10-31-2003, 02:54 PM

Um jim...can't these guys patent their designs and then make royalties off of selling their patents? If making money off your design is important, then this wouldn't pose a problem. This is assuming that you don't dislike immitators at all.

**CABimmer** · 10-31-2003, 03:04 PM

Jim, I just wanted to say that your Cam kit rocks. Ive had it for a week now and the quality of all the components are rock solid.

Thanks for brining a quality product to market in a world of crappy BMW parts.

I look forward to seeing the new SC kit.

**Jim Conforti** · 10-31-2003, 03:24 PM

Originally posted by Silex
Um jim...can't these guys patent their designs and then make royalties off of selling their patents? If making money off your design is important, then this wouldn't pose a problem. This is assuming that you don't dislike immitators at all.

It's a lot more complicated than that.

Patents cost 10's of thousands just to get and sometimes
MILLIONS to defend.

Stimpee is correct on the S/C kits.

Same with the manifold adapter.

If you have a design patent, all you have to do is change
the design and you "skirt" the patent.

All-in-all, the US Patent system is a mess and somewhat of a
joke among other countries.

**Jim Conforti** · 10-31-2003, 03:30 PM

Originally posted by CABimmer
Jim, I just wanted to say that your Cam kit rocks. Ive had it for a week now and the quality of all the components are rock solid.

Thanks for brining a quality product to market in a world of crappy BMW parts.

I look forward to seeing the new SC kit.

Thanks Doug,

Happy owners are our best reward.

Most of the props for the cam kit though, should go to Josh.

I only tuned it.

Jim

**BS05ZHP** · 10-31-2003, 03:31 PM

any pricing rumors?

**97Msedan** · 10-31-2003, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by Jim Conforti

Same with the manifold adapter.

So this kit uses the stock intake manifold?

**Jim Conforti** · 10-31-2003, 03:39 PM

The supercharger?? No.. not at all.

The CAM kit needs an adapter to allow all the emissions hoses
from the M52/S52 to fit onto an M50/S50 manifold.

**97Msedan** · 10-31-2003, 03:44 PM

Originally posted by Jim Conforti
The supercharger?? No.. not at all.

The CAM kit needs an adapter to allow all the emissions hoses
from the M52/S52 to fit onto an M50/S50 manifold.

OK, that make a lot more sense.

**M3TurboCa** · 10-31-2003, 03:53 PM

I like the dyno graph and power this s/c kit produces.

Damm this s/c makes almost max torque from 3500+ and then the hp takes off on the top end.

Very good torque even down low 2500rpm

**96cosmosM3** · 10-31-2003, 04:10 PM

How about some pictures?

**NicolasW** · 10-31-2003, 04:18 PM

Since I work at the Patent Office, I will chime in....usually you cannot get a patent by combining known elements to perform their known function. Notice I said "usually". The whole grey area of my job is in whether such a combination would be obvious (35 USC 103). Jim is correct in saying it costs thousands to get a patent and possibly millions defending/enforcing it.

Jim - You might remember talking to me about 4 or 5 years ago at a special event that Curry's Auto Service set up...Hope things are doing well! I have your Euro HFM CAI kit and it is fantastic! Keep up the good work.

Anyway, those dyno numbers looked SICK!! I cant' wait till this comes out. I know it's still in the development stages, but I'm curious to see an A/F graph.

Wes
'95 M3

**Jim Conforti** · 10-31-2003, 04:28 PM

Originally posted by stimpee
Why do you think I have been hyping and defending this approach to the "naysayers" all along??!?!?!?!
Steve

Steve wasn't even hyping.

Ask yourself this.. how many OEM's are using (insert the name
of the centrifugal supercharger of the week here) out of the
factory.

The only chargers used by OEM's are positive displacement units.

Look at the Ford Cobra, the Merc. Kompressors, etc.

Either the eaton style "Roots" blower or the Opcon style
"Lysholm" aka "Twin Screw" blower.

The smart ones use a twin screw because of the efficiency.

There is a reason for this.

There is also a reason why most aftermarketeers are using
the centrifugals.

The cost of putting a centri blower on a motor is an order of
magnitude cheaper than putting a p.d. blower. I'm talking
the R&D of course, not the finished product MSRP.

With a PD blower you generally need to use an air/water
cooler and have a complete intake manifold designed.

That's water tanks, hoses, pumps, heat exchangers/etc.

Not to mention they are quite a bit harder to tune than a Centri.

With a Centri, you need brackets and plumbing that in all
reality could be whipped up in a weekend. The tuning can
be accomplished on a dyno in a day.

A P.D. blower is hard to fit to an engine, but the results
speak loudly for themselves.

Serious Torque right off idle, with no compromise in reliable
horsepower.

Or as I've said before.. HP doesn't win races, torque does.

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