Need input on how to start a career in racing?

[M 666]

Ever since I can remember I always wanted to race cars at pro level. I am a little ambivalent as where I should start. I am really in love with the open wheel cars. There are a few options that I have and need the advice of those more knowledgable people that are into road racing.

a) Take the Skip Barber 3 Day Race program

b) Buy a shifter cart and race regionally

c) Take a driving course that Evo Sport offers

Please feel free to tell me other alternative ways and guide me to the right direction as I need to make the most cost effective choice.

Thank you for your help

Mike

[Geo31]

Originally posted by M 666
Ever since I can remember I always wanted to race cars at pro level. I am a little ambivalent as where I should start. I am really in love with the open wheel cars. There are a few options that I have and need the advice of those more knowledgable people that are into road racing.

This is one of my favorite questions. But first, how old are you and are you willing to give up everything you have, possibly including a relationship with a SO?

Do you simply want to race professionally, or do you want to make your living from racing? Yes, the two can be quite different.

If you want to make a living from racing, you MUST race in a professional series absolutely as quickly as possible. Club racing is a total waste of time and money with the possible exception of Formula Ford or Formula Continental (F2000). In both cases, you pretty much need to win the national championship at The Runoffs to be worth anything to you.

A 3 day racing school is a good place to start.

Racing karts is also a great place to start, but unless you have been racing them already, you have absolutely no business in a shifter kart. Don't have balls bigger than your brains. Start in a Yamaha KT100S powered clutch kart. If you want to translate karting experience into something meaningful to a professional team, race Formula A. This is rotory valve 100cc direct drive karts (no gearbox) and it is the world championship class. In fact, if you really want to do something meaningful to a professional car racing team, race Formula A in Europe. It most certainly does make a difference. Lee Bentham from Ontario, Canada did just that. I was at some races with him in the northeast. He eventually made it to Toyota Atlantic, but that was it.

Kart are the very best place to start racing. Unless you are not serious about it, karts will teach you how to drive, how to race (they can be very different things), preparation, set-up, how to alter your driving style when you have an ill handling machine, and more. You will learn more in one season of karting than 5 or more seasons of car racing. I used to hear this all the time, but when I started racing I realized this was very true. I was completely comfortable and confident my first time out on the track. My first real race was in the rain (temps in the upper 30s), starting 19th of 20 (only two warm-up laps in qualifying before it was checkered - long story) and finished 10th overall and 3rd in class (of 7). Along the way I passed a turbo Supra and a V8 Camaro in a Sentra SE-R. I lean on my karting experience every time I'm on the race track. My karting experience was worth every penny.

If you go karting and buy slightly used equipment (new equipment will be better than you for the first season - trust me), you can race for a couple of seasons and if you have no major crashes (hard to total a kart) and no major engine rebuilds, you can get almost all your initial investment out after a couple of years of racing.

If you go to racing school after a year of karting, you will get more out of the racing school.

OK, so we haven't even gotten to the first professional step yet......

As I said, if you want to make a career racing cars you MUST race in a professional series. Sounds simple, but you wouldn't believe how many people get this wrong. Once again, club racing is a waste of time and money. You should only race in SCCA club racing long enough to progress to a professional license.

Now, where to race?

If you want to race in open wheel cars, there is a Pro Formula Mazda series, but it's not a major feeder to real time professional racing. Your best entry level is actually the Skip Barber series with an eye on the top Barber Dodge series. Many a professional driver has come out of that series including JPM.

You could also do pro F2000. That is a great series that gets a lot of attention from pro teams. From there the next step is Toyota Atlantic and then either IRL (It's Real Lame) or CART. That's of course if you want to race in the states. In Europe it's karts, Formula Renault or similar series (there are a few), F3, and then F3000 and/or F1. Lots of guys are skipping F3000 these days. More of them seem to end up in CART than F1 while a fair number of F3 drivers end up in F1. Go figure.

If you want to race tin tops, the Speed Touring Car Challenge is where it's at. It's probably possible to field your own team and eke out a living doing this with some reasonable sponsorship, even without winning. That said, car ownership for the budding professional is foolish. Don't get sucked in. But if you can buy a ride in STC, that can be a good start.

