M30 engine ECU learning

[fobos161]

@shogun

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR RESPONSE!

[Annddrriy]

Car never did smoke test. Vacuum test also can tell if engine is in good condition.

[shogun]

smoke tester is the tool to go, easy to find and see leaks

[Annddrriy]

How do you close completely exhaust valves in cylinders head when you do smoke test ?

[shogun]

No need to close them, last time when I tested my throttle valves I connected the smoke tester to the vacuum hose which goes to the fuel pressure regulator, see here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FAQ5UZChZY
smoke machine instructions https://www.cpsproducts.com/wp-conte...glishweb-1.pdf
there are various additional parts you get to select what you want to test:
Cap Plugs Kit: these cap plugs are useful when sealing an intake manifold system in order to contain the smoke in the system for proper leak testing, such as mass airflow sensor ducting, etc.
Smoke Diffuser: this adapter is designed to locate leaks around doors, windows, sunroofs and trunk compartment. The adapter allows the operator to lay down a thick bed of smoke (from outside the vehicle) along door and window seams in order to watch for disturbance caused by escaping airflow due to a leaking seal. Internal pressure is created by vehicle’s HVAC set to fresh air (i.e. not recirculation) and blower fan on high speed.
Adapter Cone: for introducing smoke into the exhaust system or into any orifice that accommodates the cone's size, such as the induction system.
Combination Light: delivers a white light for easier smoke location, an ultraviolet (UV) light that highlights the fluorescent dye deposited at the exact location of a leak and a laser pointer.

Basic Testing Procedure
NOTE: ALL TESTS WITH THIS TESTER ARE PERFORMED WITH THE VEHICLE’S ENGINE OFF!
1. Connect Tester to shop air. See Optional Gas Source below.
2. Connect Tester’s Red power cable to vehicle’s 12 Volt DC battery positive terminal.
3. Connect Tester’s Black cable to vehicle’s chassis ground. Do NOT connect the black cable to battery ground because a spark in the vicinity of the battery can cause an explosion! (Figure 2)
4. Observe that the Green Power indicator lamp on the Tester is ‘ON’ confirming that you are properly connected.> Battery must be in good condition and fully charged!> A blinking green power lamp indicates insufficient battery power to the Tester.
5. Connect smoke supply hose to system being tested.
6. Flow Control Valve must be in Full Open position. (Figure 3)
7. Press START button and fill system with smoke. > Whenever possible it is best to ‘purge’ the ‘non-smoke’ air out of the system being tested in order to quickly fill the system with smoke.> Smoke production is on 5-minute timer.
8. Use white light supplied and look for exiting smoke or use ultraviolet light supplied to look for fluorescent dye deposit at exact location of a leak.> The longer smoke is allowed to exit a leak, the more fluorescent
dye will be deposited at leak locations.

[Annddrriy]

By doing this smoke test are you checking if fuel not go through diaphragm of fuel pressure regulator valve ?

[shogun]

Just pull off the vacuum hose from the FPR, if fuel is leaking there, diaphragm ruptured. Testing for a leaking, ruptured, fuel pressure regulator diaphragm: How to verify the cause of an intermittent long crank and a start/stall condition. No need to have the electronics as shown first, just remove the vacuum hose and sniff if there is fuel smell or even fuel coming out. Watch for fuel. Takes over a minute that fuel is coming out of the port in this vid, diaphragm cracked. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKtR_yF7bi8

[Annddrriy]

I see that. Have you ever did vacuume test for intire vacuume system through cylinder head exhaust valve all of way through exhaust manifold and catalytic converter to tail pipe muffler by closing mufler end hole then gauge was installed to intake manifold it will vacuume everything and bring you reading on the gauge if some tiny spot has some air vacuum leak ?

[Annddrriy]

What does TD/RT Signal Engine idling mean ?

[shogun]

What does TD/RT Signal Engine idling mean ?

you asked 2 months ago for TD/RT signal info and whiskychaser replied https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...3#post30836093

Have you ever did vacuum test for intire vacuume system through cylinder head exhaust valve all of way through exhaust manifold and catalytic converter to tail pipe muffler by closing mufler end hole

Have never done this

[Annddrriy]

This not working good for some reason TD engine speed signal and RT timing retard torque reduction frequency in hertz 35-45
frequency waveform of transmission TD-TR.jpg

[Annddrriy]

When engine start cold the purge valve has to be circulated through charcoal canister. Purge valve has to be open and vacuum air onto intake manifold ?

