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Thread: DIY: **HID in e36 FOGS BY Brent**

  1. #26
    Join Date
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    Calypsorot 328i
    Hey Mike.

    I don't know about older HID ballasts. That's your area, but I can assume from your previous response regarding larger fuse and connecting to the main battery terminal that they drew A LOT of power way back when.

    But the newer HID ballasts only draw 5-6 max draw at start up and work concurrently with the standard fuse box and fuses. No "modification" needed to get the HIDs to work correctly.

    Edit: AND just did a little google investigation and the stats for HID power draw for new ones are like 3 and 55w Ballasts ones draw about 6 max.

    O... And nobody is having problems with the draw of the current HID Ballasts.

    LBF though is a hit or miss occurence and there are already DIY's and proper ways of addressing those problems.
    Last edited by BMWALDO; 10-07-2007 at 04:18 PM.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmaigret View Post
    Interesting. I'd like to know what changed btw 5-6 years ago and later magnetic ballasts. I'm an electrical engineer and know that magnetic ballasts, which have been produced for over 30 years, use a reactive circuit to stabilize the output current being delivered to the bulb's electrode. In order to achieve a reasonable power factor (amount of potential power delivered to the load), these reactive circuits employ a (large) capacitor to minimize the phase angle between output current and voltage.

    A capacitor appears as a short circuit at time instantaneous, or turn-on state, before settling to a nominal steady-state current draw. The turn-on short circuit causes a car's electrical system to "see" an extremely high transient load, which in the case of HID's requires greater than 7.5A.

    Furthermore, if the ballast is powered directly from the headlight switch, all of the other loads sharing this power source will temporarily experience a low power condition due to the high current draw of the ballasts' capacitance. For example, the dashboard guage cluster in an e36 use the same power source as the headlights; hence, when the high transient load of ballast turn-on occurs, the gauges reset due to a temporary low power condition.

    In response to Habbie's certainty that 95% of his customers have never had such problems, there are a few explanations for this....

    1) BMW's other than e36's have different electrical layouts for the lighting circuits (I only have direct experience with e36's)

    2) There has been a substantial change in magnetic ballast design in the past 5-6 years which I do not know about

    3) Foglight circuits are substantially different than low-beam headlight circuits in e36 BMW's (possible, but unexpected)

    I really don't know the answer, but I do know that for those experiencing problems such as reseting gauges, audio pops, etc. upon switching on your HID lights... if you want to fix the problems you need to isolate the power source of the HID ballasts from the low-beam supply by using relays powered directly from the battery. In fact, many HID kits used to come with these relays... not sure if they still do or not. It's possible that these problems only affect older HID kits and not the ones the Habbie sells, so I am in no way trying to defame Habbie or Prolumen-- just trying to help those having problems.

    Best,
    Mike
    95% of my customers own e36's.

    -zkw- -hella- -bosch- -depo- -prolumen- -kwd- -bbs- -predator chromium- -predator ice- -simota- -ecis-

    //-install guides-//-total lighting group buy-//-zkw group buy-// -exhaust group buy-//-ellipsoids+hid group buy-//-led tails group buy-//

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmaigret View Post
    Interesting. I'd like to know what changed btw 5-6 years ago and later magnetic ballasts. I'm an electrical engineer and know that magnetic ballasts, which have been produced for over 30 years, use a reactive circuit to stabilize the output current being delivered to the bulb's electrode. In order to achieve a reasonable power factor (amount of potential power delivered to the load), these reactive circuits employ a (large) capacitor to minimize the phase angle between output current and voltage.

    A capacitor appears as a short circuit at time instantaneous, or turn-on state, before settling to a nominal steady-state current draw. The turn-on short circuit causes a car's electrical system to "see" an extremely high transient load, which in the case of HID's requires greater than 7.5A.

    Furthermore, if the ballast is powered directly from the headlight switch, all of the other loads sharing this power source will temporarily experience a low power condition due to the high current draw of the ballasts' capacitance. For example, the dashboard guage cluster in an e36 use the same power source as the headlights; hence, when the high transient load of ballast turn-on occurs, the gauges reset due to a temporary low power condition.

    In response to Habbie's certainty that 95% of his customers have never had such problems, there are a few explanations for this....

