Transmission case sleeves, ZF 4HP22/24 EH valve body questions

[Annddrriy]

I would like to that you pay attention to the wiring diagram I made it about how it wiring connected in car but not in wiring diagram I made this diagram for bimmer E32 fans only who likes M30 power. You can look at diagram on hystory page 356.

[Annddrriy]

W/2Program Switch pin 14 connect to the cluster pin 8. In both diagram E-7 version early and late pin 15 and 14 is program switch how to connect in this diagram will be correct ? Diagram has been upgraded to the latest version no more version exist.
2 position program switch.jpg3 positionProgram Switch.jpg

[Annddrriy]

Removed the BRN/BLK wire from Throttle Position Switch pin number 5 then connected scanner for general live data scanning while scanner connected went for drive test with scanner connected in transmission live data then when shifted gear selector to position drive then "E" symbol on dashboard has gone nothing was there also "M" symbol mode was not visible. When begin to drive from forward gear the shifting was smooth without any feeling gear shifting it was like driving on neutral gear and was seems to me like on M mode when shift to D it was light drag forward all that job was done with scanner. When disconnect scanner then went for road test the gears shifting return to same as before terible shifting not smooth. After road test drive did scan again for code there was no any code. The problem was in TPS pin 5 wire is shorted somehow in engine ECU pin 53 is wide open throttle. The problem seems to me is in the engine ECU or most likely the problem is in TPS wiring. When put wire back on to the TPS pin 5 and then scan the engine ECU for codes the code 54 return to scanner again.

[Annddrriy]

I did double check all wiring connection between Transmission ECU and TPS and Engine ECU and TPS all wires connected same like in wiring diagram when I was checking first time I did check wrong way. The problem is in valve body some of the shift valve not shifting smooth still need to check that. The pressure line solenoid has adjustment screw. To make adjustments to pressure line solenoid to make gears shifting smoothly you have to remove automatic transmission oil pan many times to match it all spring in valve body to the right combination. Here’s the solution if you don’t want to remove automatic transmission oil pan. Anyway you have to remove one time only and then get fixed. You have to drill a hole in oil pan with alignment straight to adjust screw of pressure line solenoid then you will have excess to put long screwdriver through the oil pan hole and makes adjustments without removing oil pan. You have to weld special plug with thread that after you can put plug in the hole to block oil coming out from that hole. This job will save a lot time if you don’t want remove oil pan just for adjustment for pressure line solenoid.

[Annddrriy]

The one more think could be in wiring connection wrong between Transmission TCU pins 6 and 7 an 9 which is connected to the TPS pins 1 and 2 and 3. When checking voltage on TPS pin 1 there is 4.9v then when move throttle to full open voltage not increase and not decrease. Something is wrong connected to the Transmission TCU and TPS. Loks like TCU pin 9 and 7 wrong connected to the TPS pin 1 and 3

[Annddrriy]

I did check Throttle position Switch voltage bwtween pins 1 and 2 there was 4.5 volts same as in test measurements book and then checked at idle voltage between pins 2 and 3 there was 0.5 volts and checked full load between pins 2 and 3 it was 4.4 volts whitch is good. What could throw code 54 to the Engine ECU it could throw the code TPS wiring not connected right.

[Annddrriy]

BMW E32 735iA 02/1990 valve body harness plug which is connect to the transmission valve body has 8 wires but the valve body is with harness 7 wires so here is the think the transmission case 4hp22 don't take E-9 version of the valve body. 4hp22 it should take E-7 version of the valve body only. Transmission case 4hp24 fits to E-9 version.

[Annddrriy]

If to put E-7 version of E-9 version can two position program switch works with E-7 version or needs to change program switch with 3 position program switch ?

[shogun]

the 3 switches are different between early E-7, late E-7 and E-9, not interchangeable. Read the ATSG manual, it is explained on page 27 http://www.bmwe34.net/E34main/Troubl...ch%20Guide.pdf

Early "E-7" Models Only (5 Solenoid) - A rotary switch with three fixed positions and an indicator light in the instrument cluster for the 3-2-1 (M) mode when selected

Late "E-7" Models Only (5 Solenoid) - A three position slide switch with Digital display of the three individual positions in instrument cluster (E-S-M). The switch is a momentary contact and spring loaded to a neutral position.

