Strange Whine Noise - What could it be??

[tylamb19]

Hey everyone,

I'm worried for my sanity trying to pinpoint the cause of a whine that I have heard since I bought my car with 155k on it about a year ago. Now up to 168k and climbing every day, so I'm not too worried about the sound as it hasn't changed much at all in almost a year. From the outside of the engine, the whine is nonexistent at idle and only starts to come into play as the engine is revved. See the videos below for an example of me revving the car from the engine bay and you'll be able to hear it clearly. From the cabin of the car, it almost sounds like supercharger whine up at higher RPM. See the other video attached below as well for that. The video of the pull from inside the cabin was taken 2 months after I bought the car and the sound has not really changed since then. I found a few examples of whine-type noises being indicative of early timing guide failure but none of the sounds I have heard are really that close to what I hear.

Through the oil cap, the timing chain doesn't look overly shiny or metallic, in fact the rubbing surface looks like it has a bit of black on it (possibly just from rubbing on the guides? As far as I know they are original to the car). The rest of the chain is a nice golden, oily brown. A picture of that is also attached.

I replaced the timing chain tensioner a few months ago as well and it didn't help with the whine. Chains clacked for about a second on the first start after the replacement but I have been told that it is normal for them to do that after replacing the tensioner, and I've never heard any sort of clacking or clunking of the chain on cold start before or after then. In fact, unless this noise is from the timing chain, they don't make any noise at all. The last oil change I did (~2.5k miles ago) showed no plastic bits either in the pan or in the filter. I also sent the oil in to a testing lab and it came back with no negative results. I run Mobil 1 Full Synthetic 0W-40 as recommended in another thread.

I'm thinking possibly alternator or an idler pulley, but I have not taken off anything yet. If anyone has any ideas or has heard this before and solved it, please let me know! I am also open to change my ways if needed so if I am doing something wrong please also let me know on that too.

Engine bay sound:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AqG...ew?usp=sharing

In cabin sound:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1K6P...ew?usp=sharing

Photo of the chain through the oil cap:
IMG_0745.jpg

[haynes740]

Are you running OEM trans filter. After market filters can cause similar symptoms. Almost sounds like a transmission whine. Perhaps others will chime in to give input.


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[tomloans]

I assume you have checked to see if the fan clutch is on all the time. The fan will make a howling sound at higher revs but will not be noticeable at idle. It sound like your fan clutch is shot. this is not good as if the plastic fan is original, there is a good chance it will disintegrate and destroy your hood and all kind of damage in the front of the engine. If this has never been replaced, do it immediately even if it is not the culprit in this case. see this thread and check out the pictures...

https://www.bimmerfest.com/threads/dented-hood-from-fan-shattering-replace-or-repair-it-whats-cheapest.552537/#post-6173184


Tom

[tylamb19]

Are you running OEM trans filter. After market filters can cause similar symptoms. Almost sounds like a transmission whine. Perhaps others will chime in to give input.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just replaced the trans filter a few weeks back with an OEM one from FCP Euro. I had a thread on that too as I overtorqued the valve body bolts which caused some shifting problems, but they’re gone now. So it’s a brand new OEM filter.

- - - Updated - - -

I assume you have checked to see if the fan clutch is on all the time. The fan will make a howling sound at higher revs but will not be noticeable at idle. It sound like your fan clutch is shot. this is not good as if the plastic fan is original, there is a good chance it will disintegrate and destroy your hood and all kind of damage in the front of the engine. If this has never been replaced, do it immediately even if it is not the culprit in this case. see this thread and check out the pictures...

https://www.bimmerfest.com/threads/dented-hood-from-fan-shattering-replace-or-repair-it-whats-cheapest.552537/#post-6173184


Tom

I replaced the fan, clutch, and most of the cooling system after the fan exploded on me 4 weeks after I bought the car. It took out a tooth, lol. I was standing right over it when it blew up.