    1) BMW's other than e36's have different electrical layouts for the lighting circuits (I only have direct experience with e36's)

    2) There has been a substantial change in magnetic ballast design in the past 5-6 years which I do not know about

    3) Foglight circuits are substantially different than low-beam headlight circuits in e36 BMW's (possible, but unexpected)

    I really don't know the answer, but I do know that for those experiencing problems such as reseting gauges, audio pops, etc. upon switching on your HID lights... if you want to fix the problems you need to isolate the power source of the HID ballasts from the low-beam supply by using relays powered directly from the battery. In fact, many HID kits used to come with these relays... not sure if they still do or not. It's possible that these problems only affect older HID kits and not the ones the Habbie sells, so I am in no way trying to defame Habbie or Prolumen-- just trying to help those having problems.

    Best,
    Mike
    Dont get to mad. My dad is also a engineer but you people THINK WAY TO MUCH!!!!!!.Im not trying to be a smart ass but somtimes thinking to much gets in the way

  4. #29
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    Guys, I apologize... coming back to the scene after a rather lengthy hiatus. I was poking around in another thread and saw a post by Jim Powell addressing the discrepancies...

    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...64&postcount=4

    At any rate, back in the day (2001-2002) the fuse popping issues were widespread and plentiful. Most installed relays to solve the problems. I was surprised to see that nobody is doing that anymore, but apparently there have been innovations in ballast design in the last 5 years that have corrected the original issues.

    I stand corrected. On the bright side I am happy to see progress in an area where so many used to have problems with after-market HID kits.

    Best,
    Mike
    2007 Porsche GT3
    2004 Honda S2000 Silverstone
    1998 BMW M3/4
    M3 SEDAN CLUB #22

  5. #30
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    Its all good!!!!!
    Glad to have you back!!!!!

  6. #31
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    It's all good. I'm not mad. I was just concerned that vendors who sells loads of these products might not know the implications of their suggested installation procedures. This happens far too often.

    I'm relieved to see that this is not the case with Habbie or Prolumen.

    I understand your point regarding not "over-thinking" problems, but I don't believe thought ever hurt anyone. Burned out ballasts and fried electrical systems, on the other hand, cause pain and frustration.

    Thanks for your concern,
    Mike

    BTW, I think I/we should stop hi-jacking poor Habbie's installation thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by zx7rhitch View Post
    Dont get to mad. My dad is also a engineer but you people THINK WAY TO MUCH!!!!!!.Im not trying to be a smart ass but somtimes thinking to much gets in the way
    2007 Porsche GT3
    2004 Honda S2000 Silverstone
    1998 BMW M3/4
    M3 SEDAN CLUB #22

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmaigret View Post
    BTW, I think I/we should stop hi-jacking poor Habbie's installation thread.
    damn straight...
    and Brent's not all to happy either..

    -zkw- -hella- -bosch- -depo- -prolumen- -kwd- -bbs- -predator chromium- -predator ice- -simota- -ecis-

    //-install guides-//-total lighting group buy-//-zkw group buy-// -exhaust group buy-//-ellipsoids+hid group buy-//-led tails group buy-//

  8. #33
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    Nice Write Up

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmaigret View Post
    It's all good. I'm not mad. I was just concerned that vendors who sells loads of these products might not know the implications of their suggested installation procedures. This happens far too often.

    I'm relieved to see that this is not the case with Habbie or Prolumen.

    I understand your point regarding not "over-thinking" problems, but I don't believe thought ever hurt anyone. Burned out ballasts and fried electrical systems, on the other hand, cause pain and frustration.

    Thanks for your concern,
    Mike

    BTW, I think I/we should stop hi-jacking poor Habbie's installation thread.
    not to beat a dead horse but..
    remember the engineers who make these products know the limitations and implications of their product, if its shoddy then they cost their respective companies a lot of money.

    the product has evolved in the last couple of years, and its nothing like the old days, if a relay and wiring harness makes you feel better then by all means, its your time and your dime.
    like anything else on the net there is more misinformation then anything else, much of it coming from "experts", some from lighting vendors asking for your confidence and support on this very forum, yet they have no clue about the product they sell or research they quote as if it was their own.

    lots of people feed on scaring others while padding their own pockets selling unnecessary parts...

