Got Hosed with O2 Sensor Cost

[jaguax]

Kind of long, but I need to rant.

I had to bring my car in for an inspection the other day. I've had a check engine light for a while now, confirmed to be bad O2 sensors. So I bought two Bosch 15733 Universals which I planned to install myself.

Unfortunately due to my laziness the inspection day snuck up on me before I had time to install them so I figured that the mechanic could install them for me. This was my fathers "preferred" mechanic, so I was hoping that everything would go smoothly.

So I bring in the universal O2 sensors to the mechanic and he immediately says "I'm not installing those. Why waste time splicing wires when I can just get direct plug and play sensors?"

What! Waste time? You are a mechanic! Time = money. Where is the logic in that statement?

So later on he calls my house while I am sleeping and my father answers the phone. Turns out that getting the O2 sensors under these time constraints means that they will cost $200 apiece. That's right. $400 for TWO O2 sensors!

Now myself, I would never agree to this nonsense but my father panicked since my inspection was overdue and ordered them. So it was too late for me to cancel. I should add here that my parents are the ones paying the majority of this because of my current financial situation. Now I feel really bad for them because of this ridiculousness.

At the end of the day the inspection cost a total of $500 just to inspect the car and change two bad O2 sensors.

Was it right for the mechanic to refuse universal O2 sensors? The guy needed to splice a total of 8 wires together and it would've literally saved me hundreds of dollars. He had the universals in his hand, but instead he orders $200 O2 sensors because he doesn't want to splice wires.

Then he goes on to lecture me "Never use universal O2 sensors. You will be back here in less than one year complaining to me about frayed wires."

Human decency people. Show some of it and you will go a long way in life.

End rant.

[Veritas325]

ouch. that sucks.

[vmwerks]

We never use them nor do we recommend them if you aren't REALLY careful with the solder job you could still throw CEL's. As a shop owner I would not take responsiblity for someone elses parts especially generic O2 sensors.
It has nothing to do with splicing wires. He knew better than to take responsibility for someone elses parts.

No offense but if it was so easy why didn't you do it yourself?

[Pswirley]

I heard the 167 price tag on my sensor OBD1 and started splicing the econoline sensor. Total cost to replace 60 bucks and total time 1.5 hours. CEL gone as soon as I installed and started car.

[smurfdawg]

Live the Yuppie life, drive the Yuppie car, pay the Yuppie price.

Don't live the Yuppie life, but like to pose as a Yuppie? Pay the Yuppie price.

Don't live the Yuppie life, don't make the Yuppie income, but like the Yuppie car? Be quiet and learn to get your hands dirty.

[93bmw325is]

basically the mechanic is an idiot , so he is saying the wires wil fray becouse he isnt going to splice them together correctly if he used heat shrink tubing wich costs a wopping 2.00 (about the same price as a soda) they would never fray or corrode. also you can get original 02 sensors for $98 each . but keep in mind shops make alot of there money overcharging for the parts.

[sirius600]

Live the Yuppie life, drive the Yuppie car, pay the Yuppie price.

Don't live the Yuppie life, but like to pose as a Yuppie? Pay the Yuppie price.

Don't live the Yuppie life, don't make the Yuppie income, but like the Yuppie car? Be quiet and learn to get your hands dirty.

well said

[strogg]

basically the mechanic is an idiot , so he is saying the wires wil fray becouse he isnt going to splice them together correctly if he used heat shrink tubing wich costs a wopping 2.00 (about the same price as a soda) they would never fray or corrode. also you can get original 02 sensors for $98 each . but keep in mind shops make alot of there money overcharging for the parts.

+1 on that. i think those mechanics should let the customer sign a waiver saying, "hey, if anything goes wrong it's your own damn fault for supplying us sucky parts" rather than just declining. that way, when it does fail (splicing o2 sensors isn't terribly foolproof), the mechanic will make more money on labor! haha, but since most mechanics don't have waivers, i believe he was on the right when he wouldn't splice them on. splicing == ghetto way, and i don't think mechanics should do ANYTHING the ghetto way.

