Faster more reactive steering for E31 and E34

[Rich8]

Quick Arms $648
This is a new and exciting item coming to the market place to give your e31 and E34 more responsive steering. Some would describe it as: “CSi + steering”.

From the driving seat, you will immediately appreciate the swift response to steering wheel; the road wheels will turn more for the same steering wheel input.

MANY E31 owners have other BMW’s or high performance cars, and after driving the 8, they feel that the steering is slow and a little numb. These new arms go a long way to addressing this problem. These are a simple replacement for the stock steering arm, and they are inexpensive, simple and effective.
Following installation of the plates, a professional alignment is required.

Here are pictures

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/w2kkrc43v...vraNFisRa?dl=0

PM me or call/text at 623 570 2777

[PhenielG]

Hello Rich, the link is broken.

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

[jdrbling325IS]

Link works for me. I’m super interested. I’m about to replace my thruster arm bushings with the Turner bushings and am wanting some better steering. What other data do you have on these?

[Rich8]

We have been developing these arms for several months, and have been running them on 3 cars for some time with great results and feedback.
The response to steering wheel input is more urgent now, so better direction change with less hand movement.

Update, we have now installed these Quick Arms on 9 cars and all owners love it.

[Rich8]

The large rubber bushing on the front upper control arm where it mounts to the chassis has always been a weak link on the E31, E32 & E39 because it wears quickly and then badly affects the braking, steering and handling. Changing to the Wokke monoballs is a GREAT upgrade and if your rubber bushings were old, then you notice a huge improvement overall in the front end and it does make the steering FEEL more direct, but it does not MAKE the steering quicker. The stock steering speed and response is what I have addressed here with the new Quick Arms.

We have been developing these arms for several months, and have been running them on 3 cars for some time with great results and feedback.
The response to steering wheel input is more urgent now, so better direction change with less hand movement.


Changing to these new steering arms is quite simple and they install very quickly.....disconnect 3 ball joints and then undo the 3 bolts that hold the arm to the bottom of the strut. then bolt in the new arms.

I have made these new arms shorter from the bottom of the strut to where the steering rod attaches. So if you move the steering wheel a certain amount, then these new arms will move the road wheel further than before.....you will get a quicker response to steering wheel inputs.

After installing these new arms, you will have to reset the front toe alignment.


When you first drive this change, it will give the impression of a much sportier car, more nimble and more reactive. After 20 or 30 miles driving in corners, you will become quite accustomed to the new feel, and maybe take it for granted that the car feels more nimble. I guarantee that if you then changed back to your old arms, you would be quite disappointed how slow and numb the steering feels.

When BMW built the hi-performance 850CSi, they wanted quicker steering response, and they got it by installing a quicker ratio steering box. My friend went down this route, hunting for 2 years before he found someone selling a CSi steering box (they are more rare than hen's teeth). Then it took the two of us almost a full day to get his box out and the CSi one in. but after driving my car, he wants to go through all the trouble to take his CSi box out and install the Quick Arms, then sell his box.....he will make money and have better steering

The Quick Arms are a little quicker than the CSi, so this puts the CSi at about 2/3 of the difference between the stock and my steering. As I mentioned above, the first impression is that this new steering is quite a bit quicker, but you get used to that very soon.


Here is a link to pictures of the arms in Dropbox

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/w2kkrc43v...vraNFisRa?dl=0

[Rich8]

Quick Arms $648
This is a new and exciting item coming to the market place to give your e31 and E34 more responsive steering. Some would describe it as: “CSi + steering”.

From the driving seat, you will immediately appreciate the swift response to steering wheel; the road wheels will turn more for the same steering wheel input.

MANY E31 owners have other BMW’s or high performance cars, and after driving the 8, they feel that the steering is slow and a little numb. These new arms go a long way to addressing this problem. These are a simple replacement for the stock steering arm, and they are inexpensive, simple and effective.
Following installation of the plates, a professional alignment is required.

