540i Noise - Vanos, Timing Chain Tensioner or Timing Chain Guides?

**FJS407** · 08-13-2021, 03:34 AM

I've been noticing a strange noise in my car
In my searches, i've found couple of videos with a similar noise but never exactly the same (I guess)

Everytime I search there are 3 options: Vanos, Timing Chain Tensioner or Timing Chain Guides
I'm trying to found the problem before take to repair cause im my country, its normal to find overpriced parts (like 2 or 3 times of the original price compared to ebay).
For example, on Ebay a timing chain kit its like 300 dollars, if I try to buy here it will be 1k or more

Its a intermitent sound but seems its getting more frequent.

Starts at 0:01, stops at 0:16 and starts again at 0:20

Can you guys tell me what is the problem?

Thank you!

**TiesTorN** · 08-13-2021, 03:44 AM

sounds like your chain tensioners are going out so chain is rubbing the guides.

**taz.** · 08-13-2021, 06:42 AM

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**FJS407** · 08-13-2021, 10:55 AM

Originally Posted by taz.

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?

**taz.** · 08-13-2021, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by FJS407

?

Pocket post... couldn't delete it so I just edited to that. Not familiar with the m62, so I couldn't be of help.

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**FJS407** · 08-13-2021, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by TiesTorN

sounds like your chain tensioners are going out so chain is rubbing the guides.

I'm going to buy a new tensioner on ebay
Unfortunately it will take a month to arrive

Today I didn't notice the noise
Apparently the problem appears if I don't use the car for some days

**FJS407** · 11-21-2021, 12:38 AM

The old spring it was completely useless but I've replaced the tensioner and the noise gets worse
My mechanic said "dont worry, its more scary than serious. It can be the guides or vanos, but don't worry and keep driving normally"

**JimLev** · 11-21-2021, 12:46 AM

I’d stop driving it now and start taking it apart.
It sounds terrible.

**FJS407** · 11-21-2021, 01:14 AM

I was surprised by what he said...
And now I don't know what to do.
This is one of the best workshops available here.
They've been fixing BMWs since the 70s. I certainly wasn't the first to come up with a problem like that.

**Chedley** · 11-21-2021, 05:09 AM

When you replaced the tensioner from Ebay, did you check its spring ?? Can you pull it, you should be able to press it to extend it by hand. Post a pic. Replace the spring: get a stronger and longer spring from a hardware store.
But yes, if the tensioner does not fix the rattling noise, then it is probably time to start planning for the big job : guides and vanos.

**R Shaffner** · 11-21-2021, 09:14 AM

It does sound bad, but it's hard to ID much from a video.

The tensioner works by oil pressure, not the spring. When they fail it's because they get clogged inside. Has the oil used been the right type, and changed often? Is it full?

Can you tell where the noise is coming from? First, you can disconnect the belts and run it, briefly, to make sure the noise isn't from a belt-driven component. Also, you can use something long and metal, like a long socket extension, to listen to different parts of the engine. Put one end to your ear and the other end to different parts of the engine. I'd try to listen to different parts of both cam covers and the timing chain covers. (Be careful! Make sure to keep the end of the metal piece away from moving parts of the engine.)

And finally, a good mechanic should be able to tell you what the noise is before telling you to ignore it. If he hasn't you should take it to another mechanic.

**JimLev** · 11-21-2021, 03:04 PM

Drop the lower oil pan and see how many pieces of the guides are in it.

**Chedley** · 11-21-2021, 07:41 PM

^^ +1
The ultimate test for broken timing chain guides: Drop the lower oil pan and see if there are any pieces of broken plastic in there.?
If none, the guides are still ok. Reinstall and replace the oil pan gasket, and pour your in your preferred engine oil.

**capebmw** · 11-26-2021, 09:43 PM

You can ignore it, which it sounds like your on the path to do, or take advice from people here who know these cars and are very familiar with this noise. It is most definitely your guides and with it that noisey you are very close to a failure . Drive it at your own risk, but I can assure you it will be a catastrophic fairly soon. And the shop probably knows how expensive it is to repair and they just don't want to do it.

**FJS407** · 11-29-2021, 12:43 AM

I'll not take the risk...
I'm already searching for the parts.

In ECS site they have some replacement lists (https://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E39-54...ing_Chain_Kit/)
Some have just the guides and the tensioners others have even the "Differential Drain Plug Gasket".

It's really necessary to replace all these components (https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...1311435026kt1/) or I can go for a more "basic list" (https://www.ecstuning.com/b-assemble...1311704945kt3/ )?