    -zkw- -hella- -bosch- -depo- -prolumen- -kwd- -bbs- -predator chromium- -predator ice- -simota- -ecis-

    //-install guides-//-total lighting group buy-//-zkw group buy-// -exhaust group buy-//-ellipsoids+hid group buy-//-led tails group buy-//

  10. #35
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    Were can i get one of these HID kits for the fogs?
    E34 525i
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    (GONE BUT NOT FORGTOTTEN)
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  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbancsov View Post
    Were can i get one of these HID kits for the fogs?
    www.bavtoys.com
    choose any of the kits we carry and add the fog light harness kit to your order.

    -zkw- -hella- -bosch- -depo- -prolumen- -kwd- -bbs- -predator chromium- -predator ice- -simota- -ecis-

    //-install guides-//-total lighting group buy-//-zkw group buy-// -exhaust group buy-//-ellipsoids+hid group buy-//-led tails group buy-//

  12. #37
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    + 1

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by habbie View Post
    not really, cutting and splicing your hid kit is not a good idea not to mention that your warranty would be voided on the spot.
    I dont have a warentee......()
    1998 SchwartzII 328is 5MT | 2003 Fresco Green Passat 5MT | 2008 Monacoblau Z4 3.0si Roadster 6MT (gone) | 1993 Lagunegrun 325is 5MT (gone) | 1993 Alpine Weiss 325is 5MT (gone)

  14. #39
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    I just want the HID for the fogs. What do you recommend and price?
    The Golden Rule of Wheels: Strong, cheap, light... pick two.

    M Texture - MOTON - Recaro - FIKSE - Vorshlag - SWIFT - Lightwerkz - Rogue

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bimmer Man View Post
    I just want the HID for the fogs. What do you recommend and price?
    check out all the kits we have on the site and choose one that suites you and your budget the best.
    the digital kits by prolumen are the best followed by the kwd.

    -zkw- -hella- -bosch- -depo- -prolumen- -kwd- -bbs- -predator chromium- -predator ice- -simota- -ecis-

    //-install guides-//-total lighting group buy-//-zkw group buy-// -exhaust group buy-//-ellipsoids+hid group buy-//-led tails group buy-//

  16. #41
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    85 735i (m), 86 735i
    Thank you Mike and Habbie.

    It is good to see open discussion on the board about this matter because I have been considering this upgrade for a while. I have seen a ton of units for various prices and I have also heard just as manny horror stories as success stories with these units.

    Granted most have been from owners of other cars however if it will mess up in a Honda why would I trust it in my e36 & e34 BMWs? I just want to put out the most light so that (a) these SUV drivers can see me coming and get out of the way (b) I can see hazards before they end up under or inside of my grill.

    Lighting and brakes are safety upgrades to me and I just would like to get as much information as possible so that I can make an educated choice.

  17. #42
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    Hey quick ques., is a fog harness necessary? I'm going to buy a kit locally, same in my headlights so i know its good, and i know they dont have said harness.

  18. #43
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    Thanks a lot, I'm going to be installing these soon.

  19. #44
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    Just installed mine last night using this. I was laughing at how easy this was.
    1995 ///M3 Cosmos Black/Anthracite M-Cross/Amaretta


  20. #45
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    where do i get that adapter harness i need to soder to the factory black and red wire coming from the car? also, how does the bulb sit secure in the fog light assembly? any pictures of this?

  21. #46
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    sweet tire/rim combo!

    Quote Originally Posted by Forged328 View Post
    love the ride forged328 what type and size rims r those and where can i find them?

  22. #47
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    I just love driving and being blinded by people who do this kind of gay shit.

  23. #48
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  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by frog 996 View Post
    I just love driving and being blinded by people who do this kind of gay shit.

    If done properly there is no blinding of anyone. Improving visibility is a huge safety improvement that can and does save lives. Its not "gay shit" unless your sticking them where they don't belong!

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by frog 996 View Post
    I just love driving and being blinded by people who do this kind of gay shit.
    You're obviously thinking of people who didn't aim their projectors properly or are using HIDs in reflector housings. I've had 55W HIDs in both my low beams and fogs and have never had anyone flash me. I've also driven around while someone else drove my car behind and towards me, not blinding at all. Fogs are too low to spread out enough to blind people.

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