By the way, these Quick Arms will also fit the E32 and E34

Here are pictures

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/w2kkrc43v...vraNFisRa?dl=0

PM me or call/text at 623 570 2777

The large rubber bushing on the front upper control arm where it mounts to the chassis has always been a weak link on the E31, E32 & E39 because it wears quickly and then badly affects the braking, steering and handling. Changing to the Wokke monoballs is a GREAT upgrade and if your rubber bushings were old, then you notice a huge improvement overall in the front end and it does make the steering FEEL more direct, but it does not MAKE the steering quicker. The stock steering speed and response is what I have addressed here with the new Quick Arms.

We have been developing these arms for several months, and have been running them on 3 cars for some time with great results and feedback.
The response to steering wheel input is more urgent now, so better direction change with less hand movement.


Changing to these new steering arms is quite simple and they install very quickly.....disconnect 3 ball joints and then undo the 3 bolts that hold the arm to the bottom of the strut. then bolt in the new arms.

I have made these new arms 0.625" shorter from the bottom of the strut to where the steering rod attaches. So if you move the steering wheel a certain amount, then these new arms will move the road wheel further than before.....you will get a quicker response to steering wheel inputs.

After installing these new arms, you will have to reset the front toe alignment.


When you first drive this change, it will give the impression of a much sportier car, more nimble and more reactive. After 20 or 30 miles driving in corners, you will become quite accustomed to the new feel, and maybe take it for granted that the car feels more nimble. I guarantee that if you then changed back to your old arms, you would be quite disappointed how slow and numb the steering feels.

When BMW built the hi-performance 850CSi, they wanted quicker steering response, and they got it by installing a quicker ratio steering box. My friend went down this route, hunting for 2 years before he found someone selling a CSi steering box (they are more rare than hen's teeth). Then it took the two of us almost a full day to get his box out and the CSi one in. but after driving my car, he wants to go through all the trouble to take his CSi box out and install the Quick Arms, then sell his box.....he will make money and have better steering

The Quick Arms are a little quicker than the CSi, so this puts the CSi at about 2/3 of the difference between the stock and my steering. As I mentioned above, the first impression is that this new steering is quite a bit quicker, but you get used to that very soon.


Here is a link to pictures of the arms in Dropbox

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/w2kkrc43v...vraNFisRa?dl=0

[theBMWbeast]

Are these steering arms the same size and thickness of stock?
I have AKG 1” bump steer plates, and would want to retain those if I installed these.
Very interested in testing these steering arms out. All my suspension is new, even my steering box is a ZF rebuild with servotronic (disabled currently). And I have a 370mm diameter wheel. I love the weight and feel, but a quicker ratio effect that these arms seemingly give sounds like a good upgrade. I’m gonna have to drive my car spiritedly and make my mind up on if the cost is worth it.

What material are the steering arms made out of? Longest amount of time a test car/ customer has had them installed? Paired with lowered suspension or shorter shocks on any of these cars? Safety/reliability of this part is obviously crucial to me, my suspension doesn’t have an easy life on these LA streets. Thanks!

[m60power]

This is very interesting. Quite a clever way to quicken the steering ratio without changing the box. I too looked into an 850csi steering box but later found out it isn't a direct bolt in to my e32 740.

Besides the difference in length from the strut center to the steering tie rod connection point, is all other geometry the same as stock? By that I mean - are the connection points for the upper and lower control arms to the steering arm the same position in 'X', 'Y' and 'Z' 3D dimensional space as the stock steering arm? (Don't want to mess up the stock control arm angles and geometry). Obviously the steering outer tie rod is closer to the center of the strut (for the faster steering), but is its connection point vertical height the same as stock, as to not affect bump steer geometry on compression?

Also what specific material /product form are these machined from? If they are aluminum, what type/temper/product form, etc.?

Edit - The steering arm p/n for the E32 and E34 is the same, however it looks like the E31 p/n is different. Do you know if there are any dimensional differences between the two?

