What aftermarket springs are compatible with OE Sachs shocks?

[cypher448]

Refreshing my suspension on my 95 M3 and already bought Sachs struts. What I thought were stock used springs for said model appear to be wrong according to my mechanic who installed them. I can’t find OEM springs anymore and my backup choice, the eibach pro kit, also looks discontinued. I’m left with H&R but haven’t seen anybody else using these with Sachs. If I could do it all over again I just would’ve gotten KW Coilovers, but since I’m past that point I Just want to find a properly compatible spring. The car is just for everyday street driving.

[nick325xit 5spd]

The H&Rs are a little too much for the stock shocks. I would keep looking for the stock springs. Also, if you bought a set of '96+ OE springs, you can just swap spring hats on the strut mounts.

[cypher448]

yea that's what I think I remember reading in forums posts. I called up TC Kline and they suggested the H&R "OE Sport" Springs which I guess are different than the H&R "Sport" Springs and give a half inch drop rather than a one inch drop or something like that. They said they were great springs and pretty forgiving for the street but they never really ran them with OE shocks so I'm a little unsure. I looked into Dinan springs but I assumed those are just re-branded Eibach or HR and were normally used with Dinan/Koni shocks that are part of their package.

I originally bought what I thought were OE springs off ebay, but when the mechanic installed them, the car sat way too high with positive camber... he suggested they might've been mislabelled or something. Lesson learned with ebay used part purchases. Now I just want to get something quickly from a reliable vender that I know will work with the Sachs struts I already have.

[timboogeyman]

Refreshing my suspension on my 95 M3 and already bought Sachs struts. What I thought were stock used springs for said model appear to be wrong according to my mechanic who installed them. I can’t find OEM springs anymore and my backup choice, the eibach pro kit, also looks discontinued. I’m left with H&R but haven’t seen anybody else using these with Sachs. If I could do it all over again I just would’ve gotten KW Coilovers, but since I’m past that point I Just want to find a properly compatible spring. The car is just for everyday street driving.

In a similar predicament. Between going Sachs on HR sport or going Bilstein on HR race. Very curious how the Sachs w/ HR sports go. Will be following. Good luck.

[bluptgm3]

Dinan and H&R OE Sports are very similar in the amount of drop and ride quality. I have cars on both, though Dinan on Bilstein and H&R OE Sports on Koni, both are different than OE.
I suspect you would be safe running either Dinan and H&R OE Sports with OE/OEM struts/shocks, though not recommended.
I have seen reports the H&R OE Sports are the same rate as H&R Sports.
Having a taller ride height I’m not sure how that can be understanding spring design.


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[nick325xit 5spd]

yea that's what I think I remember reading in forums posts. I called up TC Kline and they suggested the H&R "OE Sport" Springs which I guess are different than the H&R "Sport" Springs and give a half inch drop rather than a one inch drop or something like that. They said they were great springs and pretty forgiving for the street but they never really ran them with OE shocks so I'm a little unsure. I looked into Dinan springs but I assumed those are just re-branded Eibach or HR and were normally used with Dinan/Koni shocks that are part of their package.

I originally bought what I thought were OE springs off ebay, but when the mechanic installed them, the car sat way too high with positive camber... he suggested they might've been mislabelled or something. Lesson learned with ebay used part purchases. Now I just want to get something quickly from a reliable vender that I know will work with the Sachs struts I already have.

The OE Sports are exactly the same rate as the regular Sports, just taller.

The Dinan springs are supposedly 150lbs. in front, vs. 200lbs. for the H&Rs and 105lbs. for stock. I think that they are probably the closest solution. Note that on a '95, you will need to use the later M3 perch. The Dinan rears are supposed to be pretty similar to the H&Rs. (Note that I can't guarantee the accuracy of these rates, they are just what has been circulating for ages.)

I think that the Dinan springs are your best bet for a likely acceptable solution.

