My e39 540i Intrax/Koni suspension Install Thread

[Shawn C]

Anyone has picture of the Xenon light sensor "rod"?

I took the car back to the installer and moved the rear spring perch to the bottom and now the car is riding 1/4" lower evenly on all 4 corners compared to OE sport. I love the new height, the only thing is the rear camber appeared to be even more negative. Do you know if you can adust the rear camber closer to 0 camber?

[silverE39]

Shawn C

Pics of b4 and after?

[Shawn C]

I don't have a photo hosting site. Know any good one that's free? Mine is all stock. The drop was very minimal, only .25; you can't really tell. Here are the measurement before drop: front 14.5", rear 14"; after: front 14.25", rear 13.75.

I now have it at 1/4 turn from full soft and it actually handle better than 1.25 turn from full soft initial setting (Found out yesterday) and the ride is much better. Personally, I wouldn't go any stiffer since I got a bad back.

The guy forgot the put the "rod" back to the xenon light leveling sensor and now it's aiming fine.

[Shawn C]

To clarify the myth of Koni shocks are softer than the OE sport:
(1) I got a chance to feel the damping by hand of the rear shocks and they require a lot more force to move the rod than my OE sport shocks.

(2) The Koni shocks are very smooth, maybe that's why they feel soft but they really aren't.

[franka]

To clarify the myth of Koni shocks are softer than the OE sport:
(1) I got a chance to feel the damping by hand of the rear shocks and they require a lot more force to move the rod than my OE sport shocks.

(2) The Koni shocks are very smooth, maybe that's why they feel soft but they really aren't.

No myth my friend.

The Koni compression stroke, that's when collapsing the shock not extending it, is non-adjustable. And it is soft in comparison to any Bilstein model. I've experienced both on my car, back to back.

Additionally and more important, you can not do a hand comparison because shock stiffness is a function of the collapsing velocity. And no person has the strength to collapse the shock at anything near the velocity the shock sees in normal service.

The higher the collasping velocity the stiffer any shock will become. That's why shock testing machines exist.

[franka]

I've said it before and I'm sticking to my statement that a new factory sport shock, and even a new non-sport factory shock, is stiffer in compression than a new Koni.

Koni is the softest in compression and their compression side is not adjustable. Only the rebound stroke, also called the extension stroke, is adjustable.

[kaptom540]

[quote=Shawn C;7761419]I don't have a photo hosting site.

use photobucket.

[atl540i]

I've said it before and I'm sticking to my statement that a new factory sport shock, and even a new non-sport factory shock, is stiffer in compression than a new Koni.

Koni is the softest in compression and their compression side is not adjustable. Only the rebound stroke, also called the extension stroke, is adjustable.

If this is true then how could they handle better? I don't mind the suspension being stiff I just want it to stick to the road and not roll a lot. Maybe I should just consider getting Bilsteins and keeping my stock sport springs...

[franka]

Konis don't handle better. They ride very smooth because they are soft.

Bilstein is a superior handling shock. Bilstein will keep your car tight to the road. You will want to get the Bilstein HDs.

The HDs and factory sport springs make a fabulous combination. I had that combo before I went to shorter springs. They are great together.

[supark]

If this is true then how could they handle better? I don't mind the suspension being stiff I just want it to stick to the road and not roll a lot. Maybe I should just consider getting Bilsteins and keeping my stock sport springs...

Ok - as far as I understand, your compression is handled by the spring itself - your shock shouldn't be doing the work there. Rebound (which is adjustable on the Koni) is what matters - because it dictates how quickly the force is released from the spring.

It's very noticeable in hard driving when your rebound and compression is not matched well. I had bilstein sports with stock sports package springs on my 540 - and IMO it was not a good match, compression was too soft and rebound was too aggressive - would have been better with a moderately stiffer spring.

This is where Konis with adjustable rebound hold their value - it allows you to match the characteristics of the spring with the shocks/struts.

[franka]

Ok - as far as I understand, your compression is handled by the spring itself - your shock shouldn't be doing the work there. Rebound (which is adjustable on the Koni) is what matters - because it dictates how quickly the force is released from the spring.