I'm asking before buy cause due to exchange rate and the taxes, at the end i'll pay 7x the USD value, so its better dont be wrong.

And... Thanks for the help!

**capebmw** · 11-29-2021, 07:37 AM

This one seems more than adequate
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-assemble...1311435026kt3/

Originally Posted by FJS407

I'll not take the risk...
I'm already searching for the parts.
This one seems more than adequate
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-assemble...1311435026kt3/

In ECS site they have some replacement lists (https://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E39-54...ing_Chain_Kit/)
Some have just the guides and the tensioners others have even the "Differential Drain Plug Gasket".

It's really necessary to replace all these components (https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...1311435026kt1/) or I can go for a more "basic list" (https://www.ecstuning.com/b-assemble...1311704945kt3/ )?

I'm asking before buy cause due to exchange rate and the taxes, at the end i'll pay 7x the USD value, so its better dont be wrong.

And... Thanks for the help!

**philly98540** · 11-29-2021, 08:30 AM

In most cases replacing these parts is NOT needed:

Camshaft timing chain tensioners with retaining clips: Most re-sue existing. Just buy the plastic shoes and put onto your existing tensioners. replace the sealing o-rings.
Timing chain. Most old chains measure up just fine and don't need replacing.
Cylinder head timing chains. Same.

Drop the lower oil pan and look for plastic bits. Do this before you buy anything. Make sure to look in the oil pump suction screen too. Bits can be hiding in there. Most guys do the valley pan while doing this job. Add those parts if that has not been done.

**Chedley** · 11-29-2021, 02:04 PM

Also include the oil separator, and the oil tube /connectors connecting the separator to CCV at back of manifold.
These are really not needed for the guides job per se, but cheap parts that are a PITA to remove and replace. So you might as well replace them "while you are there"...
Replace also any O-ring or gasket in sight.

**CPHES** · 11-29-2021, 03:34 PM

This guy is in Brazil - not sure he has access to parts as easily.

**FJS407** · 12-01-2021, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by CPHES

This guy is in Brazil - not sure he has access to parts as easily.

You're right.
Its almost impossible to find a Camshaft Tensioner, for example. The only one I saw, was like 300$.
The viable way to do the job and not pay the value of the car in parts is to import components on ebay.
Our "IRS" equivallent don't inspect all the boxes (principally the small and light ones) so, sometimes, i'll not pay the 60% import duty.

**DrCharles** · 12-03-2021, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by Chedley

^^ +1
The ultimate test for broken timing chain guides: Drop the lower oil pan and see if there are any pieces of broken plastic in there.?
If none, the guides are still ok. Reinstall and replace the oil pan gasket, and pour your in your preferred engine oil.

Ist it possible that a reasonably well-maintained M62 can wear the guides sufficiently to start making noise (like mine at 190K) without chunks of plastic falling into the pan? My noise sounds exactly like OP's but not as loud. I haven't dropped the pan yet - the front covers have to come off to investigate anyway, and at that mileage the guides are well due for replacement.

**FJS407** · 01-12-2022, 07:07 PM

The Auto Parts online, Parts & Accessories catalog, Carparts store - Cars245.com, is legit?
Most of parts are cheaper in this page than in "start245" store on eBay. Are they really the same store?

**FJS407** · 06-15-2022, 11:37 PM

I replaced the chains, guides and rebuild the Vanos and the engine sounds like new.

The mechanic who did the service sent me a video about the condition of the guides and they had not broken.
Only the center guide was worn out but still in place.

According to him, all the frightening noise came from Vanos.

To make sure I don't have any future problems I chose to replace everything that was in the way, I used an ECS Tuning parts list for the full service.

Next and final problem (hopefully) to solve: my auxiliary fan has decided to stop working. I've read a lot on the forum and I'm thinking about buying a new one.

**JimLev** · 06-15-2022, 11:42 PM

^_have you checked the connector and the fuse?

**FJS407** · 06-16-2022, 12:02 AM

Originally Posted by JimLev

^_have you checked the connector and the fuse?

Yea!

Also according to the mechanic, the signal to activate the fan is being sent and the fuse is good.

He even changed the fan for another one (used), but as we couldn't test it in another car, to see if this one works, I suspect it's also broken...
With the previous fan the problem was intermittent.

I've seen that there are several similar cases but I'm completely new to electrical issues.
I don't even know if there is a way to test the current of the wires (to rule out the possibility of a broken wire). Time to search in the forum...