why you should never own a BMW out of warranty

[ycis]

or period for that matter.

This 760LI was the first...and last bmw ill ever own...I havent even put 10k miles on it in its 2 years of ownership.

just a quick summary of the history of this car since its purchase

12/6/06 CEL - replaced defective left side 02 sensor 7 days in shop 598
1/26/07 CEL - replaced intake gaskets and pcv valve 7 days in shop 859
3/7/07 CEL - replaced right side 02 sensor 10 days in shop 1255
6/15/07 CEL - faulty tank venting system valve..special order from germany 14 days in shop 1170
8/13/07 CEL - same tank vent valve 7 days in shop 151
8/27/07 CEL - swapped DME's, reprogrammed 100 mile drive 9 days in shop 0
9/7/07 - dead battery after first use of car getting it back from 8/27 repair - 4 days in shop 298
10/22/07 CEl - pre cat 02 sensor replaced 4 days in shop - 228
12/12/07 - CEL tech reset codes without doing anything, car returned to me after 250 miles put on car 16 days in shop $106
1/2/08 - CEL - replaced oil separator valve and cleaned valves due to carbon buildup - 15 days in shop - $2229

93 days in the shop
10 total trips
7000 in repairs not including labor

just got it back for the 10th time...and they claim its "fixed" now after sending 3 separate FSEs out to look at it.

oddly enough I spoke to the tech who worked on it on trips 1-3...and he claims that there were no signs of carbon buildup on the intake or valves when the gaskets and pcv were replaced earlier in the year.

BMW usa has claimed that even though I have been without my car that I am paying for for over 90 days...I dont qualify for any sort of goodwill reimbursement.

Id hate to see what has to happen to a car for it to qualify!

Lets also remind ourselves that this car is valued by BMW at nearly 100 THOUSAND dollars less than what it sold for new....and its still under factory warranty. I can see why now.

[740ILMIKE]

Thats why I'll stick with an E38.

[eddieb022000]

sounds like you got a lemon... those prices are way high too for what they did

[gspdave45]

My 750 is still for sale! And it has a warranty!
Sorry to hear about your experience. Can't imagine paying that much on a car and having no use for that long, let alone the inconvenience. I would be PISSED.

[heifetz17]

First off, find a new shop. If it takes them 10 days to replace an o2 sensor and 4 days to replace a battery, something's wrong.

Secondly, what year is this? I ask because you should NEVER buy a brand new car that they haven't worked out all the bugs and kinks, and this is why.

I've had 5 BMWs, 4 of which had no warranty on them. I've never had a single problem, other than regular maintenance, with any of them. I had to replace the clutch in my e36, but I consider that maintenance since it's a wear item. BMW's are the only car I'll drive. Try an older 7, or maybe even a 5. One that has some good miles under its belt.

Also, I work for a Dodge dealership, and I know all those things you mentioned would have been covered under Chrysler factory warranty, had this been a chrysler product. So why, I must ask, would BMW not cover anything, unless it's a service contract and not a factory warranty?

[ycis]

there is only one certified dealership for BMWs in this town...its Tom Bush BMW.

they have sent a total of 4 "Regional service engineers" to tackle the problem on this vehicle over the course of these 10 trips...including 2 for the last one.

I dont care what the prices are...its all covered by the warranty.

however the 3 full months in the shop is over 4000 worth of payments and insurance out of my pocket and being unable to drive my car.

[heifetz17]

Every state has a lemon law, why not pursue it?

[ycis]

that is my next course of action...however after mentioning this to BMWUSA and my service manager...I was told that after the car was fixed this time that BMW would work with me for an amicable solution to the situation.

However the last email I received from BMW states:

Dear Mr. Rogers:

Thank you for your reply. BJ and his staff are committed to ensuring that the vehicle is properly road tested before returning it to you.

In your message you mention compensation for the time your vehicle has been down. Your vehicle does not qualify for our goodwill perimeters at this time. I understand that your have been provided with a loaner car and that the BMW center staff have considered your repair a priority. I am sorry we were unable to meet with your satisfaction. I do encourage you to contact me in the future if need be.

If you have any further comments or questions, please respond to this e-mail or contact the Customer Relations and Services Department at 1-800-831-1117, Monday through Friday from 9:00 A.M. to 9:00 P.M., Eastern Standard Time. Again, thank you for contacting BMW.

Sincerely,

Melinda Sabo
Customer Relations and Services
Representative

[chico728]

Sorry to hear about all the sh!t you're going through.

I'd have thought you have grounds for at least a goodwill gesture, if only to soften the financial blow.

After all they have made a good percentage out of all the repairs.

I am amazed that such an advanced car has so many problems - that care would retail at about £80,000 ($155,000?) over here and would be a good £35000 after a couple of years.

Has yours done monster milage?

[04SSHD]

that sucks, also adds to the numerous horror stories that I have heard about the e65 and e66 line. I like the look of them but i would never own one out of a warranty.

[ycis]

car has 28k miles on it as it sits now.

mileage in for first repair of CEL issue was 20,100

Dealership claims the used value of the car is at $50k...thats an 80 thousand dollar depreciation while still under factory warranty.

They have an 03 760 on their used lot for sale asking 45k

funny that they have an 04 750 on the lot for 55.

