that was the most disgusting picture of an internal's i've ever scene. Ewww.
By the By, i change once ever 3-5 K, or when viscosity breaks.
coming to a dirt track near you........
if you checked out the links i posted you will gain a lot of knowledge of how different types of oils work. if you run a high quality synthetic from the start of your vehicles life, ie redline etc, that has a good ester, it will keep your engine clean and free of sludge. check out the links, there is tons of good info there if you are patient enough to read.
Yes, but as Brett was saying, oil can only hold so much sludge before it becomes saturated and the particles start precipitating out.
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
quite true, i was never debating that. dino oil is cheap and so are filters, i see no reason to let dino go past 3k considering the price. after i finish my 2nd treatment of auto-rx im switching to a good synthetic, and will most likely change it at 5-6k intervals. your oil is the life blood of your engine, and the single most imporntant piece of preventative maintenence you can do to your car. that pic is probably one of the most disgusting things i have ever seen, in the car world.
Last edited by nightkrawler; 12-19-2004 at 02:13 PM.
didn't you also do a Tranny fluid flush? How much was the Auto Rx? Any idea what Bobtheoilguy has to say about quick flushes such as Gunk's? Also, did Bobtheoilguy ever test open celled (or whatever they're called) filters such as what M3's use?
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
i change my mobil 1 synthetic every 3-4ish k miles. I work at a place with an autoparts center, so I get mobil 1 at cost. So no real losses there.
But don't the filters cost money? Or is that at cost too? And what about your time?Originally Posted by mobil1
2005 Audi (Purchased 07/09) - 2005 Yamaha R6 (Raven) (Purchased 5/06)
07/97 BMW (Sold 08/09) - 03/01 Audi A4 1.8TMCX (Sold 06/03)
Please do NOT PM me! Email me: clumpymold@sbcglobal.net
and what is "cost" for Mobil1?
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
I've done the oil analysis, and really like it if for no other reason to get a "baseline". EG, what types of wear, additive reduction, silicon/dirt, do you see BEFORE something has gone wrong? Since I have several cars to maintain in the family, I bought 6 samples for $100 -6th ends up being free, or the cost per on 6 goes to $16.66; however you want to look at it.
I did mine to rule out bearing wear when my pump nut came off (actually twice, once when pan came off, another time after I'd restored pressure to be sure).
I agree with Brett about the dirt. Blackstone analysis will tell you about that too, but I don't think it's cost effective to do one every time w/o having a fleet and trying for significantly longer change intervals, so I'll continue to change about every 5k with Castrol sythetic blend. I'm never going to wear a synthetic out (or modern, quality dino oil for that matter) at that change interval, so it's a cost effective thing to do. I also often do a filter at about 3k, buy them by the box so it's cheap and easy, but doubt it does much. Oil color and consistency certainly doesn't change after this! I also know previous owner did 5K mile changes, and when the pan came off at 45k, there wasn't even a hint of sludge anywhere (nor up top under valve cover).
I also watch what the oil looks like. If I get a dusty month, or (hopefully in 2005) get some track days, I'll change earlier if I believe it looks darker.
I'd also note that the synthetics look darker with only a 100 miles on them than most dino oil's I've used (read something about why but forget), so you have to get to "know" your oil and motor to some extent.
It's just SO cheap and easy at the end of it all to change if there's any question.
ADS
Last edited by adsingl; 12-19-2004 at 08:42 PM. Reason: added minor detail
"But how many engines have you heard of that die from having oil changes done more than 9k miles using synthetic? Is this common?"
Clumpy, I know you asked Brett but I'm going to take a stab at this. The extended intervals haven't been in place long enough to answer this with LOTS of experience. EG, not a bunch of 100k plus cars, many fewer 200k mile cars. Experience we ARE starting to get more of is like the one from this thread.