"E-9" Models Only (4 Solenoid) - A two position slide switch for the "A" mode (Economy and "M" mode (Manual). The Sport mode is selected with the range selector in position 3, 2, or 1 and "A" mode selected. The switch is a momentary contact and spring loaded to a neutral position.

[Annddrriy]

If to put valve body Late E-7 version 5 solenoids then needs to put a three position slide switch with digital display of the three individual positions in instrument cluster E-S-M it will work ?

[Annddrriy]

The difference between E-7 and E-9 just one solenoid and one more wire has on pin 1 W/3 PS. W/2 PS pin 6 goes to TCU pin 10 which shifts A mode and W/3 PS pin 6 goes to TCU pin 4 and one more wire from PS pin 1 goes to TCU pin 14. The wire for reverse solenoid is already installed between TCU and valve body harness.

[shogun]

Instrument cluster will work with S-E-M switch.
I assume you need a complete correct wire loom when you switch from E-9 to E-7. Also probably a different transmission control unit.
Stay with your E-9 transmission, all is designed on your car for E-9.

[Annddrriy]

E-9 version don't fit to 22 case it fits to 24 case.

[Annddrriy]

The valve body E9 version sticking point holes to the 22 case where feed with ATF clutch pack is matching ?

[shogun]

There is no 4HP24 case, the housings of the 4HP22 and 4HP24 are the same + on the cast iron housings always 4HP22 is written on, no matter of the version is 4HP22 or 4HP24.

There are numerous changes between 4HP22 (used in for example E32 735) and 4HP24 (used on E32 750). First off
- Springs with different rates are incorporated
- the torque converter diameter is increased to 280 mm
- the bearing surface of the torque converter is longer to take the stronger loads
- the converter lockup clutch diameter is increased to 300mm
- the transmission bell housing is larger due to the increased converter size
- the A transfer plate is 15 mm wider in order to accept the larger a clutch
-the stator wheel shaft is now mounted with 6 countersunk screws for a tighter connection with the transfer plate
- a new pump body was designed for the longer converter shaft bearing
- the splines on the input shaft are longer
- both sealing rings on the input shaft are cast iron
- the A clutch has a larger diameter and the clutch friction surfaces are increased in size also
- the number of plates in the B,C and D clutches was increased by one inch each
- the one way clutch for 2nd gear has been strenghtened and riveted together
- the one-way clutch for 3rd gear was changed from a roller type to a locking body type for greater torque
- the planetary gear for 4 is much stronger now with forged webs
- the output shaft diameter is increased and 2 holes are provided for more lubrication
- the output flange has a larger bolt circle to take more force
-the pan is deeper
- the filter is different for the deeper pan = longer neck
- valve body plates gasket is different
- Last but not least, remember that early E32 have trannies with 8 pins connector and the other ones with 7 pins. My 11/88 750 has 8 pins.
As 4HP22 is also used in the Landrover V8 Defender, Range Rover Classic and the Disco 1 and these cars are usually handled very rough, there are special shops which enforce the 4HP22 with 4HP24 parts, here you can see the differences in the pics on the website of AshcroftTransmissions
quote
Heavy Duty ZF Autoboxes
We are able to supply the ZF4HP22 with optional strength upgrades depending what you are doing with the vehicle, what gearing, what engine etc.
Stage 1 Upgrade
We can build the 4HP22 but fit the centre section of the box with the bigger 4HP24 internals which upgrades one of the weak links being the C1/C2 one way clutch, the 24 one is much stronger, another part which gets upgrade is the Planetry Gearset, the solid 24 type being much stronger. Just the centre internals are changed so the box stays the same externally. This upgrade is an additional £250 on top of the normal rebuilt exchange price of £675 or £725, depending if the box is hydraulic or electronic.

Stage 2 Upgrade
The box can be built with both the 4HP24 internals as above but also the 24 front end as well giving you the added strength of having the larger 24 "A" clutch, also a weak point with larger engines. There are 2 fitting implications of doing this, the unit is 15mm longer and the oil cooler nipples are M18 x 1.5 thread, on the early 22"s these threads are M16 X 1.5, the later 22"s like the TD5"s are already M18. This upgrade is an additional £500 on top of the normal rebuilt exchange price of £675 or £725, depending if the box is hydraulic or electronic. Note the Stage 2 upgrade can be specified to accept the medium and the large type converter. We are often unable to offer the medium converter option due to availability problems but if you are considering the stage 2 upgrade then you are likely to want the large converter anyway for the reasons below.