"Buy your way in" you say? Yep. You don't get rides by being good anymore (you're more likely to win THE LOTTERY). You'll need sponsors, preferably lots of them and with deep pockets. You will spend 90% of your time finding them and then kissing their and their client's butts. Also expect to get 1,000 "no's" before a "yes" and then probably not a big "yes."

Oh, and if you're over 25, you should probably forget it. You're an old man already. It can be done, but you must be prepared to give up everything you have and then go into hock so far you can't see out. You need to be able to commit to this type of life for at least 5 years or you're just wasting time and money.

Still interested? I could tell you more.

How do I know this stuff?

I was 29 years old (and had been racing karts for 2.5 years) before I realized it was possible to make a career racing cars. I can sooooo close to making the attempt. There is a long story here that I won't go into now, but after about 9 months and thinking things through a couple of times, I finally realized I was too bloody old to try to make a go of it. I would have had to give up a career that was starting to move and just about everything else in my life. It wasn't worth the financial risk at that age. If I were 19 or even 24 I probably would have at least tried. I did a lot of researching and soul searching 13 years ago.

[M 666]

Hi George,

I have been looking into professional racing career since I was fourteen. I have called skip barber and talked to their reps, but the main reason that I had not taken any steps in this direction was primarily the lack of informatin as it was not easy for me to obtain knowledgable info just after a year that I moved to US. and nobody I knew could guide me in the right direction.

I am 22 now and like you at one point in time, I am faced with the hard decision of whether to pursue a carreer in pro motorsports while stopping my carreer in finance which is starting to pick up for me. I guess the love for the motorsports is running deep and I sometimes get myself caught preoccupied more with cars and racing than with my work.

So, I am thinking of getting my feet soaked in the motorsports and see where I end up. For me it is better to see that I was not good enough than wonder what if...

Skip Barber series offers scholarships for those who are talented and enable upcoming racers to move up their rankcs so that is the main reason why I want to take their courses which would give me a chance to be observed by them as they have their series in Barber Dodge as you mentioned.

So basically what I am trying to ask you is what is the effective sequence of events and procedures that I should follow? Start with Skip Barber Racing school and try climbing their ranks or get a kart (and which category/class) and race it for a season then take the classes?

Thank you for your time and effort to provide me with all the usefull info I very much appreciate it. I am still very much interested in what you have to say, so please do tell more.


Sincerely,

Mike

[Geo31]

Originally posted by M 666
...the main reason that I had not taken any steps in this direction was primarily the lack of informatin as it was not easy for me to obtain knowledgable info just after a year that I moved to US. and nobody I knew could guide me in the right direction.

That was my "problem" in this endeavor. Hell, no one in my family even understood my passion for it (still don't).

Originally posted by M 666
I am 22 now and like you at one point in time, I am faced with the hard decision of whether to pursue a carreer in pro motorsports while stopping my carreer in finance which is starting to pick up for me. I guess the love for the motorsports is running deep and I sometimes get myself caught preoccupied more with cars and racing than with my work.

Finance is also my career. Be assured, what you are being asked to give up is at least five years of your budding career. If you are not totally committed to give it five years at least, don't even bother to start. Work on your career and save your money for club racing and keep it a hobby.

Also, you can forget cars. Expect to drive cheap transportation while you are trying to make it since any money you might put into a car should be put into your career. Every penny you have. Every penny you can get your hands on.

Originally posted by M 666
So, I am thinking of getting my feet soaked in the motorsports and see where I end up. For me it is better to see that I was not good enough than wonder what if...

I like that attitude. It's a requirement, along with the fortitude to give up at least five years of a finance career and all that goes with it. BTW, getting your feet wet won't cut it. You need to get up to your neck and occasionally over your head.

Since you are in finance, you should understand opportunity cost. Your opportunity cost here is going to seem staggering. Not only will you have your opportunity cost, but you also will have very real outlays of cash that will also be staggering. You may even go into debt that will also be staggering. Still interested?

Originally posted by M 666
Skip Barber series offers scholarships for those who are talented and enable upcoming racers to move up their rankcs so that is the main reason why I want to take their courses which would give me a chance to be observed by them as they have their series in Barber Dodge as you mentioned.