on another note, why do some mechanics decline using customer's parts anyhow? like, the proper parts. i mean, one time i needed tie rods replaced, and i figured i'll just save time and effort on my part and let the local alignment place install them. those idiots decided to charge me over practically $600 to install them. i was like, "why's it so expensive?" they said that the parts cost $186 per tierod assembly. i asked where the hell they got that price, and they said their supplier. i laughed and said that i can get OE equivalent (bilstein) for $46 a piece, Lemforder for $75, and actual OE for $113 from the dealership, then told him off for his price being ridiculous. obviously, the mech was quite upset, although at me and not his supplier. he then refused to sell me those particular parts i mentioned and won't even let me bring in those parts because of the whole he doesn't want to be responsible for customer parts thing. then i asked what makes his parts so special and who actually made them. he couldn't answer that. "so if they're ebay parts, i'm not letting you install ebay parts on my car. bye." and i never went back there again. sheesh..... ok </rant>

[damone6969]

most shops here wont install customer supplied parts. To quote my mechanic

"we cant make a decent living on labour cost alone, we make money off the parts too"

[strad]

If I were in his shoes, I would not be splicing wires. I would be installing things that are guaranteed to work the way they did when the car was new.

If you want to screw around with stuff, do the work yourself. Don't complain when the mechanic does the job the correct way.

[jer0177]

most shops here wont install customer supplied parts. To quote my mechanic

"we cant make a decent living on labour cost alone, we make money off the parts too"

Having turned wrench before, there's some skill involved in actually diagnosing and ordering the correct part - and that's where the markup comes in. Don't go yelling about "their job is diagnosing, why am I paying labor charges, blah blah blah", because yes, their job is repairing your car, but there's more involved in it that just turning a wrench.

Ever hear the tale of the old man that knew everything about steam locomotives? He was called down to the tracks one day to figure out why a locomotive wasn't working. He surveyed the situation, chalked an X on the side of the beast, and asked for the strongest man to come forward with a sledge hammer and hit the X as hard as he could. The locomotive started working after that - the man asked for $100 payment, and paid $2 to the sledge hammer guy. The $98, he kept for himself for knowing where to hit.

I would agree with the tech in not using a universal O2 sensor. Even with soldering and heat-shrinking the connections, it's still asking for trouble.

I also think a 100% markup on parts (that are over ten bux or so to start with) is a little ridiculous.

[fsuadams]

At the risk of getting too personal, if you are in a sticky financial situation and have to have your parents pay for the repair why not get your hands dirty, do some research and install the sensors yourself, how much would that have saved you, I mean your parents? See smurfdog's yuppie comments...

I bought my car about a year ago with virtually no car knowledge and have poured over pelican parts article, my haynes manual, etc and have learned that cars really aren't that complicated. If you do the work yourself you save a TON of money and you can make better decisions on what's best for your baby.

Maybe you could sell the '69 Rolls Royce in your signature and you could have enough money to get back on your feet and pay for your own repairs....???

[jamin325i]

bimmerparts.com offers bosch 02 sensors at $118 each for that '97 328is and there has to be some profit in that price.
i beleive its normal shop practice to charge customer their cost times 2, so $200/sensor is likely typical.
it should be an easy install at the home garage.

[jaguax]

Guys, you are misunderstanding me. I do ALL of the work on my car, except the big things like clutch replacement. I love working on my car, even in a crappy dirt driveway!

I admitted in the first post that I got lazy with the O2 sensors. The car didn't run any differently with the CEL on and I was still getting the same gas mileage, so it wasn't my number one priority to replace. Then the inspection day came before I knew it, and my choice was to either attempt a rush job replacing the O2 sensors (which time did not permit), or have the mechanic install them. I had no idea that the mechanic would refuse universal sensors at the time, or else I would've replaced them long ago.

I also would've never accepted a $200 per sensor price tag. Like I said, my dad took care of that business. Had I answered the phone, I would've said no, taken the car back, and installed them myself.

I'm sure a decent job of following directions would've made the Bosch universals last as long as any plug and play sensor. They come with nice heavy duty connectors to hold everything together. Hell I would've spliced them myself and handed them to the mechanic to install.

Another note - The Rolls Royce is my fathers, he bought it on a whim from Ebay and had it shipped from CA to NY. It was a GREAT car, though it has developed some kind of electrical problem and now it just sits in the driveway. Sad but true.

[BimmerChuck]

Chaulk it up to a learning experience. Don't bring parts to a mechanic and laziness and/or procrastination cost.

[fsuadams]

That does suck about the Rolls, and the sensors for that matter.

[amozarte]

To the OP:

First I'll say that I'm sorry you're out a lot of money for such a simple repair. I would be pretty miffed as well if I woke up and realised I was in a similar situation...

...miffed at myself.

