e36 into e30 engine swap or 4cly turbo questions.

[Cosmos///95Lux]

I love my 95 but have always had a love affair with the style and handling of the e30. Is there any way to get the best of both worlds -- power of e36 into an e30?? I know people do engine swaps but how reliable is that and will that lead to more money down the line in maintenece costs due to the fact that the e30 was not designed for a more powerful engine???
Does anyone make a turbo or SC kit for the e30 4cyl???

[Bry]

The s14 motor in an E30 M3 is a very picky engine. Superchargers and turbos can work, but it is very hard to get it right. I know someone who lives in the Austin, TX area, who does engine conversions. His e-mail is wofford69@hotmail.com

You would want to talk to him about an engine conversion. People have done them before, it adds a lot of smooth torque, but personally, I love the s14 motor. Chris also knows some other people who can do this, so try sending him an e-mail.

[JamesM3M5]

You can swap any E36 motor into the E30. The M50/S50 swap is becoming the hot ticket. Zionsville Autosport sells a CD-ROM that details the whole conversion start to finish. Can be done for less than $8k with an E36 M3 engine and tranny. Highly recommended you upgrade the suspension and brakes. Any Z3, M-Roadster or M-Coupe suspension will bolt right up, and then you can use the bigger E36 brakes. The E30 M3 suspension bolts in, too. All will give you 5-bolts hubs.

Turbo or supercharging the S14 isn't recommended. They don't handle it well and are a tuning nightmare. Get a 320i or 318i motor and bore/stroke and add the turbo with the 2-valve head. It's much cheaper, and the heads seem to take pressure more easily than the S14 head.

A well-tuned S50 with software, cams, valve springs, pistons, etc, can put out a very torquey and reliable 300+HP. You just can't do it with the S14. A 300HP S14 engine will have about 230lb-ft of torque and will last a year or so on the track. They're just too fragile and expensive. I love the S14 engine, but for gobs of power, you have to go with the S50.

JamesM

[Bry]

I don't like it when people take out a s14 motor, and replace it with a m50 motor. It destroys not only the value of the car, but also the character of the e30 m3. Sure you can do it with some money, but it really hurts the resale value. If you do a z3 aluminum block, with an e36 euro m3 head, it would be pretty awesome, but it would still be different than what it was meant for.

[Mark S.]

bry
i had my e30 m3 converted to 3.2 last fall. it was the best thing i ever did for myself. i have owned 3 e30 m3's and 1 e36 m3. the e30's are obviously my favorite. i felt that i needed some more power to contend with lunacy in northern nj traffic, so i had don fields of autosport performance in nj convert the car.

as far as wrecking the resale value, it would only make the remaining of the 5000 cars originally brought into north america more valuable because i have DESTROYED 1 of 5000. there is a lot of interest in how many cars are actually still on the road out of the original 5000.

i had my car at sigfest this summer which is a group of over 800 people around the world with e30 m3's who share valuable information with each other on a mailing list. they originally bashed the whole idea of converting my car. after seeing it at the picnic(60 e30 m3's) everyone kept complimenting me and saying that they were now thinking about it themselves. i let one member take it for a ride and he said he will be building one now. he happened to be a die hard s14 guy.

you just can't imagine how much power the car gets from the upgrade. everyone is certainly entitled to their opinion. i just did what was best for me. i welcome any questions anyone might have about the car. by the way, the balance is no different with the 6 cyl. vs. the 4 cyl.

mark
mark@rogueengineering.com
www.rogueengineering.com

[Bry]

Yes, you do need it in traffic situations. I have driven in an m50 motor conversion, and it has tons of power. Where I live, there is no traffic on my drive, so I have it lucky, but when you are in stop in go traffic, it can be a real pain.

Mark, I am mainly talking about M50 motor conversions, your car is an s50 correct? That still has the character of a M3, because it is a m3, just a newer version.

[JSN]

I have seen more S50 in e30's than any other engine swaps. fits surprising well, as well as it should

[chuck90m3]

here are a few pic of my swap. if you have any questions or want any info on the details please feel free to call us at:
INTERNATIONAL AUTO
770-745-0501
ask for Chuck

[Bry]

Wow, old thread! When I was young and naive

I only had my car 1 month when this thread was made!

[E30 toy]

I would like to defend the S14 in one way: Tune... Most people complain of the power of an e30 m3 unless they ride in one that is in tip top shape. My butt dyno feels about 40 hp between a well running 2.3 and one with vaccum leaks, out of adjustment valves, out of sync throttle bodies and other things. The s14 is tweaky and needs to be tuned just right to be at that 192 bhp. I do also have proof of this. At a recent autocross there were all three generations of M3's there and 2 e30's (including mine.) I beat all of them by a considerable number and everyone said how much harder mine pulled in the straightaway than the e36 and e46. I have a few mods, but not too many. I do understand that if an s14 blows up (rod through block etc) all of the sudden an s52 swap seems like a very good idea- if it hasn't blown up make it run right and you won't be dissapointed! I can't count the number of e30 m3's that I have seen that literally run like crap...

[E30 toy]

Oh, if you see an S14 with the yellow caps on the throttle body adjusters, the TB's have never been adjusted! I see this all the time... This makes a HUGE difference in the way they run. Replacment caps are blue and the yellow ones are destroyed when you adjust the TB's.