For this very reason, I think Skip Barber is the only program to get involved in if you want to try to make a career in professional motorsports as a paid driver as opposed to a paying driver (which I assure you'll be for at least five years). The trick is to be able to talk someone else into paying (sponsors).

Originally posted by M 666
So basically what I am trying to ask you is what is the effective sequence of events and procedures that I should follow? Start with Skip Barber Racing school and try climbing their ranks or get a kart (and which category/class) and race it for a season then take the classes?

If you want to go into professional racing, the time to do it is as soon as you can put a plan together that is responsible and has a chance of success. The clock is ticking. You have to realize you will be competing against some people your own age who have been racing and winning for 14 years. Sobering isn't it?

While I would suggest getting into karts as soon as you absolutely can, I think karts are the best way to start racing. Period. If you have the funds to race karts and go to Skippy in the same year, do it. If you have to sell your Bimmer to do so, do it (assuming you still have the committment). It will only be one of a long line of sacrifices you will be forced to make. Frank Williams not only didn't have any money, but was in debt up to his ass and then some long before he won his first F1 race as an owner.

Karts will teach you to drive, to race, to prepare, to set-up, etc..... The experience can be invaluable if you are 100% committed to your own success. If you do karts before going to Skippy, you will only enhance your chances of winning a scholarship. If you want to just get your feet wet and see if you really are committed, karts are an absolute must. A MUST! The season hasn't started yet, so you can even get into this season, but it's fast approaching. Trust me, you have a lot of work to do to prepare for the start of the season.

I'd highly recommend starting out in the Yamaha KT100 class. It's popular so you'll have a lot of folks to race against, even at the local club level. They are pretty bullet-proof so you won't waste a lot of money fixing it (unless you do stupid things to it). I'd recommend buying a 2-3 year old chassis (no older than 3 years and for God's sake not a new one). Buy the absolute best engine you can buy. I'd recommend an Emmick blueprinted engine. They are on the web. Emmick Enterprises. They consistently turn out the best Yamaha engines in the country. They are worth every penny. They will also sell you exactly what they race. Their philosophy seems to be that if you beat them with their own equipment, that's even better advertising for them. They are good folks and have been around a long time. They may even be able to help you will information on building a professional career (don't ask about it on the first call though). Ron Emmick was the first (only?) American to win the Renault Elf Pilote scholarship (the program that sent Alain Prost on his way in his career as well as a number of other greats). Linda Emmick is Ron's mother (Ron's dad passed away many years ago) and a great racer in her own right. She is the owner of Emmick Enterprises. If you get her on the phone, consider yourself lucky.

If you decide to take the Skippy plunge, you can most likley sell your kart for what you paid for it (assuming you buy used equipment) and that should finance your school. If you can go to school and keep the kart, so much the better. While trying to make a career in racing, it's best to keep racing as much as possible, and a kart is the cheapest way to go racing. If you stay in karts for a second (or more) season, jump into Formula A with both feet. You'll likely be over your head, but that's a good way to learn. These are direct drive karts and will improve your driving skills. But, if you are a large driver, forget it. I swear this class is made for jockeys. If you are a large driver, you could go into shifter karts. Just be aware they tend not to be a spawning ground for budding professionals like Formula A is. BTW, a friend of mine raced in a Formula A race at Charlotte Motor Speedway (they have a kart track) and raced against Jarno Trulli. Truly. He has a photo of himself with Jarno.

Originally posted by M 666
Thank you for your time and effort to provide me with all the usefull info I very much appreciate it. I am still very much interested in what you have to say, so please do tell more.

It's very much my pleasure. I wish I had someone to coach me when I was your age. I found out it was possible too late in life. I don't profess to have all the answers. Hell, I don't profess to have even 50% of them. But, I have a good idea of where to start and how to plan the beginning of that road.