It's very noticeable in hard driving when your rebound and compression is not matched well. I had bilstein sports with stock sports package springs on my 540 - and IMO it was not a good match, compression was too soft and rebound was too aggressive - would have been better with a moderately stiffer spring.

This is where Konis with adjustable rebound hold their value - it allows you to match the characteristics of the spring with the shocks/struts.

Your shock manages/controls the velocity of spring compression and also the velocity of spring rebound. Shocks are very important in compression and in rebound both.

Regarding matching. A stiff spring needs a stiff shock to control/manage the stiff spring.

The Bilstein SPs are stiff, too stiff in my opinion for any street spring and that includes factory sport springs and the aftermarket Eibachs, Intrax, H&Rs etc springs. All those springs are street springs and as such are relatively speaking, soft. Race springs easily have double the spring rate of street springs or more.

The Bilstein SPs are not a good match for any street spring in my opinion. The Bilstein HDs are a good match. The HDs are roughly 20-30% stiffer than a factory sport shock and that's plently for any street spring.

I've had both Koni and Bilsteins on my car and I can say the Bilsteins offer more car control. For fast sudden movements like very quick lane change at 80 mph the Bilstein HDs were clearly superior.

At one time I had Konis and Eibach springs together. Because the Eibachs were soft and the Konis soft on compression it would bottom very easily on bumps that my factory suspension had no trouble with. I could crank the Konis up but it didn't help a bit on straight-on bumps. It would reduce the lean on curves because the rebound side of the shock was working.

[supark]

this is why coilovers are the ideal solution - because it allows you to set compression and rebound (or if you're on a budget - a matched setup like what UUC offers - though not sure if they have something for the E39..) If you're bottoming out that easily on Konis - you need to change your driving habits - they aren't that soft.

[atl540i]

Ok - as far as I understand, your compression is handled by the spring itself - your shock shouldn't be doing the work there. Rebound (which is adjustable on the Koni) is what matters - because it dictates how quickly the force is released from the spring.

It's very noticeable in hard driving when your rebound and compression is not matched well. I had bilstein sports with stock sports package springs on my 540 - and IMO it was not a good match, compression was too soft and rebound was too aggressive - would have been better with a moderately stiffer spring.

This is where Konis with adjustable rebound hold their value - it allows you to match the characteristics of the spring with the shocks/struts.

Ok - thanks for the info...

[franka]

[QUOTE=supark;If you're bottoming out that easily on Konis - you need to change your driving habits - Konis aren't soft.[/QUOTE]

Facts are facts.

Put that combo, Koni/Eibach, on your car and tell us what you find.

[supark]

Facts are facts.

Put that combo, Koni/Eibach, on your car and tell us what you find.

The thing is - it's not about "facts" - in a lot of ways this is very subjective - totally depends on your driving style and how you like the car to drive. I'm sure there are plenty of people on the board that can chime in on this who have this setup. Koni/Eibach is a very common combo - and you're the first that I've heard who's disliked it.

[The Fifth Element]

I'm sure if Bilstein HD's and chopped springs were the ticket, companies like Dinan and Groundcontrol wouldn't be using konis.

I don't consider one person's experience as 'facts'. What makes your judgement superior to the countless others on this board, the m5board, bimmerfest and others who like the koni shocks? You're the only one I've ever seen who says they're 'too soft' and that 'those are the facts' yet how a suspension feels to someone is entirely subjective.

And then you say Dinan koni's are revalved, yet there is no evidence to support that. Other people have found that the stampings/part numbers and welds are identical to that of the 'regular' konis, and that there's no observable differences except a premium increase in cost.

[Shawn C]

I am sure Bilsteins are stiffer than Konis, but there is no way the stock is stiffer than Konis. Place the shocks on the bench straight up, I can push down and pull up the stock sport shocks much easier and quicker than the Konis at full soft. I know this is not scientific, but any body try this can tell you which shock is much stiffer. Unless the Konis break in but I've already got 300 miles since last week and they don't seem to get any softer, it's me that's getting more used to the firm and yet smoother ride. I also talked to Konis tech rep and they said the FSD was designed more for comfort and Sport (the one most people use here) are for sports driving & lowering applications (stiffer). He told me full soft is slightly stiffer than OE sport. Most people with lowering springs to set on 1/4-1 turn from full soft.