Spring -> Front Rate -> Rear Rate

Stock E36 M3 ->105 ->335
LTW E36 M3 ->138 ->402
Eibach Pro Kit M3 ->148 ->428
Sachs M3 coilovers ->215 ->395
H&R 29910 (Sport) ->200 -> 380
H&R 29910 DTM(Race) -> 345 ->515
H&R Coilover ->340 -> 380
Dinan ->150 ->400

[cypher448]

So I called Dinan earlier today and the rep, think his name was Miller, said that their springs were NOT rebranded but made in house (which surprised me) and that they were designed to work with both their own Dinan/Koni shocks and with the stock Sachs shocks. Which echoes was what nick mentioned. I mentioned I was particularly worried about compatibility because my old Sachs shocks started leaking at 20K miles on them, possibly due to the previous owner putting on lowering springs, but he was pretty adamant that they would work out fine.

https://www.dinancars.com/products/s...arts/D100-0468

Found a comparison of spring rates on one of the old posts here:

http://www.uucmotorwerks.com/html_te..._m3_spring.htm

[nick325xit 5spd]

It is worth noting that spring testers are usually not able to give accurate results on progressive springs because they don't have the ability to compress far enough. (See wonky readings on the rear springs.) '95 front springs are linear. Note that the Dinan '95 springs are discontinued.

- - - Updated - - -

This is expensive, but these springs have the correct markings for a '95 M3: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1995-1999-B...temCondition=4

[bluptgm3]

It is worth noting that spring testers are usually not able to give accurate results on progressive springs because they don't have the ability to compress far enough. (See wonky readings on the rear springs.) '95 front springs are linear. Note that the Dinan '95 springs are discontinued.

Ya, the front springs of both the 1995M3 and 1996+M3 are effectively linear with the 1996+M3 being slightly less so and are a little stiffer due to the tighter upper winding.

The upper winding leading into the ‘hat’ decreases in diameter.
On the H&R / Dinan front springs, the coils are are not constantly spaced the full length of the spring, with spacing of the lower 3~4 coils more closely spaced. Effectively, there are three different springs linked.

I did not think there was a Dinan spring set for 1995M3 , but there seems to be.
Additionally, the 1996+M3 set fits the 1995M3 by using the 1996+M3 upper perch/‘hat’ and spring pad, or vice versa.
The ‘bee-hive’ shape of the rear spring makes them a multi/progressive rate spring.

Conversely, the H&R website application list for the 1996+M3 indicates “large front hat” or the 1995M3 upper spring perch/spring pad.
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[KimoSabe]

I have about 3-4k on my Sach/H&R OE Sports. Previously had Koni yellows with the OE Sports. While not as compliant as the Konis on hard cornering, the Sach/OE Sport combo is perfectly fine for street driving.

[cypher448]

Yep, the guys at Turner Motorsport mentioned the H&R OEs need the different perch for 96+ cars but will work as is with 95s, which I have. Interestingly enough the rep at Turner said that H&R OE Sport Springs were initially developed as a "mistake" because they found it didn't really lower the car, but people liked the initial run that they produced that they kept making them.

Thank you KimoSabe, that's good to know!

[blckstrm]

Yep, the guys at Turner Motorsport mentioned the H&R OEs need the different perch for 96+ cars but will work as is with 95s, which I have. Interestingly enough the rep at Turner said that H&R OE Sport Springs were initially developed as a "mistake" because they found it didn't really lower the car, but people liked the initial run that they produced that they kept making them.

Thank you KimoSabe, that's good to know!

Yeah, you need 95 top mounts for the fronts for the OE Sports- that's the only way they make them.

They make both versions for the Sport and the Race springs.

[bluptgm3]

Yeah, you need 95 top mounts for the fronts for the OE Sports- that's the only way they make them.

They make both versions for the Sport and the Race springs.

To be clear this is generally a reference to the upper spring perch/‘hat’.
A “top mount” is a reference to a strut mount, bearing plate, or in BMW speak Guide Support.

95 M3 Spring “Hat” Upr Spring Perch
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227348
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31331128523

96+ M3 Spring “Hat” Upr Spring Perch
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227903
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31332227902
Canadian cars SPRING PAD UPR 9MM 31332227901

This is seldom talked about, but a small amount of camber can be gained on a 1995M3 by using the 1996+M3 Guide Supports, swapped L-R / R-L.

95 M3
L/R GUIDE SUPPORT 31332228345

96+ M3
LH GUIDE SUPPORT 31332227897
RH GUIDE SUPPORT 31332227898


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[nick325xit 5spd]

To be clear this is generally a reference to the upper spring perch/‘hat’.
A “top mount” is generally a reference to a strut mount, bearing plate, or in BMW speak Guide Support.