If you are still interested despite my warnings and scary statements, perhaps we should take this off the forum. You can e-mail me at: geo31@earthlink.net

Believe me when I say this is a tough road and that the best aren't always the ones who "make it." I've often wondered if Pete Rose or Cal Ripken would have even gotten to the majors if they had to pay (in today's money) $100k to $1MM per year just to play in the minor leagues and perhaps have to pay $10MM just to play in the majors their first year. Would they have done it? That's what you're up against. Be aware that the vast majority of the drivers in CART are paying to be there (though personal sponsors). A CART seat on a mid-field team probably costs $10-20MM a year.

Still with me? :

[eurorides]

just curious, what does a skip baber "advanced" class cost, and how long is it? thanks

[Geo31]

BTW, when I talk about buying your seat, while some people do it with family money, I generally assume you will do it with other people's money (sponsors). The trick is to convince sponsors to sponsor you through the lower ranks.

[Han]

Originally posted by eurorides
just curious, what does a skip baber "advanced" class cost, and how long is it? thanks

The advanced school is $1,925 and lasts 2 days.

[99DINAN3]

there is alot of info here www.racingschools.com :

[B.Watts]

Geo knows of what he speaks.

[BMLRacer]

There is some very good information here. I can offer a quick glimpse of what it take to make a meger living in this industry. This is my 12th year of full time racing. I have had jobs with in the industry the entire time, but I have never really "made it". I started in a Quarter Midget when I was 9. A neighbor had one and I used to go with them on weekends. One weekend they put me in the car and said drive, I was faster than their kid by a landslide. I dicked around with Karts ad the like, but never really had family support. When I turned 16 I began Autocrossing with my GTI. When my Mum saw that I was a) commited to it and b)good, she got behind me a bit. Never really more than a few entry fees or a couple tires, but she supported me. I was at Drivers School the week after my 18th birthday (at that time you had to be 18 to have a competition license, it is now 16) and did my first race shortly after. I had to fly back home to attend HS graduation (I was also named the "Worst Driver" in my Senior Class... ). By the end of that summer, I had received my Regional License and had run 3 IMSA Firehawk races. I 1994 I put together a decent package with a Nissan Sentra SE-R in the SCA National SSB class, I would also run a few select Firehawk races. We did 11 races in the Nissan, 2 wins, 1 Second, 3 Thirds, and a trip to the SCCA Runoffs. In the process, I spent over $30,000 dollars or almost all of my college money. The following year we took a factory deal with Mazda to run an MX3 V6 in the SSB class and again I would do a few Street Stock Endurance races (nee Firehawk). Well, talk about a nighmare. in 10 races we blew up 6 motors. We went to the Runoffs again, but packed it up and went home after losing yet another motor. Even though we had some factory support (free car, some parts, etc) I still spent $15,000 plus some crash damage from pro racing. At this point, I'm 2 full seasons and 1 partial season in and I've gone through a bit over $50,000. And, this doesn't include Pro races, because I was working for a team in exchange for a few dries. 1996 was going to be a big year for me. I started a team, found a few drivers, a shop, 2 cars, a truck, trailor, and the whole deal. Unfortunately, the entire deal fell apart after 2 races and I got bought out. Now, I'm without a race car, not much money in my pocket, and looking for options. I found a cople of guys that would put me in the car for not a ton of money, in exchange, I drove the truck, worked on the car, and sometimes didn't get to driv even though I was signed up to. I raced 5 times in the IMSA Street Stock Endurance series GS class in a Mustang Cobra R. In 1997 I was getting tired of sedans and wanted to try open wheel racing. We spent a lot of money and were working with a big sports management company. They had found us a deal to race the US FF2000 (Formula Ford 2000) series. We signed with the best team in the series, paid $58,000 for their year old, but championship winning, car and went testing. Only to have the sponsor pull the plug before the first race. Now, I was in breach of contract, had close to $60,000 in a car that I couldn't afford, and no way to go racing. By the time the car was sold and a settlement reached, I was out nearly $25000 and pretty much out of racing. But, by the grace of god, a good friend was running a Porsche 993 GT2 in the first year ALMS. I got signed on to do almost all of their testing, but I had to pay all of my own expenses. In 1998, I went back to work for a team that was running Grand Am Cup and did 1 race that year as a substitute, as well as a few races in my old Nissan while coaching its owner. 1999 and 2000 saw a good bit of testing time in BMW World Challenge cars and a handfull of BMW Club races and a few SCCA Nationals in BMW Z3s. In 2001, I took a job working with Bridgestone as I had to pay bills. I'm doing corporate training ad well as tire testing for them. In exchange, they give us freedom to go race (as long as we don't race against a Bridgestone product) and a pay check. Last year I did 5 races in a BMW Z3, 1 win, 3 seconds, and a third. This year I'm doing testing for the 2004 Speed Touring Car series and might squeeze in a few races as time premits, as well as my third year with Bridgestone. Anyone that tells you that getting into racing is as easy as writing a check is flat out lying to you or wants to be the person that you're writing the check to. Don't get into racing thinking that its going to make you a living. You'll be living a lie. Get into motorsport because you have a passion for it. Racing has cost my everything I have, but it has given me everything as well. I am willing to suffer in my quest to make it, are you? If you'd like to know, I lived at home untill I was 26, I'm now 28 and just bought my first house. Motorsport ruined more than a few of my relationships and I made it very clear to my wife when we met just how commited I am. She still thinks I'm nuts, but she loves me anyway.

