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Thread: Odd Steering after Control Arms Replaced and Alignment

  1. #1
    Join Date
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    1995 BMW 850CI

    Odd Steering after Control Arms Replaced and Alignment

    I had the control arms (which were really bad) and tie rods (if I remember right) replaced. I had new Continental tires installed and an alignment done. Initially I was happy as it rode and tracked great on the freeway, much improved. I started to notice that when going 40-60 mph or so if I slowly start a turn and keep increasing it at about 40 degrees on the steering wheel the car suddenly will turn more sharply. I seem to notice it more in a right turn but that may be due to sharper right turns. It's as if at a certain point in an increasing turn at one point it suddenly gets more sensitive. The tires have 35psi all around and are basically the same tires I had before. I just looked at it from the front and back with the steering straight and in my eye it looks like the fronts are have some toe out which might be the problem as I'm pretty sure they should have a small amount of toe in. The specs for toe is 0° 18'± 5'. I will take it to another shop when I get a chance to check the alignment.
    EricinConejo

    1995 850CI, 1959 Chev Impala, 1965 Cessna 172, 1986 Mustang GT, 2002 Mustang GT, 2005 Dodge Durango Hemi, 2016 Land Rover Discovery Sport

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
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    San Jose, CA, USA
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    1994 "532i6", 1998 528iT
    That definitely sounds like an excess toe issue. I get this all the time after I do something major, and the toe angle is over a degree (in or out). E34, but we basically have the same front end.

    You can check the toe yourself with two straight blocks of... anything (metal, wood, etc) and two identical tape measures. The tape measure in front of the tires should read about 1/16" to 1/8" less than the tape aft of the front tires.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    CSRA, SC
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    850Ci, Excursion
    I'm voting for something is loosey goosey

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
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    Shoreview MN
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    Had a 1991 BMW 850
    Could be you fixed one problem that was masking another. Check Alignment first though

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    850Ci, M5, Model-S P85D
    I had a car with excess caster differential between the front wheels.
    The car did not pull, but once I initiated a right hand turn it just wanted to keep turning right.
    I had to force the steering wheel by hand to go straight after a right hand turn.
    It was a bent strut housing after an accident and the body shop did an hack alignment without replacing the bent suspension parts.
    Dangerous car...
    Also,
    The front suspension has "Ackerman Steering" where the inside tire must have tighter turn radius compared to the outside tire or the toe-in between tires during a turn will increase.
    The Ackerman steering is based on wheel track (width) and wheelbase (length) so it is different for various BMW's i.e. E32 is narrower and has different steering arms than the E31, etc.
    Make sure the correct steering steering arms (Left/Right - tie rod lever) attached to the bottom of the strut housing are correct/matching for the E31.

    Last edited by m6bigdog; 01-20-2023 at 06:14 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    I'm starting to think something is giving that shouldn't. Drove it a lot today. At freeway speeds the increased turn happens really abruptly and I think almost only to the right. Also, pulling into the garage at slow speed there is a point when turning close to full right that the car wants to turn further right when the steering wheel is let go. I also noticed that if I've been driving straight for a bit at the first slight push on the brake pedal there is a small jump to the right which I guess could possibly be related. My daily driver is down and we are leaving town next week so I'll bring it to the shop in a couple of weeks to see what could be going on. Don't think it's the alignment any more but something not right on the right side suspension.
    EricinConejo

    1995 850CI, 1959 Chev Impala, 1965 Cessna 172, 1986 Mustang GT, 2002 Mustang GT, 2005 Dodge Durango Hemi, 2016 Land Rover Discovery Sport

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricinConejo View Post
    I'm starting to think something is giving that shouldn't. Drove it a lot today. At freeway speeds the increased turn happens really abruptly and I think almost only to the right. Also, pulling into the garage at slow speed there is a point when turning close to full right that the car wants to turn further right when the steering wheel is let go. I also noticed that if I've been driving straight for a bit at the first slight push on the brake pedal there is a small jump to the right which I guess could possibly be related. My daily driver is down and we are leaving town next week so I'll bring it to the shop in a couple of weeks to see what could be going on. Don't think it's the alignment any more but something not right on the right side suspension.
    Of course checking suspension fasteners is always a first check for the easy find!!
    I would not drive the car any distance in its current condition, as suspension failures (complete loss of steering/mobility) are very possible with very little sensation of the looming failure.
    Tie-rod and other wheel control part failure at speed can cause significant chassis and body damage.

    Braking/torque steer can have two flavors.
    If it occurs with some sensation in the steering wheel it is likely caused by the front suspension.
    If it occurs with no sensation in the steering wheel it is most likely in the rear suspension. This is a sensation that the steering is loose..
    The next check it to find a level patch of road that doesn't cause any tramlining or directional twitching at a steady speed to test (over and over) how the suspension reacts to torque loading.
    Braking is one (above) and the other is throttle torque steer.
    With throttle it mainly causes a reaction in the rear suspension.
    So, you will want to drive through that smooth section of road at 35-45 MPH at 3k RPM and throttle both easy and fairly hard to see if it caused a direction/steering change or torque steer.
    Example: Throttling caused a movement toward left and lifting-off makes it return, then braking causes a movement towards the right: this would obviosity be rear suspension torque steer, hence you will want to find the rear suspension bushings and/or ball-joints causing the problem.
    Also, steering instability can be a combination of front and rear suspension behaving poorly, hence you could have have both front suspension tramlining with brake torque steer and rear suspension brake and throttle torque steer.
    If you have rear suspension torque steer, I suggest getting the rear suspension torque steer corrected, bushing and ball-joint replaced with the rear camber and torque angle alignment set then sort out the front suspension woes...
    You can also do a massive suspension bushing and ball-joint replacement effort (great for cars with more than 60k miles since suspension refurbishment) but don't forget to check the front strut upper guide supports.
    Last edited by m6bigdog; 01-21-2023 at 03:14 AM.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    1995 BMW 850CI
    Thanks for the responses. I'll let you know what I or my mechanic find.
    EricinConejo

    1995 850CI, 1959 Chev Impala, 1965 Cessna 172, 1986 Mustang GT, 2002 Mustang GT, 2005 Dodge Durango Hemi, 2016 Land Rover Discovery Sport

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    1995 BMW 850CI
    It ended up being the Front Sway Bar End Links. Also new struts which may have helped also. Drives great now.
    EricinConejo

    1995 850CI, 1959 Chev Impala, 1965 Cessna 172, 1986 Mustang GT, 2002 Mustang GT, 2005 Dodge Durango Hemi, 2016 Land Rover Discovery Sport

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