95 M3 Spring “Hat” Upr Spring Perch
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227348
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31331128523

96+ M3 Spring “Hat” Upr Spring Perch
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227903
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31332227902
Canadian cars SPRING PAD UPR 9MM 31332227901

This is seldom talked about, but a small amount of camber can be gained on a 1995M3 by using the 1996+M3 Guide Supports, swapped L-R / R-L.

95 M3
L/R GUIDE SUPPORT 31332228345

96+ M3
LH GUIDE SUPPORT 31332227897
RH GUIDE SUPPORT 31332227898


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By small, you mean significant amount of camber. Also, you can swap the hats on any M3. You just have to buy new ones for the '95.

[realjones]

I have had Dinans on OEM Sachs for years with no issues. Gives a little bit of a drop, but not really noticeable if that is the look you want.

[bluptgm3]

By small, you mean significant amount of camber. Also, you can swap the hats on any M3. You just have to buy new ones for the '95.

The 1995M3 has a single p/n for the upper spring perch (or ‘hat’) as does the 1996+M3.

.

Yes you can swap all M3 Guide Supports, the left side-to-the-right side, the right side-to-the-left side (L-R/R-L).
The Guide Supports on a 1995M3 adds caster however offers no added camber and there is no camber gain achieved by swapping L-R/R-L.

In image -
Left side - LH side Offset 1996+M3 GS.
Two GS p/ns: one for LH; one for RH.
Right side - Centered 1995M3 GS (used both LH/RH sides) One GS p/n for both L / R.

This image is of an installed 1995M3 centered GS



The 1996+M3 Guide Support replicates 1995M3 caster and effectively removes camber by standing the strut more upright (when looking straight on from the front), the redesigned 1996+M3 King Pin adds ‘inclination’. So swapping the 1996+M3 Guide Supports (GS) L-R/R-L adds double what was removed by moving the bearing location outboard as part of the 1996+M3 geometry redesign.
This image is a right 1996+M3 GS swapped in to left side strut tower.


On a 1995M3 replacing the ‘95M3 centered GSs with a 1996+M3 offset GSs ‘swapped’ - moving from centered position to inboard position - adds half the camber gain that can be achieved when swapping the 1996+M3 GSs on a ‘96M3 L-R/R-L as this ‘swap’ moves the bearing/mounting point from an offset-outboard position to an offset-inboard position.
The camber gain achieved on a 1996+M3 using swapped ’96M3 GSs is double what can be achieved on a 1995M3 moving to ‘96M3 swapped GSs.

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[jamrobin]

FWIW I put brand new Sachs shocks and H&R Sports on my vert several years ago and it was "ok" but bumpy roads or a speed bump would thump the bump stops which is a bit of a jolt...

Last year I put thicker spring perches (25mm I think) in the rear and it helped quite a bit.

This year I swapped the shocks to the Bilsteins (and added Turner sway bars) and I am delighted. I still have the thicker perches... my car is a little heavier than stock thanks to lots of stereo equipment and additional sound deadening and the ride height and suspension travel are perfect... Zero bump stop hits, and zero tire scrub.

[bluptgm3]

Last year I put thicker spring perches (25mm I think) in the rear and it helped quite a bit.

I think what you are referring to are Spring Pads.
95 M3 Spring “Hat”
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227348
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31331128523

96+ M3 Spring “Hat”
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227903
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31332227902
Canadian cars SPRING PAD UPR 9MM 31332227901

E36 Rear Spring Pads
SPRING PAD LOWER 33531135420
UPR SPRING PAD 5MM 33531136385
UPR SPRING PAD 7,5MM 33531136386
UPR SPRING PAD 10MM 33531136387
UPR SPRING PAD 15MM 33531094754
UPR SPRING PAD 21,5MM 33531091599

Going the other direction, there is an upper spring perch from an E90 that is being used as an E30 ‘drop hat’ that is roughly .50 deep that also fits the 1995M3 Spring upper diameter (and 318/323/325/328, E30, E24) -
“BMW E30/E24 FRONT DROP HATS (31336764093 E90)”


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[jamrobin]