Good luck to you, god knows you'll be needing a lot of it.

Brian

[B.Watts]

Sounds familiar Brian. I was lucky to have a dad that was willing to help support my first real year in racing last year. I've since finished college, gotten a job, and moved out. I sold my M3 to pay for 2/3's of the race car I bought for this season. I've got fuel, tires, and most of my running costs covered by sponsors this year, but I'm still going into debt for $10K+, not including any crash damage that may/may not happen. I've already reserved every bit of vacation I have for racing, and I'm likely going to miss the wedding of one of my best friends. Just this weekend I had the worst experience of my racing career thus far and it pales in comparison to some of the stories other drivers can tell you. Here's a recap from an email I just sent some folks:

Get to Road Atlanta for a Friday test day before the SCCa National. My times are 3-4 seconds off my personal best just a couple months earlier in October during the Petit LeMans Pro race weekend...times that would put me at/near the front of my class. To make it even better, after sending my Pi system in to have the software updated, it no longer works, so I've got no way to see just where all my speed has gone. Then comes qualifying. I'm going a little faster, but someone has a "moment" in front of me during every lap of the session, 3 times in T7, the most important turn on the entire track. I don't get a single flying lap. The race rolls around on Sunday, and it looks like rain, which makes me smile. Finally, something to equalize the field and my handling problems (and the fact that I qualified on pole in the Pro race in the rain in October). About 30 minutes before the race, the rain stops, and the track forms a dry line. DANG! Race starts while I'm still in the braking zone of 10A, clutch goes bu-bye before I've completed the first lap thanks to a cracked line. I had been putting off learning to downshift without the clutch until I had a test day to work on it...well, guess I'll have to learn now. 2 laps later, the shift knob comes off in my hand. Not only am I shifting without a clutch, but I'm trying to shift using a 1/2 threaded bar that's about 3 inches long. It all comes to a close as I've passed 4-5 cars in my class after only 6-7 laps of an 18 lap race, only to have a car that is two laps down to turn in on me in T6, sending me into a spin at which point I'm hit by two other cars that I was racing with, taking myself and both of them out of the race for good. The lapped car continued on to beat all three of us, leaving me only a multi thousand $$ repair bill to show for my efforts.

The sick thing is, I'm ticked that I can't get back into my Formula Mazda until May. Until then, I'm hoping to co-drive with my dad at a BMW Club Race, do some testing, and maybe get some karting in. As a friend of mind in the business likes to say, I'm "Chasing the Dream."

Meanwhile, back to my day job. Does anyone need any commercial real estate services in the Charlotte, NC area?

[M 666]

Thanks for the input guys, very much appreciated.

Tell me about not being understood, especially by the ones really close to you. I think that they are finally starting to understand that I really have passion for racing and it's not just a fluke but I still have to have their full support.

Tell me about an opportunity cost... I have a year left until I graduate from university and I practically have a job waiting for me so it is not easy for me to decide. I have come to point in my life that the choices I make can have a great impact on my future for a long long time.

