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Thread: R&R cylinder heads of M62TU engine in the car (BMW E39 540i)

  1. #201
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    Probably.
    Although "operator error" -mine- is the most likely cause. Having noticed it is about 10º off, I may have over-corrected it but in the wrong direction (advance instead of retard), which would make it 20º off as reported by INPA.
    Note that Bank-2 has a new -used- timing cover, because the original one was gone when the chain broke. Could the seating of that used cover be a factor ??

    Although, on Bank-1 , the alignment is almost perfect. INPA live data shows Vanos angle fluctuations of + or - 2 degrees, not - 20.

  2. #202
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    All I can say is a number of peeps back in the Boston area, NC, and SC have used my timing kit (GG is one of them) and haven’t had timing codes.
    Your used bank 2 upper timing cover isn’t the problem.

  3. #203
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    My GAS tools have been used for more than a dozen chain guide replacements. 2 of us had to adjust a trigger wheel slightly after getting intermittent codes. Was that the tool or us? Hard to say.

    And there was one GAS tool user who swore up and down that he'd done everything right and still got codes, when it later turned out that he'd used the tool wrong and installed one trigger wheel way off.
    Last edited by R Shaffner; 02-05-2023 at 01:52 PM.

  4. #204
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    I’d have to guess tolerance stacking errors and operator errors are what cause most of the problems.
    Quality tools are generally not the main cause of the problem.

  5. #205
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    I suggest taking it one step at a time. I'd do the following:


    1. Run the car for 30 seconds, or crank it over several times with the starter, to make sure the chain tensioner is full of oil.
    2. Take both cam covers off.
    3. (Leave all the belts on for now.)
    4. Turn the engine forward to #1 TDC. (Removing the plugs makes that easier.)
    5. Put the crank pin in.
    6. Check to see if the cam blocks fit well, with the chain tight (no slack) from the Bank 1 intake cam, to the Bank 2 cam, to the crank. (Ideally there'd be no slack, but if there is make sure it's passenger side, where the tensioner is.)
    7. If the timing is off, you have to reset it, along with setting the trigger wheels.
    8. If the cams are timed properly, then you can breathe easier -- it's a trigger wheel issue. You can try checking the position of each trigger wheel using the holes in the UTCs. (It's crude, but it should certainly tell you whether you're 20 degrees off or not. Some have used it to tell them how far to adjust the wheels. (I forget the details about using the timing cover holes, but it's on this site somewhere and others, like JimLev of course, know how to use those holes to line up the trigger wheels.


    In short, if you're lucky you might be able to do this without removing the front timing covers. Others have.
    Last edited by R Shaffner; 02-05-2023 at 08:50 PM.

  6. #206
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    Well, but I am positively sure that it is a trigger wheel issue and only on Bank-2.

    My reasons are :
    -- After I replaced the fuel pump, the engine started and ran fine several times for several minutes each, . After each run, I scan with INPA : no error codes, other than the MAF signal error (I had to disconnect the MAF to be able to start it, but that is another problem I think).

    Until yesterday, when error code 34 popped out after another run of about 10 minutes or so.
    So, I retest it again with INPA live monitoring (Engine status, analog F6). I saw the live Vanos angles fluctuating + or - 2 degrees on Bank-1. But up to -19 or -20 degrees on Bank-2. Then the CEL or Engine-fail-safe kicks comes up. And the error code 34 is logged...,

    I just did the fix described in post #116 of https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...k-2-quot/page5. : Remove valve cover Bank-2 , and adjust the trigger wheel : turn it CCW by about 15 or 20 degrees . Because at minus - 20º, the trigger wheel is over-advanced. So, I need to turn it back counter-clock-wise by about 15 or 20º : that is about a quarter of a notch of the trigger wheel hex nut .

    I have a couple other unrelated things to do while I am there : replacing a water hose and a couple O-rings. Then I'll put the engine back together and test

    Crossing my fingers this is the last straw...
    Last edited by Chedley; 02-06-2023 at 01:02 AM.