[Rich8]

I will try to answer both M60Power and theBMWBeast here.
All dimensions are the same as stock except the distance from the base of the strut to the steering rod attachment is a little shorter. The thickness where you have your bumpsteer plates is still the same, no change there.
The material is Structural Steel and has been clear Zinc coated to stop rust and corrosion.
We thought of using Aluminum, but for several reasons we went with the steel, which by the way is the same material as BMW use.......the difference is that BMW forged their part and we machine from billet....they have some softer corners where ours are a little more pronounced. If anything, I would say our part is stronger, tougher than the BMW part.
The over-riding consideration on our part was safety and second to that was perception and performance. The Structural steel is stronger than Aluminum, and is generally perceived as that. So while it is heavier than Aluminum, we will accept that for these reasons mentioned

theBMWBeast, I assume that you went with a smaller than stock steering wheel to get quicker steering, and normally I would say that going back to the larger stock steering wheel would be better when using our Quick Arms, but if you activate the servotronic on your steering box, you will have the perfect set up. Obviously, we had to make the arms assuming that people would have their stock steering box and steering wheel.
As I mention in my description of these arms, your initial feel is that the car is more nimble and reactive, BUT after driving for 30 minutes, you will be used to the reaction and enjoy you driving even more. You said you want to go out and 'evaluate your car, and I'm sure with all the work you have put into the front end, it will feel better, just like adding a pair of our arms will make it feel better again.
I have been running the prototype on my E31 for 7 months, and we have had the production item on 2 cars for 2-3 months with no issues. My car has been lowered and has the 13mm bump steer plates installed, and we also have a set of arms on a bone stock E31.

I would like to mention that it is very important to have the front Toe alignment reset, and I suggest 1.5 Toe-In MAX on each wheel. If you have toe-out or more toe-in, the handling will not be as nice as 1.5mm Toe-In. These arms will not affect the camber, caster or Achermann

[bdiefAZ]

We tested another 97 850 today with the new arms, the car reacted very well to this mod. Faster steering response can easily be felt from the driver seat.

[Rich8]

I have just lowered the cost of these Quick Arms to $648
Machines from billet Structural steel, clear zinc coated for rust and corrosion protection
same bolt on thickness as stock
same Achermann as stock
just shorter for quicker steering reaction.

[stilljester]

Impressive work! I have to plead a bit of my ignorance when it comes to steering geometry...What's the trade-off or downside with this modification?

[sugaki]

Does it make the steering more darty, having to correct more to stay straight?

[Rich8]

Impressive work! I have to plead a bit of my ignorance when it comes to steering geometry...What's the trade-off or downside with this modification?

I would not call it a trade-off, but you may feel the steering effort is VERY slightly heavier, but I like this because it gives me more feed back.....certainly not a problem.
Your very first impression is WOW, lot better steering, but after 20-30 miles you will be use to it and loving it.

[Rich8]

Does it make the steering more darty, having to correct more to stay straight?

No, it does not make the steering more darty.

As for having to correct to stay straight, this will not change; if you have loose joints in your steering system now and have to correct on the straight, then this will remain (it won't fix any issues like this) but if your system is tight, then there will not be any change there.

The caster in the suspension setup is what makes the car track straight, and these Quick Arms do not alter any of the suspension geometry, except to shorten the length of the steering arm.....there will be no camber, caster, Achermann, kingpin angle changes when you add these arms.

And before I get hit with people telling me about my comment "caster being what makes the car track straight", let me preface this by saying I'm making some assumptions here......I assume your tire sizes and pressures are the same side to side, and I'm assuming your alignment is all equal side to side.

If you have more camber on one side or if the Toe is different side to side (ESPECIALLY in the rear) then these things will make the car track badly. If the Toe is different side to side on the front end, then you will feel this as the steering wheel is not centered when driving down a straight road.

[Layne]

Nice product!

If I recall correctly from comparing them a long time ago, E24/E28 steering arms were exactly the same as E32/E34, except for the size of the key on top that engages the strut housing. You could very likely make one small change and increase your market dramatically.

[Rich8]

More Explanation about these arms. This is probably not necessary for about 75% of people reading this, but for that other 25% I would like to explain, in basic terms, what is happening with these Quick Arms.
By shortening the distance from the base of the strut out to where the tie-rod attaches, we have done two things......for the same input in the steering wheel, we are now moving the road wheels quicker and further. Caster is what is giving the steering the ability to 'self center' and when the wheels are pointing straight ahead, you have the most self centering effect, and when you are at full lock you have the least.....imagine if you could turn the road wheels until they were at 90 degrees to the forward direction, you would have zero self centering.