And that's the real key to the issue here- that the person you're upset with is really yourself, not the mechanic. I'm not saying you're a bad person, heck for all I know you and I might get on like brothers. I'm just asking you to recognise that your series of bad decisions, and not your mechanic's "lack of decency", resulted in substantial cost to you.

Here are the facts, that we might develop a "car proof", as opposed to a "plane proof" like your signature:

1. Mechanic/Dealership prices for parts & labour on a BMW are expensive.

2. Mechanics/Dealerships add a markup, for better or for worse. Refer back to #1.

3. The majority of mechanics/dealerships will NOT accept customer supplied parts due to (but not limited to) liability reasons. We, as consumers, can argue about how we feel about that, but the fact remains- the *majority* just don't do it. Refer back to #1.

4. The words "Rush" and/or "Priority" almost always mean additional cost. Just ask FedEx or UPS what the price difference is for overnight vs standard shipping. You "got lazy" and procrastinated, forcing yourself into a rush/priority situation.

5. Prior to performing any work, the mechanic fully disclosed the costs to your dad, who agreed to them- knowing he was the one who had to pay that bill.


You could have done the work yourself, but you didn't and that left you at the mercy of the #1-3. You waited until the last minute, see #4. You chose not to be available for the mechanic's call and also chose not to notify whoever might answer the phone to come and wake you, see #5.

The bottom line is that you had ample opportunity to avoid a bad situation but at each turn you chose not to act. I still feel bad for you, because I've been there before- everyone has. But please, please, please rather than pass the blame to your mechanic, accept responsibility for your actions.



PS- Take the Rolls off you tag... I believe that section specifically says "Not your dad's cars, not your sister's cars, YOUR cars"

[karlow]

OK, OK
Worse case your soldering job sucks, what would be the down side?
A CEL, and the car would not run on closed loop. You guys seem a bit mechanically challenged! Soldering is a skill, you might want to use crip connectors. If you strip the wire prio to there use it's nothing that most eight year olds would get wrong on the first try. Note: the phone companies do not solder wires anymore. What you should have done was to spliced the wires for him. You would have to crawl under the car and cut the connectors off the old sensor first. And while you are down there, you might as well do the install the dam things.
Remember, we are talking about old luxury cars. They are just like new luxury cars except they require a lot more manitence. If you are not going to do it yourself, you can expect to pay luxury car prices to get it done. It doesn't get cheeper just because the car is only worth $3500. It is going to run about $120-$200/hr.
Now it's time to ask yourself, can you afford to have someone maintain your car?

[jaguax]

Amozarte, nice post. But the facts do not make it right. In a perfect world, a mechanic would be like a brother to me. I could ask him to install whatever I wanted, and I would pay him actual labor cost to do it. I would accept any liability agreements, all it would take is a simple signature. I guess what I am dreaming about is a "better system," where people don't think so much about money but about doing what the customer requests. After all, the customer is always right. /end dream

But you're absolutely right, I was lazy in this case and I (my parents) paid the price for it. It was wrong of me to assume that a mechanic would install any part I brought in, however this specific mechanic did tell my dad that he would install whatever we brought in. But apparently universal sensors are his worst enemy.

As for the Rolls, it's more of a father/son weekend toy to drive around in. Or at least it used to be. Now it's just a comfortable place to sit. Thing has living room sofas for seats!

[350chevrolet]

sorry to ruin your dream but 98% of the time the customer has no f@#$ing idea what they need or are talking about, even tho you still need to be polite. i personally will never install a part that a customer brings me because you have no idea where they got a 100$ part for $5.95. i also wont use aftermarket parts bacause they seem to fail sooner than using oem ones. granted i buy oem parts at wholesale and sell them at a 50-75% markup but that is simply called retail pricing and thats how EVERY store makes their money. BUT the shop that i work for does NOT do a 300-500% markup like i have seen done. i think you can get the correct bosch sensor at bav for like 75$. universal o2 sensors are never the way to go unless you want to do the job twice.

and as for a waiver, there not worth the paper there written on. people will allways blame you for incorrectly installing the part and say that their 5$ fuel pump was not the problem.

[smurfdawg]

.........due to my laziness...

+

.....the inspection cost a total of $500 just to inspect the car and change two bad O2 sensors....

To jaguax, I took the liberty of editing your first original post so that it expresses your thoughts more concisely. Because of the newly aligned clarity, your parents now have the proper bulls eye to aim their foot.

[ncipps]

+1 couldn't agree more with the above post.