Torque Converter Upgrades
The ZF auto as used in the LandRover vehicles uses three different diameters of torque converter. Small. Medium and Large. Small" is used on the 300 Tdi, P38 diesel and the TD5. "Medium" is used on the 3.9, 4.0 and the later 4.6 P38. "Large" is used on the early 4.6 P38"s. Note the large converter can only be used with the stage 2 as it will only fit the 4HP24 front end. A larger converter is desirable on a tuned engine for a few reasons :

1) Lower stall speed, there's little point in having a nice torque engine if the converter is not transferring the drive and you are revving straight past it. A larger converter will reduce these revs and allow you to take up drive earlier which results in much more relaxed driving. This is by far the biggest advantage of upgrading the converter. Note these reduced revs are not to be confused with lower gear shift points, these stay the same as they are determined by the autobox ECU programming.

2) Less heat generation because of the lower stall speed and reduced 'slip'.

3) The converter has a lock up clutch inside and the smaller one struggles to cope with a stock engine, never mind a tuned one. This clutch can slip as you accelerate when it should be staying locked. In a TD5 the stock converter is the small one. If you have a stock engine, stick with the stock converter. If the engine has a mild tune then we would recommend upgrading to the medium diameter one, we have sold quite a lot and get very good feedback.
This option is an additional £240 when ordered with an autobox or £315 exchange + £ 200 refundable core charge when ordered alone.

4.6+ V8's - We would recommend the stage 2 and the large converter with a 4.6 or more. To fit the large converter you will need the 4.6 boss and flexplate assy to match the bigger converter which we can supply at £175.
2.8 TGV to ZF
We would recommend the stage 2 and the large converter with the 2.8 TGV, When using this setup be sure to order the correct conversion kit to suit the large converter. The part number for this kit from Motor and Diesel Engineering in the UK is Kit '82E'. See below for additional notes on the 2.8.
TD5 ZF upgrades
If you are converting your TD5 Defender to auto you have a few options, I though it may be useful to give some guidance based on our experience. Stock 90/110, fine with a stock 4HP22 Medium Tuned 90, stock ZF, uprated converter Medium Tuned 110, stage 1 ZF, uprated converter Fully Tuned 90, stage 1 ZF, uprated converter Fully Tuned 110, stage 2 ZF, uprated converter Tuned Challenge 90, stage 2 ZF, uprated converter
2.8 International engine to ZF auto
The easiest way to fit a ZF to the 2.8 is to treat it as a 300 Tdi and fit the corresponding autobox from the 300 Disco but as this has the smaller diameter torque converter I would not recommend this set up. For the strongest set up I would suggest purchasing the 2.8 adapter kit made to fit the engine to the early P38 V8 ZF thus allowing you to use the largest diameter torque converter as you are now using the V8 bellhousing and use this in conjunction with the "stage 2" 4HP24 described above. We are now able to supply these kits at £595 and the 4HP24 autoboxes rebuilt, outright at £1550.

This means you now have the biggest converter which gives you the stronger lockup clutch, lower stall speed so it's not revving so much when you pull off (and thus less heat generation), with the 24 you have the stronger internals, this is the best box and converter setup and it can be run hydraulically but you are restricted to the shift points set by the box, to get the most out of the engine you can have this box built with electronic control and run it with the Compushift, this allows total control so you can make the vehicle drive perfectly.