When you are maneuvering in the driveway or parking lot, you are using a LOT of steering, but when you are out on the road, you almost never turn the steering wheel more than 90 degrees (usually 45 degrees or less). I would like you to go out to your car in the garage or driveway and turn the steering wheel 90 degrees, then get out and look at how much the road wheels have turned.....its about 5-8 degrees !! When you are driving down your favorite twisty road, you are moving the steering wheel about 45 degrees so about 3-5 degrees road wheel.

As I mentioned, when you move the steering wheel, you get more travel at the road wheel, SO if you turn your steering wheel to full lock, and because the tire is moving further, there is a slight chance that it will touch the inner fender.......just because it is there, you do not have to turn the steering wheel that far and get 35 degrees !! USE SOME COMMON SENSE (By the way, if you do use this 35 degrees with these Quick Arms, you will be blown away by how tight the turning circle is, you can easily turn a U-turn in the street outside your house).

I'm sorry if this is a little long winded, but we have had a customer who cannot grasp the concept that when you turn the steering wheel it moves the road wheel, and when you make this arm shorter, it moves the road wheels further.
In reality, when you drive down that favorite road, you will not be wanting to use any more road wheel angle than before, but it is nice when the reaction to steering is quicker....duh!

As I said, 75% of you will already understand this, but some of the comments I get really surprise me.

[Rich8]

..

[e30m3_78rus]

@Rich8

Does this change the bumpsteer relative to stock arms?

[uscharalph]

Interesting

[Excoriar]

I'm interested, but will the faster response result in unwanted faster response at high speeds?

[goodnight1985]

Im definitely interested in these arms, but has anyone installed these? Any independent testing?

[bdiefAZ]

I have tried everything possible over the years to improve the steering response on my 850. It was always a letdown to me when driving other cars, including my truck and other BMW's that have more responsive steering than my e31. To be clear, the steering system in my car was in good working order, no slack, just very slow steering that required high amounts of steering wheel input compared to my other cars.

In a quest for better steering bushings were replaced, some replaced with spherical joints, sway bars were upgraded, springs, shocks, as well as camber plates were installed. Chassis improvements were immediately felt with these modifications. Overall the chassis said yes, but the steering said - OK... I found a CSI steering box and installed it into the car, that was a big improvement, but still not quite there, more was needed....

I had been working with Stefan for quite some time on suspension and other mechanical upgrades on the e31 and e39's - disclaimer - we are partners in several products for sale, including these Quick Arms.

Stefan and I both drove his prototype QuickArms and we test drove the car that he had been running prototypes on for over a year. This led to the production of the current version. We even tested and measured steering reaction on the Stock 97 840, 93 with CSI box, and the Quick Arms equipped car.

The CSI steering box was removed from the car and we installed the standard steering box with the Quick Arms on my 1993 850. I could not be happier with the result, my car steers like it should have from the factory. Recent trips around the state of Arizona included interstate driving, mountain canyons, and various state routes. All types of driving were improved, responsive on curves, stable at speed, not twitchy - what we expect from an e31.

Anybody want to buy a CSI steering box?!

[Rich8]

Small price increase

These Quick Arms have been flying off the shelf, and another new batch has just come in.
Unfortunately, the material and machine costs have gone up, so we are forced to raise the cost for a pair of arms up to $648.
We hate to do this, and although our main objective with this produce was always to give a fantastic upgrade to our E31, E32 & E34 communities, we have to cover our costs. We cannot continue to sell them at a loss.
Again, we are very sorry, and hopefully our continued availability to answer any questions on the QA's and any E31 suspension questions, helps justify your investment.
If you PM us, we will give out a phone number to contact us.

[tortexal]

We hate to do this, and although our main objective with this produce was always to give a fantastic upgrade to our E31, E32 & E34 communities, we have to cover our costs. We cannot continue to sell them at a loss.

Breh, idk what you're selling exactly but don't apologize for this. You need to eat and stay in business otherwise parts availability for us approaches zero which is far worse for everyone than a price increase. As our cars approach 35 years old in some cases we're entirely dependent upon small businesses in order to be able to preserve and enjoy these things.

edit: interesting idea to re-engineer the steering plate I'm sure it solves lots of problems for lots of people.