Decisions, decisions...I have made my mind... I am going to get into carting and after a season I taking the Skip Barber Racing course. By that time I will have my degree and my lucrative job in finance and I will be able to partially fund my passion in case I run into problems with sponsors.


Again thank you guys for your time and effort

Sincerely,

Mike

[BMLRacer]

Hey, best of luck to you. i hope the job pays very well, because motorsport will take every spare dime you have and then some. Don't plan on landing much in the way of sponsorship in your first few years. Get out there and learn, then start approaching sponsors. if you don't have the expirence, why would someone want to invest their compainies image with you? Even at the levels Bryan and I are at, real sponsors (read, not family money) are few and far between. it gets even lower as you take a few steps down the ladder.

Spend all the time you can afford in Skippy car, bondurant schools, Panoz schools, anything you can do to get seat time with a well qualified instructor. but, whatever you do, don't tell the instructor that you want to be a Pro Driver after your first school. it's a good way to get laughed out of your drivers suit.

[Geo31]

Originally posted by BMLRacer
I 1994 I put together a decent package with a Nissan Sentra SE-R in the SCA National SSB class, I would also run a few select Firehawk races.

Excellent choice Brian!

If you didn't know, I have a 91 SE-R and am racing a 92 SE-R and have a company that is producing development parts for them. We're going to ARRC this year. Do you know Rich Kulach? He was racing our SE-R in SSB at the same time as you and he's going to drive our car at ARRC and in the enduro he, the current owner, and I will be racing in the enduro.

Also, do you know Greg Amy? He's a buddy of mine who finished 3rd at the runoffs in 93 in an NX2000. Set a lap record and probably could have won, but was actually trying to protect another Nissan driver in first. He kicks himself for that.

Originally posted by BMLRacer
Anyone that tells you that getting into racing is as easy as writing a check is flat out lying to you or wants to be the person that you're writing the check to.

I think that depends upon the size of check you can write. Don't you think if you could write a check for $1-2MM you could have a good run in Toyota Atlantic?

[Geo31]

Originally posted by M 666
Tell me about not being understood, especially by the ones really close to you. I think that they are finally starting to understand that I really have passion for racing and it's not just a fluke but I still have to have their full support.

My family didn't understand in the least. They finally did when they came to some of my kart races. When I told them I was gonig to race karts they thought I was off my rocker.

Originally posted by M 666
Tell me about an opportunity cost... I have a year left until I graduate from university and I practically have a job waiting for me so it is not easy for me to decide. I have come to point in my life that the choices I make can have a great impact on my future for a long long time.

If you are a finance major, you should fully understand opportunity cost. Your opportunity cost is the salary you will be throwing into the wind. Figure what you could make in the 1st five years of your career and that is your opportunity cost, or what you've given up.

You're right, it's a big decision. Only you can make it. It takes total commitment. You're also young. If you are going to do it, the time is now. Just make sure you give yourself at least a 5 years commitment. That means no whining. If you're broke and living in your car and eating scraps your friends give you, so be it. There are many pros who have done that. I'm serious. If you do this, you MUST commit to 5 years or forget it. That's the absolute minimum. If you're the next Ayrton Senna, you might make a decent living within 5 years, asssuming you are good at finding sponsorship. Otherwise, in 5 years you can probably honestly assess your chances. Before that you just don't know.

Originally posted by M 666
Decisions, decisions...I have made my mind... I am going to get into carting and after a season I taking the Skip Barber Racing course. By that time I will have my degree and my lucrative job in finance and I will be able to partially fund my passion in case I run into problems with sponsors.

Mike, if you think you're going to hold a professional job in finance and have a pro career, you're kidding yourself. If you're thinking that way, be the best financier you can be and spend all your money on club racing and enjoy it. If you're really lucky, you'll make a fortune in your finance career and be able to fund a drive in a pro car yourself. Others have done it. It's a money loser though.

If you want to make a living racing cars, you can consider nothing else. NOTHING!!!

[Geo31]

Bryan, I love your avatar! I use my colours for my avatar as well. I've just been waiting to get enough posts to use mine here.