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by R Shaffner View Post
    I suggest taking it one step at a time. I'd do the following:
    ....Check to see if the cam blocks fit well,.....
    And yes, the cam blocks did fit very well on Bank-2 when I removed the valve cover to adjust the trigger wheel.

  8. #208
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    Update:
    So, adjusting the trigger wheel by about 3 mm or 15 degrees CCW on Bank-2 only, seems to have fixed the problem: no more error codes. Crossing my fingers again.

    But now I have a pretty familiar problem : -- Murphy's law does not want to give up on me--
    The alternator is barfing : it produces only 10 to 12 volts after I start the engine -as measured live by INPA (Engine Status, F5), then the engine dies. New battery fully charged at 12.4 volts.
    This confirms a bad water cooled alternator , yes ??
    It is a Bosh alternator, about 6 years old- and has about 60 K miles. Time for a new alternator or a rebuilt one. Are the after-market alternators any good ??
    Last edited by Chedley; 02-09-2023 at 06:07 PM.

  9. #209
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    That voltage doesn't sound fully charged. I'd double check your wiring before deciding that the alternator just died.

    I'd also try jump starting it from another running car. That should tell you whether the engine will run with sufficient battery and charging.

  10. #210
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    Well, I recharged the battery to full : 12.7 volts at rest, and got the same behavior.

    So, I replaced the alternator with a rebuilt alternator. Engine starts and voltage climbs up to about 14 volts (INPA live reading) , but after about 10-15 seconds, it drops again back to about 12 volts, the engine coughs and then dies...And no error codes.
    I do not think it is an electric connection problem? Is it related to the MAF issue: engine still starts and dies if the MAF is connected.

    My next suspect is the wobbly main idler pulley -- It may not drive the alternator to start right. I am going to replace the whole belt and tensioner-idler pulleys thing, and see if that fixes the problem. I wanted to replace them anyway....
    Last edited by Chedley; 02-13-2023 at 10:03 PM.

  11. #211
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    If the battery was good and the alternator was dead you should be able to drive the car for at least 30 miles.
    Disconnect the MAF and see if it still stalls. Have you checked the battery connections?

  12. #212
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    Yes , the battery connections are clean and tight. .
    And yes, it stalls with MAF disconnected, and a fully recharged battery. You'd think it is a bad battery / connections ?
    I have a back up battery, I will try it.

  13. #213
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    What’s your fuel pressure read when cranking and when it starts?

  14. #214
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    Low fuel yellow light has been on for awhile, but a new fuel pump installed.
    I am going to get and pour a couple gallons of fresh premium gas and test and get a read fuel pressure..
    Thanks for the hint.

  15. #215
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    Error code 34 (P0022)

    So, this week end, I fixed the fuel, battery voltage and MAF issues. But...Error code 34 (P0022) is back.

    The engine starts and runs rough. INPA code 34 (P-code 22) pops up at about 2000 RPM, then engine dies if I let its rpm idle down.
    INPA live status shows : Vanos angle on Bank-2 is too retarded by 40. But on Bank-1 it is perfect at about 0 degrees.
    See attached INPA status.

    I think I may have screwed it last week -or maybe I was drunk -, when I first had this ugly code 34 with Vanos angle at -20 : I adjusted the Bank-2 trigger wheel CCW to the left. And now it is at +40, instead of 0. If so, the fix now should be to turn it again CW to the right by 10 degrees..

    Before I get too far carried by this, I want to confirm it.
    Could anyone who has a well tuned M62TU engine running with vanos and no errors, and who has INPA installed, try this:
    Start the engine and warm it up. Then hook up INPA, and monitor live the Vanos angles at idle then at 2000 RPM. PM me or post what you find. Thanks,..
    (INPA live monitoring of vanos: start INPA, select Engine ECU, then click on Status, then F6)

    Thanks,

    (remove the .txt to view this file)
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by Chedley; 02-20-2023 at 11:29 AM. Reason: Attach INPA report (rtf)

  16. #216
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    At this point you just need to stop beating around the bush and retime the engine.
    Last edited by MotorMouth93; 02-20-2023 at 10:31 AM.