I think what you are referring to are Spring Pads.
95 M3 Spring “Hat”
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227348
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31331128523

96+ M3 Spring “Hat”
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227903
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31332227902
Canadian cars SPRING PAD UPR 9MM 31332227901

E36 Rear Spring Pads
SPRING PAD LOWER 33531135420
UPR SPRING PAD 5MM 33531136385
UPR SPRING PAD 7,5MM 33531136386
UPR SPRING PAD 10MM 33531136387
UPR SPRING PAD 15MM 33531094754
UPR SPRING PAD 21,5MM 33531091599

Going the other direction, there is an upper spring perch from an E90 that is being used as an E30 ‘drop hat’ that is roughly .50 deep that also fits the 1995M3 (and 318/323/325/328, E30, E24) -
“BMW E30/E24 FRONT DROP HATS (31336764093 E90)”


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I stand corrected... You're right I used UPR SPRING PAD 21,5MM 33531091599

[ax77]

I think what you are referring to are Spring Pads.
95 M3 Spring “Hat”
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227348
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31331128523

96+ M3 Spring “Hat”
UPR SPRING PLATE 31332227903
SPRING PAD UPR 3MM 31332227902
Canadian cars SPRING PAD UPR 9MM 31332227901

E36 Rear Spring Pads
SPRING PAD LOWER 33531135420
UPR SPRING PAD 5MM 33531136385
UPR SPRING PAD 7,5MM 33531136386
UPR SPRING PAD 10MM 33531136387
UPR SPRING PAD 15MM 33531094754
UPR SPRING PAD 21,5MM 33531091599

Going the other direction, there is an upper spring perch from an E90 that is being used as an E30 ‘drop hat’ that is roughly .50 deep that also fits the 1995M3 (and 318/323/325/328, E30, E24) -
“BMW E30/E24 FRONT DROP HATS (31336764093 E90)”


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I just installed 95 eibach springs on my 99 using the 95 top hat and the drop up front ended up being more like .6" instead of the advertised 1". I was actually looking into trying this e90 top hats to get a bit lower but I couldn't find anything about it working on an e36. From the looks of it the right side strut mount would interfere a bit at some of the welded gussets.

[bluptgm3]

I just installed 95 eibach springs on my 99 using the 95 top hat <snip>. I was actually looking into trying this e90 top hats to get a bit lower but I couldn't find anything about it working on an e36. From the looks of it the right side strut mount would interfere a bit at some of the welded gussets.

Wow, I did just install the E90 ‘hats’ on an E30 I am woking on and more recently discovered that the 95M3, E36 318/323/325/328 and E30 upper spring winding are all roughly same diameter as the E90, but had not tested on actual 95M3 or 96+M3 strut build up, I will look into that.

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[ax77]

Wow, I did just install the E90 ‘hats’ on an E30 I am woking on and more recently discovered that the 95M3, E36 318/323/325/328 and E30 upper spring winding are all roughly same diameter as the E90, but had not tested on actual 95M3 or 96+M3 strut build up, I will look into that.

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The 95 M3 eibach front springs are the same used for the e30 M3. When I was looking for the 95 top hats they were something ridiculous like $40 each. The e30 top hats looked very similar and were only $10 so I bought both and there was no measurable difference so I returned the expensive ones.

[nick325xit 5spd]

The E90 drop hats *can* be used on a NEW E36 M3 guide support. However, the guide support will need the reinforcing braces SUBSTANTIALLY trimmed down. It's not great. And you will have to replace the support a lot sooner because you won't be able to make enough clearance to accommodate the rubber sagging.

[cypher448]

as an update, I heard back from a couple people (in this thread and elsewhere) that HR OE sports or Dinan springs would be just fine on the Sachs, but also heard a couple people mention I might find the bump stops every once in a while. Since I'm driving on particularly crappy, deep potholed roads, I figured I'd just bite the bullet and go for some coilovers. My Sachs shocks have 0 miles on them and my mechanic was pulling them anyway, I figured I could just sell them, and buy some KW V1s which my mechanic's shop was selling for $1099 with free shipping (cheaper than I saw anywhere else). Thanks all for the guidance and info.

[bluptgm3]

Not sure you will be able to achieve Dinan/H&R OE Sport ride height with coil-overs.


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