[djrandin]

its wierd what comes up in searches. this thread could have saved me a lot of typing and feeling retarded had i found it a week ago.
this is the perfect thread of all time........

[dapaspy]

I agree. This has to be one of the most enlightening post I have ever read on any board.

[snk328is]

I concur. Perhaps we can park it?

[Pman]

First, I'll admit that I didn't read all of the posts above, so I'll keep it short and apologize if I repeat anything mentioned above.

A couple months ago Car and Driver had a big article about this topic -- I guess one of the staff is trying to start a racing career. Check back issues to find it. If I recall, there was some good info there. One thing that was quite interesting was that they compared it to going to med school in terms on time and money, and it made med school look like the easier or cheaper choice. Not to discourage you, I just thought it was a good illustration of the commitment required.

[Bane2871]

Tell me about an opportunity cost... I have a year left until I graduate from university and I practically have a job waiting for me so it is not easy for me to decide. I have come to point in my life that the choices I make can have a great impact on my future for a long long time.

I don't have the racing experience of GEO31, BMWRacerITS, and those guys, but I have something that might help:

A buddy of mine graduated college with a mechanical engineering degree. He found an excellent job fairly quickly. All through college he had played guitar off and on. Nothing serious. A few gigs with filling in for absent guitarists. Well, he became friends with the guys in Caroline's Spine. CS started to get some radio airplay and started to go on the road opening for bigger, more established bands.

Well, my friend did some soul searching and decided to sign on as a roadie for Caroline's Spine. He quit his job and went on the road. Shit pay for hard work, but he loved every minute of it. Got to meet Jimmy Page personally. Went to Europe, Asia, etc.

I've since lost touch with him, but his reason for doing it: If he didn't do it then, he would never do it. He had no kids, no house, no commitments. An engineering job would still be out there for him when he had had enough. He'll never have to wonder 'what if', because he went out there and did it.

Would he be further along in his career had he not gone? Yep. So what? He played guitar with Jimmy Page.

I don't know if this helps or not, just thought I'd throw it in.

[S.Lang]

Mike, if you think you're going to hold a professional job in finance and have a pro career, you're kidding yourself. If you're thinking that way, be the best financier you can be and spend all your money on club racing and enjoy it. If you're really lucky, you'll make a fortune in your finance career and be able to fund a drive in a pro car yourself. Others have done it. It's a money loser though.

If you want to make a living racing cars, you can consider nothing else. NOTHING!!!

This is the best thing I've read so far. Unless I missed it, the original poster still hasn't said whether he wants to race professionally and make his living at it, or make a living elsewhere and race professionally. You can do both, just not at the same time.

A lot of professional drivers are considered such mainly because they don't PAY to race. That doesn't mean they're making a damn cent, only that their racing isn't costing them anything. For me, because I have a career and own a business, having my racing funded by someone else would make me a perfectly content pro racer. I can let my business take care of my own living expenses.

I hate to be the one to inject this into the thread, but at 22, the original poster is reaching the very top end of the age spectrum if he hopes to have a money-making career in motorsport. Like George said, he'll be a newbie going up against guys with 14 years of experience, who all want the same thing. The reality is that F1, CART, and IRL are out unless he's the next Senna with a sponsor. NASCAR drivers go well into their 40's, so that's a possibility, and there's always sportscars, although I don't know that many of those guys are making a killing; most have something else going on the side (usually motorsport-related, though). No one's getting rich in SPEED World Challenge.

[dorikin_86]

"you can never run away from who you are"

that is a quote that i take to heart dude...if you know deep down you WANT to do this then go ahead, you might not be making millions but you will wake up each day more happy than most others. I work hard to get my track-day gig going...it doens't pay very well but you know what...I don't mind the hardwork because I LOVE the job. NOthing great is ever accomplished without passion so I think you got what it takes =)

Good luck...I wish I had the opportunity to start racing earlier

[dorikin_86]

Just as a reference...if you cannot get into pro racing then you can still take other jobs. For eg: my instructor who works for skip barber as an instructor and tests prototypes for volvo..bmw...mercedes..lexus etc and race once as well is getting paid in the 50+k salary range...not bad at all =)

[B.Watts]

Back from the dead thread!