[shogun]

quick test tank breather valve 45 +/- 20 ohm
Fuel tank breather valve function decription: the electrical control = the timing of the tank venting / breather valve is dependent on RPM speed and load. The venting cycle includes 16 cycles and begins as soon as the lamda/oxygen sensor control is active = when the O2 sensor is heated up to operating temperature. At the end of a cycle, the valve is closed for about 5 minutes. Without power = 12V the valve is closed by by the internal check valve. with increasing vacuum in the air collector, the valve is opened as long as no voltage = 12V is applied.

Oxygen sensor: O2 sensor
Since a temperature of approximately 300 degrees Celsius is necessary for the lambda sensor to be ready for operation, a heating resistor in the O2 probe shaft is supplied with voltage via the fuel pump relay. If the lambda sensor fails, the control is carried out with a fixed programmed replacement value = 0.45V in DME/ECU

From DME 1.1/1.3 testing instructions:
Check the tank ventilation valve (TE valve):
The tank breather valve valve is pulsed every second. The timing/pulsation can be felt by hand.

Check tightness:
Connect the vacuum supply from the service tester to the 8-mm connection (observe the flow arrow). Adjust the vacuum to 600 mbar and supply the TE valve with 12V.
Switch off the vacuum pump, after 20 seconds the pressure drop must not exceed 50 mbar. Without 12V the tank breather valve is closed by a check valve up to a suction pipe vacuum of 20 mbar.

Check the actuation phases:
The TE valve is actuated when idling (display ON) and is thus closed. As soon as the lambda control is active and the engine speed is increased up to approx. 1600 RPM, the gradual opening can be observed (display OFF).

Air flow meter check
The value Up/UV (Up = potentiometer voltage, Uv = supply voltage 5V) shows the voltage ratio, which results from the jam flap position in the LMM/AFM. At no load the value is 0.20....0.25, at full load it rises up to 0.9. In case of an interruption of the power supply or the signal line the value 0.02 is displayed.

Check voltage supply:
At the LMM/AFM at line GR/WS (+) and GR/BL (-) with supply ON approx. 5V. At the DME control unit this corresponds to pin 12 (+) and pin 26 (-).

Intake air temperature error in LMM
The intake air temperature is 50....70 degrees C when the engine is at operating temperature. (Ambient air temperature 23 +/- 5 degrees C.) A reading below -40 degrees indicates an interruption in the temperature sensor or the supply line to the DME control unit.

Resistance check
Connect universal adapter, measure resistance at terminals 44 and 26.

Injectors
The fuel injectors are controlled with a frequency of 10 Hz. The pulse time is 1 ms. to avoid fuel injection. The activation can be felt by hand. The pulses can be checked with a multimeter at the injection valve connector.

Resistance check
The resistance of a coil is 15...17 ohm at 23 +/- 5 degrees C.

Lambda probe
Prerequisite for the working is an operating warm lambda probe. The displayed voltage signal is tapped step by step and varies between 0.02 and 0.85V. If the lambda sensor is not working or the line to the DME control unit is interrupted, a constant value of 0.45V is displayed. This value is also present if no lambda sensor is installed.
LAMBDA SENSOR (O2 SENSOR) https://autoditex.com/page/lambda-se...nsor-21-1.html

This I translated for you from here, the rest you can translate DIY https://web.archive.org/web/20141031...DME11-735i.pdf

[Annddrriy]

When engine starts cold misfire it's vacuum leak somewhere. When engine starts cold lambda sensor warm up 5 minutes then turn 12v power for purge valve if purge valve getting small DC voltage around 0.67v the purge valve has internal valve a bit open and create small vacuum leak. If purge valve getting small DC voltage around 0.67v is that mean engine ECU purge valve S450 A4 pin driver has electrical leak.

[Annddrriy]

I think I have to clear the engine code by blocking purge valve hose and run the car one week like that after that check out for stomp pedal test for any code.

[Annddrriy]

Any one know what's amp draw limit at idle on fuel pump M30B35 ? Thanks !

[shogun]

The fuel pump always runs at 1 speed, no matter if idle or full throttle, the fuel feed/flow is controlled by the fuel pressure regulator and the vacuum hose to the FPR. Fuel pump fuse is 15A. The rule of thumb for a fuse is double the amperage. So I assume it draws 7.5 amps because of the 15 amp fuse. if you want to know exactly, use your multimeter.