[ycis]

I was amused at a friends comment the other day about the value of the car..

"well I can see why noone would want it...its got a check engine light problem" lol

I can only laugh at this point as this entire situation is so ridiculous.

[T56 Impala]

Sorry you have a bad taste in your mouth from that. I am in complete agreement. I would have NEVER bought the e38 or the e66 if they had not been CPO cars with low mileage. Too many things that can go wrong on a car with so many bells and whistles. I will sell my e66 before the the warranty expires. Will I get another BMW? WHo knows. I do like them when they ae running and acting correctly.

Where abouts in JAX are you? I lived there for a while. We had a home in JCP. It was before it got too large but I bet it is still a nice place to live.

[ycis]

not bad..how long have you had your impala...ive had 3 of em in the past and used to participate in JAIL etc.

[T56 Impala]

Scott and I founded the JAILERSS!!!! I sold mine and bought the e38 a few years back. Too hard on me to keep it running. It was barely streetable in the end.

I hear Scottie boy is getting hitched! If you run across Scott, Chris or any of the older members, tell tham I said howdy!

[chico728]

Jesus, 28k miles.

You could have expected issues at 128k and perhaps plenty more at 228k but at that mileage its amazing.

What are they doing with the current models, testing reliability by letting the owners find out the problems for them and then burying their heads in the sand?

Unbelievable, I've had nightmare cars in the past, but they were cheap runarounds so you get what you pay for in that instance.

But you are paying good money for a marque that has made its name on quality/handling/reliability - makes you wonder with the latest 5 and 7 - I've heard of similar problems but not the combo you've suffered.

[Louiseven]

Really sorry to hear your problems. Your car may have it's problems but I would try and take it to another BMW dealership. Not all service bays or technicians are fully trained to work on a flagship car. I have learned this from experience. My car is the older E38 750IL. The dealer service at BMW needs a re-work. Their idea of service is to make appointments first then sell you on a repair. You are supposed to be happy they give you a ride in their shuttle or some crappy loaner car. I found an Indy who does great work and I get better service. No young porters trying to do burnouts with my car. No week long waits for repairs. It took my dealer three weeks to diagnose and then replace the batteries on my car. And that was on their third try. I have experience with three different LA. area BMW dealerships. Just not a positive experience. You will probably need to take it up with BMWNA and perhaps get the BMW CCA involved too. Good luck to you.

[vsapra]

wow - what year is your Li?

[rome2001]

here's how you do it, buy a 100K car and make the payment on it while it is in the shop getting all the bugs worked out on it, by the time their done a new model will come out and they will pursvey you to but the new model, it is like a cycle of shit product but cost to play. sorry to hear all this bull shit i take my car to a independent BMW shop and it gets fixed right.

[dophineh]

At those prices, who would take it back to the same place.

[B Child]

In 25 years of driving cars

I've only bought one car with a manufacturers warranty and I finally got to fix it properly after 10 attempts they failed to fix the problem

I've only bought one car with a "insurance" based warranty and that wasn't worth the paper it was written on

So that leaves the other 20 plus cars I've owned without any form of warranty - if it breaks I fix it - they never go near one unless it's so I can pick up parts.

I'm finding the E38 to be a little more "demanding" than most but at least I've managed to fix it without taking it to a dealer

The E65 is way past my capacity and a BMW specialist I know reckons they are the first disposable car once they are out of manufacturers warrenty they will last a couple of years with owners who are still prepared to get the book stamped but after that - nightmare

[manithemoneyman]

damn that sucks, especially when its a 760... not a car thats supposed to be sitting in the shops.

I'd be pissed if I had to put up with that, would've just driven it to a bad part of town and hoped it got stolen, at least Id get my money back from the insurance.

[rollinfree]

1/2/08 - CEL - replaced oil separator valve and cleaned valves due to carbon buildup - 15 days in shop - $2229

I love this one!! I mean really do you think they actually did this or just changed the Separator valve if that.

On Friday when there is Free Pizza in the back for the guys, it's becuase they got to bill for these "repairs".

[ycis]

1/2/08 - CEL - replaced oil separator valve and cleaned valves due to carbon buildup - 15 days in shop - $2229

I love this one!! I mean really do you think they actually did this or just changed the Separator valve if that.

On Friday when there is Free Pizza in the back for the guys, it's becuase they got to bill for these "repairs".

The last one was supposedly the "root cause" of the problem.

Two separate "regional service engineers" sent out to work on the car from Jan 2 to Jan 16 (when it was returned). They claim the carbon bulidup on the "intake baffles" is what has been causing the light.

oddly enough I spoke to the prior tech who replaced the intake gaskets and pcv valve back in the previous year and he recalls no carbon buildup at the time as it would be something extremely abnormal.

Honestly I think its a completely made up diagnosis and solution.

and if there were another shop local to take it to that would do warranty repairs....id have taken it there.

[ycis]

On another side note...I have been told that there are only certain bmw techs qualified to work on said vehicle....now if the dealership actually follows that policy is one thing.

however when said "qualified" techs fail to fix the problem....they claim to send out some tech jedi called a regional service engineer.

I have had 4 separate ones come out to inspect and repair my vehicle...I would assume if these guys cannot diagnose and repair the problem...another dealership isnt going to be much help.