[reelizmpro]

About S14 performance....years ago a 300HP S14 was hard to obtain at all, let alone reliably and only a few people knew what it took to build one. Today it's a completely different ballgame. One big reason are aftermarket piggybacks allowing us the convert from AFM to MAF or Alpha N. This alone improves HP/Torque across the board on the S14. Another reason is the E30 M3 S14 community is very tightknit and there's a ton of information out there on just about everything like what works and what doesn't, etc. I have contemplated the swap myself, years ago but decided to keep the S14 in the car and save the swap for my 88 325iS when the time comes. In the meantime, I have a stock 2.3 S14 w/284/276 cams, Grp A header, 48mm throttles, CF DTM intake and Maxx programmable alpha N computer making (untuned) 209rwhp/250HP from "bolt on" mods. Combined, the CF hood and CF intake drop about 35lbs off the front and retaining the S14 improves the cars original weight distribution closer to 50/50.

A friend of mine recently finished his M3. It makes 248rwhp on a 2.4 rebuild, 11.5:1 compression, 292/284 cams, big valves, RK headwork, E3 header, SS race system , TMS 2.5 DMod chip, 48mm throttles on an otherwise stock intake w/Evo airbox and E3 AFM!

[seantn1k]

So the complete Z3/M3 Roadster suspension rear subframe with trailing arms and the front end subframe with shock assemblies will fit? If so does the front subframe have reinforced swaybar mount locations?

Also I wanted to ask about the S50 3.2 swap, did you have to switch to OBDI?

Sean S
(Blowing up E30 M20B25's like it's nobody's business)

[gobuffs]

Also I wanted to ask about the S50 3.2 swap, did you have to switch to OBDI?

S50 B32 by definition is the Euro 3.2. It is not OBD II compliant. Requires no conversion.

The S52 B32 by definition is the US 3.2. If you put this one in you will need to convert it to OBD I.

If you need a S50 B32 (yes Euro 3.2) I have one for sale with tranny and all electronics. $10k/obo.
________
Medical Marijuana Seeds

[Soviet1942]

S50 B32 by definition is the Euro 3.2. It is not OBD II compliant. Requires no conversion.

The S52 B32 by definition is the US 3.2. If you put this one in you will need to convert it to OBD I.

If you need a S50 B32 (yes Euro 3.2) I have one for sale with tranny and all electronics. $10k/obo.

Thats a lot of money
I thinks I'd rather buy me another E30 with that money.

[GGray]

You can swap any E36 motor into the E30. The M50/S50 swap is becoming the hot ticket. Zionsville Autosport sells a CD-ROM that details the whole conversion start to finish. Can be done for less than $8k with an E36 M3 engine and tranny. Highly recommended you upgrade the suspension and brakes. Any Z3, M-Roadster or M-Coupe suspension will bolt right up, and then you can use the bigger E36 brakes. The E30 M3 suspension bolts in, too. All will give you 5-bolts hubs.

Turbo or supercharging the S14 isn't recommended. They don't handle it well and are a tuning nightmare. Get a 320i or 318i motor and bore/stroke and add the turbo with the 2-valve head. It's much cheaper, and the heads seem to take pressure more easily than the S14 head.

A well-tuned S50 with software, cams, valve springs, pistons, etc, can put out a very torquey and reliable 300+HP. You just can't do it with the S14. A 300HP S14 engine will have about 230lb-ft of torque and will last a year or so on the track. They're just too fragile and expensive. I love the S14 engine, but for gobs of power, you have to go with the S50.

JamesM

They do fine with boost most of the super high hp cars over in Sweden run S38 turbo motors...Guess what an S14 is...An S38 with two holes wacked off. Tuning isn't an issue now there are a few tuners who can burn chips and you can buy MAf conversions and such to tune the car with a lap top...

I may build a turbo S14 to put in my M3 replica vert next year...Instead of the normal S50/S52 motor swap...I like the trusty S14 motors too

[futurevagabond]

So, There was a lot of talk on this thread about a M50 motor swap into a M3 E30. But I have neither. I have a 1992 318IC E30 and wasn't wanting to get rid of the car when it, inevitably, craps out. I was looking to put a bigger motor in it, would the M50 be a good one to swap even though it isn't an M3?

[mlytle]

an e30 is an e30 engine wise. does not matter m3, vert or coupe. anything that swaps in one swaps in the others. engine bay is the same. if you want info on swaps, try
www.r3vlimited.com. site devoted to nothing but e30's and tons of engine swap info.

[DeM3n]

This thread is old. Really old.

Not your best post bro.

an e30 is an e30 engine wise. does not matter m3, vert or coupe. anything that swaps in one swaps in the others. engine bay is the same. if you want info on swaps, try
www.r3vlimited.com. site devoted to nothing but e30's and tons of engine swap info.

Definitely check that website out. There is tons of info on this swap, nowadays, that really the only issue has to be money. The knowledge is out there and, if you search, you can find it to make this M5x/S5x swap possible.

[bluebmw83]

not to be off topic but is this a good buy cause i would love to do a conversion as such and get this one here.
http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...5&aff=national

[DeM3n]

not to be off topic but is this a good buy cause i would love to do a conversion as such and get this one here.
http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...5&aff=national

Dead link.