Technical Information / FAQ's
A common problem with all ZF 4HP22/24 boxes is the failure of the one way "sprag" clutch. Once the cams in this one way sprag clutch "flip" the unit will slip both ways resulting in the vehicle only pulling off with the shifter in position "1" not "D" and driving OK when shifted up to position 2,3 and D until you stop then you need to pull it back to "1" to start off again. It is not feasible to change this unit in each rebuild as this one part is approx £400. By disassembling the "sealed unit" we were able to examine the profile of the cams and understand how they work, from here the challenge was to find another cam from another type of autobox that would fit and had the correct profile to make the unit stronger by not allowing the cams to flip. After quite a lot of searching we found one, "re-cammed" some of these clutches and thoroughly tested them, we have not had one fail since. This is an example of how we are able to use our engineering background to understand a problem and cost effectively make the unit stronger without having to raise our prices. We have also recently invested £20,000 in a "Hydra-Test" machine. This machine allows us to do 2 things. Firstly once the valve body has been rebuilt we are able to fit it to a plate on the test rig and run the valve body through its cycle with 45 deg pre-heated oil to simulate as close as we can get to "real world conditions" The hydraulic valve bodies are run through manually by winding a valve to simulate the governor increasing in speed and various pressure gauges are monitored to see that the valve body is applying the correct clutches at the correct pressures. When testing the electronic ZF valve bodies once the solenoids are all tested this cycling procedure can initially be run through manually to check all is well then the computer can run up to 100 full run cycles going from 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and lock up down to 1st again to ensure no valve are sticking and the solenoids are not failing when hot and working hard. As part of the test procedure we also fit a test plate to the autobox in place of the valve body and apply heated oil at pressure to check we have no leakage or pressure drop on any of the clutch packs.This machine has enabled us to improve the quality of our boxes by identifying any potential faults or problems before the box reaches the customer. unquote

[Annddrriy]

Your BMW 750i has 4hp24 Transmission center case where valve body a touch to that case. All 750 models has 24 Transmission center case I mean 4ph24 it has big torque converter and some internal parts a bit bigger that is why E 9 version is a last version for 750i and 750iL models which has big powerful engine M70.
735i and 735il has smaller engine that is why it has smaller transmission case is 22 I mean 4hp22 which is E7 version fit to that 22nd case. Do you agree ?

[Annddrriy]

I can exchange with your E7 version valve body if you want with my E9 version valve body which is going to run more smoothly then your E7 version. You sent me your E7 and I will send you my E9 version valve body if you have spare valve body E7. I have spare E9 version of the valve body.

[shogun]

The torque converter is not in the main housing, but in the bell housing. see a 4HP24 and what is shown in the cast above the ZF type tag, from an E31 850 ZF plate says 4HP24 1043 030 019 and above that in the cast of the housing you can clearly see 4HP22 https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-...44219-223-1745
https://img.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/api/v1/prod-ads/images/31/31a969cd-41f2-4af7-a715-9cb123d5b206?rule=$_57.JPG
the internals are partly different as described above, also torque converter and bell housing. I do not need your E-9 valve body,

[Annddrriy]

Yes I just say in general all part are bigger in 4hp24 the 24th center case is different of 22nd case isn't ?

[shogun]

See my list above what internal parts are different in size or strength, but all 24 parts fit into the same outer casing marked 4HP22, there are 3 different torque converters, different bell housings different part numbers for the valve bodies, the outer dimensions of the valve body plate gaskets are the same between 22 and 24, part numbers are different as the holes and channel holes are different etc
1043 328 080 4HP24
1043 326 161 4HP22
1043 326 162 4HP22
1043 326 232 4HP22
1043 326 253 4HP22

[Annddrriy]

Yes I just say in general all part are bigger in 4hp24 and the 24th center case is different of 22nd case isn't ? 735i and 735iL can't take 24th case and 750i and 750iL can't take 22nd case. Same thing with E7 version and E9 version. All E7 version goes to 735i and 735iL models only and E9 version goes to 750i and 750iL models only.

[shogun]

The main outer (center) casing is the same for 4HP22 and 4HP24! again the link for a 4HP24 where you see the casing marked 4HP22 https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-...44219-223-1745 Difference of internal parts see my post 419, that are enforcement parts to match higher Nm of the M70 engine.

[Annddrriy]

What is different between those two cases 24 and 22 ? Transmission case 24 has bigger sprag gear inside and has wider case. Maybe longer also if case wider then ATF oil feeding holes for clutch pack relocated a bit a side no same like in 22nd case then E7 version and E9 version channel plate is different where is sticking point to the Transmission case.

[Annddrriy]

We are talking about the sprag gear inside the transmission senter case. If sprag gear inside bigger then case wider.

[Annddrriy]

Screenshot_20211105-053009.png20211101_194301.jpgthe valve bodies, the outer dimensions of the valve body plate gaskets are the same between 22nd and 24th I mean other side also same but oil atf holes is in different places.