Edit, German E32 repair manual mentions for the M30 Bosch fuel pump power consumption 5.5A

[Annddrriy]

I thought fuel pump runs depend on the engine RPM when engine RPM goes up then crankshaft sensor send small AC voltage to ECU to open injectors valve more. When engine RPM increase then vacuum increase in the intake manifold and open fuel pressure regulator diaphragm more to make more pressure to injectors valve. Does the engine ECU controls injectors pulswide only and ON/OFF injectors two group ?

[shogun]

The fuel pump on our old cars has only one RPM/volume/pressure. Excess/not needed fuel is controlled by the fuel pressure regulator and returned to the tank. A good working fuel pump always delivers much more than your engine needs. Bosch specification for your pump for the M30 engine I got from a German language repair manual for the E32, Nominal data:
The M30 fuel pump is Bosch 0 580 464 995, operating pressure is 3 bar, conveying capacity at 12 V 1.9 liter/minute, conveying capacity against counter pressure 875 ccm/30 seconds, Power consumption is 5A
The M70 has 2 pumps, so 1 for 6 cylinders, each: Bosch part number is 0580112507 (according to an old repair book) , operating pressure is 3 bar, conveying capacity at 12 V 1.7 liter/minute = less than the M30 pump
capacity against counter pressure 875 cc/30 seconds,power consumption 5.5A

As you can see from above for M30 the fuel pump makes 1.9 liter/minute = 114 liters per hour. If the pump get's older, capacity and pressure goes down. The most common causes of low fuel pressure are a clogged fuel filter or a bad fuel pump. It can also be caused by a bad fuel pressure regulator, a leaking vacuum system which controls the fuel pressure and flow, a stuck fuel injector, or a smashed fuel pressure line. It is not advisable to drive with low fuel pressure because it can cause damage to your engine. If the fuel pressure gets too low, it will starve the engine of fuel and cause it to stall. If your engine is not getting enough fuel, it will cause heat in the pistons which can damage your engine severely. If you want to increase the fuel pressure, you will need to install an aftermarket adjustable fuel pressure regulator.

[Annddrriy]

Do you have part number for an aftermarket adjustable fuel pressure regulator ?

[shogun]

I do not need adjustable fuel pressure, the original 3 Bar FPR fits + is designed exactly for my engine, if you want higher pressure on M30, use for example M60 FPR 13531729319 3,5BAR/PIERBURG. But for which reason?
If you want an adjustable, google for: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with Gauge.
It seems to me that it would be a worthless mod unless you have an A/F ratio gauge to see the results of your tuning. Your DME will adjust , closed loop mode = The computer will trim the injectors, and change the pulse width. What does an adjustable fuel pressure regulator do better than the original one on a original, not tuned engine?

[Annddrriy]

For the reason if pump not provide proper fuel pressure.

- - - Updated - - -

The vacuum a bit low in the system because purge valve creates vacuum leak through the charcoal canister. It creates vacuum leak after 5 minituse when the engine warmed up.

[shogun]

if you have a problem with vacuum, then fix the vacuum problem, but do not try to by-pass it with something which can create a new problem. The purge valve system is a proven system, if that makes a problem, fix the purge valve system.
quick test tank breather valve 45 +/- 20 ohm
Fuel tank breather valve function description: the electrical control = the timing of the tank venting / breather valve is dependent on RPM speed and load. The venting cycle includes 16 cycles and begins as soon as the lambda/oxygen sensor control is active = when the O2 sensor is heated up to operating temperature. At the end of a cycle, the valve is closed for about 5 minutes. Without power = 12V the valve is closed by by the internal check valve. with increasing vacuum in the air collector, the valve is opened as long as no voltage = 12V is applied.
Since weeks I am proposing to you to make a smoke test to test for air/vacuum leaks. Get a smoke tester or make a test kit DIY

[Annddrriy]

Yes a smoke test to test for air/vacuum leaks it is good idea. I will put smoke in to purge valve hose which is connected to the charcoal canister.

[Annddrriy]

I did not see any difference between fuel pump green relay and orange relay. Just a bit Ohms different between pins 85 and 86.Orange relay has 5 Ohms more then green relay. Fuel pump has amp draw fluctuate around 1.5amps. I have to check fuel pressure with the gauge. One green relay I have from rear window heater. What is different of those two relays 83506005001 and 20 213 501 ?