Another thing to watch out on the Bilsteins is that the shocks WILL RAISE YOUR RIDE HEIGHT. This also can be verified with many people with their E39. Just do the search and you'll find out. I had Bilstein shocks on my preveous car--99 Passat and it was way stiff plus the fact that they are extemely high pressure shocks that the shocks not only had damping but also springing effect. You cannot push down these shocks unless your Arnold S. Personally, I think the Bilstein are more suitable for track.

Regarding the ride height, the Konis will drop your car 1/4" front & back if you're using the lowest spring perch on the rear shocks. The reason for the drop in the front is due to the lower location of the spring perch(there is only 1 perch in the front shock). And I love the moderate drop.

[Shawn C]

The Bilteins on the Passat had the same stiffness in HD vs sport, the only thing different was the length of the rod. The sport was shorter built for lower springs. I don't know about the E39 though.

[OGM3]

Thanks' everyone who contributed to this thread especially John 540i6 for the great write up. I did my Intrax install today. Man, the rear was a pain. I was so happy when the back was done and I could do the front. Overall it was not that bad. This thread was very helpful. The car looks great and low. I will post some pics as soon as I put on my 19" staggered M5 replicas. Soon!

[5zrisbmr]

Eibach springs , factory shocks , 2 months later no complaint's.....

[Shawn C]

5zrisbmr, you got a cool looking ride! What is your current ride height? Did you have factory sports suspension or regular? Those rims are cool too, what kind are those?

[supark]

5zrisbmr, you got a cool looking ride! What is your current ride height? Did you have factory sports suspension or regular? Those rims are cool too, what kind are those?

his sig reads - SSR GT3s for the rims

[franka]

This is off of Dinan'sweb site. You can go there yourself but for those who can't bother I've noted it below.

In the middle of the paragraph it says..."The shock valving has been custom tuned......"


Stage 1 Suspension System
The Stage 1 Suspension System represents the foundation for high performance handling. Comprised of carefully matched performance springs and Koni rebound adjustable struts and shocks, the system reduces the pitch and roll associated with the stock suspension, providing increased grip for faster and more predictable cornering capabilities. The shock valving has been custom tuned for superior handling, without sacrificing a well dampened, comfortable ride. The rebound dampening characteristics are user adjustable, providing the driver with the ability to fine tune for varying conditions, driving style and comfort. The modestly lower ride height gives the 540 an even more aggressive stance, as well as improving suspension geometry for tight and predictable handling.

[franka]

I'm sure if Bilstein HD's and chopped springs were the ticket, companies like Dinan and Groundcontrol wouldn't be using konis.

I don't consider one person's experience as 'facts'. What makes your judgement superior to the countless others on this board, the m5board, bimmerfest and others who like the koni shocks? You're the only one I've ever seen who says they're 'too soft' and that 'those are the facts' yet how a suspension feels to someone is entirely subjective.

And then you say Dinan koni's are revalved, yet there is no evidence to support that. Other people have found that the stampings/part numbers and welds are identical to that of the 'regular' konis, and that there's no observable differences except a premium increase in cost.

Along with the Dinan valving point you got wrong you also expanded my very specific statement to a broader generalization that I did not make.

In essence I said that my experience with the Koni/Eibach is that it is soft in compression and that it bottoms more easily than factory stock.

That's factual. That's my experience. Until you put the same combo on your 540 you have no experience to refute me.

There are lots of peole with Koni's that love them. That does not alter the fact that the Eibach/Koni combo bottoms more easily than a factory stock combo.

You can go on about m5 boards, those who like their Konis and all sorts of other non specific inunedo about Konis but you can not refute my experience.

Put the combo on and try it. Then talk to me specifically about bottoming.

I'll be out of town and off this forum for a few days.

[OGM3]

Here is my Intrax setup on stock struts. I am very happy with the smooth ride and the increased handling. It does not feel like I sacrificed any of the car's comfort. Like most people mention the car sits with a slight rake in the back. Thanks again for the write-up.