  17. #217
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    Well, I think the engine is basically well timed.
    The only problem (code 34) is the Bank-2 trigger wheel setting. And if my geometry is right, I just have to turn the trigger wheel CW by about 10º or 2 mm.
    Trigger-wheel-adjust.JPEG

    Anyway, that is what I am going to do and see how it pans out.
    Besides it is a lot easier than a full re-timing of the engine. You just lock pin the crankshaft with engine at TDC, remove Bank-2 valve cover, insert the camshaft locking blocs, loosen the trigger wheel screw to adjust it, then re-tighten it.

  18. #218
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    Either it’s timed right, or it isn’t.
    Set the controls for the heart of the sun

  19. #219
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    Brave assumption at this point but good luck. It's pretty hard to screw up the trigger wheel timing with the GAS tools but here we are...

    Edit: Take a look at JimLevs post here https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...7#post30681227

    If I'm reading that correctly it looks like it might not be a trigger wheel issue and instead could be some functional issue with the VANOS on that bank.
    Last edited by MotorMouth93; 02-20-2023 at 02:28 PM.

  20. #220
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    It shouldn’t be a vanos problem, I rebuilt and checked both of them.
    He had my timing kit as well as the GAS kit and told me my kit was something like 10º or 20º off compared to the GAS kit. I found that hard to believe as I’ve used in on my car and plenty of other 540’s. Some good friends have borrowed it, nobody had codes after they timed it.

  21. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by MotorMouth93 View Post
    Brave assumption at this point but good luck. It's pretty hard to screw up the trigger wheel timing with the GAS tools but here we are...

    Edit: Take a look at JimLevs post here https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...7#post30681227

    If I'm reading that correctly it looks like it might not be a trigger wheel issue and instead could be some functional issue with the VANOS on that bank.
    @MotorMouth93 --> The thread you quoted is a very interesting read. Thanks.

    That OP's problem turned out to be a bad built Vanos and / or a misaligned front timing cover.
    As my Vanos has been rebuilt by JimLev -so I assume it is good- , I'll have a second closer look at my Bank-2 front timing cover when I get to readjusting the trigger wheel. It is a used timing cover that I bought and installed on this engine, as the original cover has been cracked and shattered when my timing chain broke.
    So maybe that is the real problem ?
    Last edited by Chedley; 02-21-2023 at 02:23 AM.

  22. #222
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    His vanos had a broken inner part preventing it from fully advancing, see the pics at post 34.
    https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...022-Code/page4

  23. #223
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    I'm not sure and don't have time to check right now, but if you unplug both cam sensors, I believe the engine will deactivate the VANOS units and run. (That is, it will run more like an M62, less power in the mid-range without VANOS.) And you'll get error codes of course.

    Trigger wheel issues won't matter with the sensors disconnected. If it doesn't run well this way, that brings you back to re-checking the timing.
    Last edited by R Shaffner; 02-21-2023 at 08:20 AM.

  24. #224
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    R Shaffner, you are 100% correct. Do it Chedley.

  25. #225
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    Just did it. Thanks to R.Shaffner's suggestion, now I have confirmation that the problem is indeed the trigger wheel on Bank-2.
    And I still have the MAF problem.


    1. With MAF and both Cam sensors (cps) disconnected : Engine is hard to start, but then runs pretty smooth and quiet at +1000 rpm. It logs INPA errors: 113,114 (cps) and 115, 124 (MAF), then goes into Engine-fail-safe mode, but keeps running. I guess that is what you guys call M62 mode.
    2. Only the MAF sensor is disconnected. The engine starts alright and then logs these INPA errors: 34 (P0022) , 115, 134. INPA live status shows again the Vanos angles fluctuating around: 0 on Bank-1, and +41 on Bank-2.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by Chedley; 02-21-2023 at 07:43 PM. Reason: Attach status

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