But a simple gut check suffices. The engine that started the discussion hadn't failed from what we're told, and I won't predict when it does, only that it or engines like this that don't have the problem caught and MAYBE several short changes and "cleaner" additives later get cleaned out, will fail significantly sooner than one that looks flawless. This could be a slow wear process where an oil path gets reduced, so HEAT and lubrication problem get worse, or, my prediction, lifters will start clattering, the classic, chronic low oil and/or dirty oil failure.
So - back to gut check, supposing records are available and you recall the pic of this 330, which car would you buy? 5k changes, 15k changes?
On average, oil at 8k and certainly by 10k, is opaque, you can't even see through it a little bit. 15k ain't gonna happen in my cars unless the stock (cost built into the car) filtering technology changes. And 9k is too close the the edge for me based on what I've seen about how dirty it looks - regardless of lubricating capabilities, in over 35 years of changing oil. In my teens it was part of my job, dozens of times a year.
ADS
I only did this once. I sent a sample at 4.5K miles and a 9K miles to see how th oil is doing. I actualy change may oil between 4k - 5K miles.Originally Posted by clumpymold
97 M3/4
...420rwhp...Dinan SC
Tuned by AA, M50 Manifold, RMS Aftercooler
3.5 Porsche HFM, 42# injectors, Supersprint Exhaust
AA Turbo Clutch, AA LTW Flywheel, TCK Suspension
AA Strut bars (F&R), XBrace, BMP Rear Camber Correcting Arm
BBS RK wheels on Pilot PS2, CF Hood
No it sounds like somone driving their car everday not long enough to warm up the engine sufficiently.I opened this one up to replace a leaking valve cover gasket and found this.
Another victim of 15,000 mile oil changes.
The car is a 2001 330i with 82,200 miles on it.
15K oil intervals are fine on newer BMWs, the oil filter however should be changed every 10K though.
"To live in the hearts we leave behind is to never die"
-Carl Sagan
case, i just changed the trans fluid to redline d4 atf. the fluid that was in the car was very clean so i didn't use the auto-rx in the trans,...yet. im on the rinse phase in the oil treatment part, and as i said the engine just keeps getting more and more quiet. as for price, when i ordered it, it cost me $60 for 3 bottles. but i need three because the car is over 100k so i have to do the treatment twice. solvent flushes such as gunk etc are not highly regarded over there. i dont know about the filters. check out the site and the forums, good info. i'll post a pic of the first oil filter i remove during the rinse phase. im going to cut it in half and check out the inside.Originally Posted by Casebrius
Just to drive you insane, here's a really interesting test : http://neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/mobil1.html
The gist of their conclusions:While the wear metals all accumulated steadily over the course of the test, the highest concentrations of accumulation per mile occurred in the first 3,000 miles of the test! From the 3,000-mile mark all the way to 18,000 miles, only lead showed an increase in per-mile wear beyond 3,000 miles. Yet even with an increased wear rate, lead wore the least in terms of absolute wear. For iron and copper, the longer the oil remained in service, the lower the wear rate got.
In case it isn't obvious yet, this means that the most wear occurs in the first 3,000 miles.
-Boondoggie
I meant tranny fluid in the crankcase, someone on here did that recently.
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
Using either Amsoil 10w-40 or Mobil 1 0w-40, both ACEA III rated long life euro spec oils, I follow the bmw srvc lights for changes.. This means i change the oil every ~8-10k miles, with a filter change at half the interval. Now, before condemming this, also consider that from the very beginning, like so many M3s, mine requires the addition of a qt every ~1800 miles. So, within every oil change interval, the car has already seen 5 new qts of synthetic! I havent figured out how this oil addition effects the total change ratio, but clearly its effect is to lower the effective oil change interval. Ive had several oil analyses done, and they always indicate i can go longer.
