With turbo technology today, I personally think that the 335i's TT motor will have more potential to increase horsepower vs the M3's V8 N/A motor. This may hurt M3 sales, I think.
What is everyone's opinion on this?
- '01 LS430 Ultra Luxury...VIP Style baby! :bling:
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I don't think it's going to hurt sales because M cars are always the car to get. A majority of the consumers that buy these cars are not enthusiasts. If they are, they will lean towards the M. The people that buy these cars wouldn't want to spend that much money and then have to fix it up. It should come off the showroom with performance unheard of. The only market it will affect is 3 years into the future after the car comes out and when it's flooded in the used market. When they get affordable it's just a matter of which one you want to fix up but brand new, there isn't going to be a hurt in M3 sales. Cars have become so advanced that if you're out of warranty, imagine finding somebody independently to fix something gone wrong with your SMG Transmission. It will take sometime time to tune these 335's since they are so new and tuners will have to pick the brains of BMW engineers. It's a tough task.
BMW isn't dumb... they know that people will be upgrading turbos as soon as the cars are out of the showroom. Hell, software is already available for the 335 and the car isn't even released yet. Larger turbos and more advanced software are probably just on the horizon. FYI the turbos are mated to the exhaust manifold which will make that upgrade a bit pricey.
As for the comparison and competition to the M3. The 335 will never be what the M3 will be. The 335 is a sport coupe, but will come with a more sensitive traction control, no mechanical limited slip differential, smaller wheels/tires etc.
Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by hundreds of engineers that get paid thousands of dollars for something you bought at Pep Boys because your buddy who doesn't have a job told you it was 'better'?!?
Kev, what software is already available.. IM looking for some nice boost bump software like I used to use from IPD for my Volvo 850 Turbo.. With an ecu swap, I went from 9 psi to 14.5 psi
Interestingly I saw where the M3 is listed at 310 hp... the 335i was dynoed at 300 wheel ft lbs, which means its got close to 360 ft lbs using the other E90/E92 differences ascribed to their drive train losses. Im thinking a small 3 psi boost bump will get it to power numbers real close to 400 hp.
>>The 335 will never be what the M3 will be. The 335 is a sport coupe, but will come with a more sensitive traction control, no mechanical limited slip differential, smaller wheels/tires etc.<<
Well, Im sure youre not using electronic doodads like trac control to define the M3! As for the wheels, the first wheel option on the 335i is an 18" performance wheel pkg, which comes standard on the M.. Not a big dif in my book.. The Limited Slip on the other hand I think is meaniful.
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Paul E
'11 AW 135i ; Sold: '99 White M3 81k mi; Dinan SC kit, 6"/3.48" sc pulleys, Aftercooler: 10.5 psi-367 SAE rwhp/304 rwftlbs @80 degrees ambient (still with OBDII manifold & stock cats); DynoTuning by Nick G (techniquetuning.com); Speed Shop: Imported Cars of Stamford; AA-Aquamist Water Injection, exhaust, clutch; Fikse FM-10s; Koni Suspension; Stealthboxes
http://s11.photobucket.com/albums/a173/boostm3/
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Thanks Moss. but I got rid of my 850 Turbo the day I bought my '99 M3 back in june '99! First thing someone did was find out where it was sitting, and persuaded the lot owner to let him swap his stock 850 T ecu with the IPD ecu that was installed... That turned out to be a real nice deal for him. See, back in '95, you could swap ecus without any of that drive away protection crap we have today which would have detected it wasnt computer matched to that particular car!
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Paul E
'11 AW 135i ; Sold: '99 White M3 81k mi; Dinan SC kit, 6"/3.48" sc pulleys, Aftercooler: 10.5 psi-367 SAE rwhp/304 rwftlbs @80 degrees ambient (still with OBDII manifold & stock cats); DynoTuning by Nick G (techniquetuning.com); Speed Shop: Imported Cars of Stamford; AA-Aquamist Water Injection, exhaust, clutch; Fikse FM-10s; Koni Suspension; Stealthboxes
http://s11.photobucket.com/albums/a173/boostm3/
Even though the M3 will be a more thoroughly engineered "total package" with regards to performance stock vs. stock compared to a 335i....YES, without a doubt the "potential" and allure of the twin turbo motor of the 335i will (not to mention "VALUE") hurt M3 sales....to a *certain* degree. (*which no-one here can accurately predict or guage until we actually SEE the E92 M3)
Super Clean 1000HP / 9-SEC MKIV Supra Turbo* For SALE or TRADE Serious inquiries PM me...
think about it... who's going to be upgrade there turbos?? the business executives that are leasing these cars?? NO, the 50 year old guys that buy it for there wives? NO ...
only a very slim percentage of the people that buy these cars are gonna be upgraded. I'm sure BMW doesn't give a shit, and by the time it gets cheap were 2nd hand owners wanna transform and it becomes more popular the new model will be along and this car will be WAYYYY of bmw's radar
http://www.automobilemag.com/feature..._dyno_revised/
This article could tell a lot about the 335i potential. I kinda agree with them that BMW engeneers are deliberately "underestimate" the 335 to protect the e46 M3.
Past cars :94 318is - Sold; 97 328is - Sold; 99 e36 M3/2 - Sold ; 93 Porsche 968 - Sold
There will be 400+HP / 400+ ft-lbs 335i's in the very near future my fellow enthusiasts...and that's with "BPU" modifications (basic upgrades)...
Super Clean 1000HP / 9-SEC MKIV Supra Turbo* For SALE or TRADE Serious inquiries PM me...
Or that was a "tuned" car for the magazine... which has been known to happen.
SOLD: '96 Artic Silver M3/2 Lux Click here for pic's. 2003 X5 4.6is: Nav, loading floor, comfort seats
2007 E90 335i: Titanium Silver/Black/Aluminum trim, Sport, Premium, Heated seats (for the wife), iPOD, MORR VS7
2011 E92 M3: Space Grey/Black/Blue aluminum trim, Premium, iDrive, DCT
Nope...two other cars had been tested along with shiv's personal 335i and ALL of them consistently dyno the same RWHP. ~280'ish with nearly 300 rwt!
...yet another even stronger recent 335i dyno test... http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=604894
Super Clean 1000HP / 9-SEC MKIV Supra Turbo* For SALE or TRADE Serious inquiries PM me...
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