___________________
Paul E
'11 AW 135i ; Sold: '99 White M3 81k mi; Dinan SC kit, 6"/3.48" sc pulleys, Aftercooler: 10.5 psi-367 SAE rwhp/304 rwftlbs @80 degrees ambient (still with OBDII manifold & stock cats); DynoTuning by Nick G (techniquetuning.com); Speed Shop: Imported Cars of Stamford; AA-Aquamist Water Injection, exhaust, clutch; Fikse FM-10s; Koni Suspension; Stealthboxes
http://s11.photobucket.com/albums/a173/boostm3/
i dont understand what you mean? i changed the manual trans fluid. the old fluid looked really good. i changed it to redline d4atf.Originally Posted by Casebrius
i think he is referring to using atf in the engine to flush it.Originally Posted by nightkrawler
Someone on here put 1/2 qt tranny fluid in the crankcase as a flush alternative. So what are peoples takes on running a heavier vis. oil vs. a lower vis. one? It seems that people who run a little heavier don't burn any oil where as people running lower vis. do burn some. I used to burn oil when i ran synthetic, then switched to Castrol 10w-30 Syn blend and burn ZERO oil. I can see it being good from a "fresher" oil in your crankcase point, but are there any drawbacks to burning it? I'm about to switch back to Mobil1 15W-50 (after a Gunk Flush) because most people who run it claim to burn little oil.
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
I went from dino oil to 10W30 Mobil 1. It leaked like no other. Put in about 4 QUARTS after about 1500 miles or so. It started getting less and less though. Then when I changed to 0W40 Mobil 1, it hardly leaks. Not bad at all. Only downfall I notice is that the car runs a little rough on startup. But I heard, from another thread, that this is common. Not sure if it's true. I didn't notice this with my 10W30 though.Originally Posted by Casebrius
2005 Audi (Purchased 07/09) - 2005 Yamaha R6 (Raven) (Purchased 5/06)
07/97 BMW (Sold 08/09) - 03/01 Audi A4 1.8TMCX (Sold 06/03)
Please do NOT PM me! Email me: clumpymold@sbcglobal.net
Where was it leaking from? Running Syn blend so I'm wondering if I'll have that problem ?
Last edited by Casebrius; 12-20-2004 at 06:41 PM.
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
Not really sure. My power steering was also leaking at the time. All I know was that I had to fill up a lot of oil about 1500 miles later.Originally Posted by Casebrius
Haven't filled up much lately. Only put in about 1-2 quarts the last 1-1.5k.
2005 Audi (Purchased 07/09) - 2005 Yamaha R6 (Raven) (Purchased 5/06)
07/97 BMW (Sold 08/09) - 03/01 Audi A4 1.8TMCX (Sold 06/03)
Please do NOT PM me! Email me: clumpymold@sbcglobal.net
i can tell you guys honestly that before auto-rx, the only products that worked in any of my car's have been rislone and restore. i've tried solvent flushes ie gunk, seafoam, etc, with no results. this auto-rx stuff is the best thing i have ever used and im not even through the first rinse phase. im telling you, check out the site and call frank miller, he's the inventor. nicest guy i have ever met and likes to talk to people about this kind of stuff, here's his # 1 904 273 9098. i have no affaliation with this product and am gaining nothing buy telling people about it. it really has worked for me.
what has it done for ya?
Dakar 95 M3 (4/95 manufacture)
Techno Violet 97 M3 (12/96 manufacture)
Alpine White 16 535i M-Sport (10/15 manufacture)
_________________________________
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -- A. Senna
Illegitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
Yeah, and what's it's main purpose? Is it similar to Restore? That's what I use. So far so good. Not many leaks. Maybe that's why I don't have much leaks anymore?Originally Posted by Casebrius
2005 Audi (Purchased 07/09) - 2005 Yamaha R6 (Raven) (Purchased 5/06)
07/97 BMW (Sold 08/09) - 03/01 Audi A4 1.8TMCX (Sold 06/03)
Please do NOT PM me! Email me: clumpymold@sbcglobal.net
Bookmarks