[tomloans]

listened to your videos. In the cabin it sounds like the fan but in the engine well, it does not. Take your fan and clutch assembly off and see if the sound stops. then at least you can eliminate this as the source. Again, if it has never been changed then I would still change both out for good measure.

[tomloans]

check your power steering fluid and see if it is sparkly ( tiny pieces of metal ). I have had a whine when my steering pump failed and there was metal in the fluid.

- - - Updated - - -

Here is a good thread...

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...-or-water-pump

[tylamb19]

check your power steering fluid and see if it is sparkly ( tiny pieces of metal ). I have had a whine when my steering pump failed and there was metal in the fluid.

- - - Updated - - -

Here is a good thread...

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...-or-water-pump

I had leaky power steering lines for a while and one time right after buying the car (and coincidentally the day before losing my tooth to the mechanical fan) accidentally let the level go all the way down to empty and without checking it I started up the car. Made the worst power steering noise I’ve ever heard. Promptly filled it up with fluid. Lines were then replaced and no more leaks. Transmission cooler lines were also replaced as well as they were slowly leaking for a long time.

All has seemed fine since the power steering incident but maybe that made a pump already on the fritz worse. I’m going to get a mechanics stethoscope tomorrow and go poking around for sure.

[Mark3377]

My car had a whine after the first time I changed the trans filter and it turns out it was because of low trans fluid. Couple of months later topped it off properly and no more whine. This was in 2010-2011.
Now I have a trans dipstick installed so topping off is a breeze.

I can't be 100% sure that the whine you have is the same but mine was also happening at acceleration mostly in low gears. Good luck.

[tomloans]

My car had a whine after the first time I changed the trans filter and it turns out it was because of low trans fluid. Couple of months later topped it off properly and no more whine. This was in 2010-2011.
Now I have a trans dipstick installed so topping off is a breeze.

I can't be 100% sure that the whine you have is the same but mine was also happening at acceleration mostly in low gears. Good luck.

Curious if you had the whine while in park and higher RPM or when in drive and higher RPMs?

[Mark3377]

I only remember having the whine while driving. It's been 10 years. There could have been a whine while in P but I don't remember specifically trying to see if it's there. Sorry.

[tomloans]

I only remember having the whine while driving. It's been 10 years. There could have been a whine while in P but I don't remember specifically trying to see if it's there. Sorry.

Thank you.

[tylamb19]

Curious if you had the whine while in park and higher RPM or when in drive and higher RPMs?

My whine seems to be louder and more apparent in park/neutral compared to drive but is obviously still there in drive so it may just be ambient sound or air noise masking the sound which doesn’t happen when the car is in park. I’ll get a video of this tomorrow.

[tylamb19]

My whine seems to be louder and more apparent in park/neutral compared to drive but is obviously still there in drive so it may just be ambient sound or air noise masking the sound which doesn’t happen when the car is in park. I’ll get a video of this tomorrow.

Here’s the video from inside the cabin with the car in park and just revving. You can hear the whine clearly from 3k up in the rev range.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1p26...w?usp=drivesdk

[Frankie]

> Strange Whine Noise - What could it be??

Spoiled children in the back seat?*

* sorry

[tylamb19]

> Strange Whine Noise - What could it be??

Spoiled children in the back seat?*

* sorry

Are we there yet???
Are we there yet???
Are we there yet???
Are we there yet???
Are we there yet???

[chemmech]

harmonic balancer to chain cover sealing surface? would probably need a very carefully placed mechanics stethoscope to check it though ....

[clarkitect]

To my eyes that timing chain looks like it is wearing against the metal return guide. You say you replaced the tensioner. Is the chain tight when you reach your finger in the oil fill and try to lift it from the cam sprocket?

I would pull the oil pan and check for broken plastic. Worth the $20 gasket for the peace of mind.

When my guides went the engine sounded similar to yours and I could clearly tell the chain was loose on the cam sprocket (vanos for my car).

[tylamb19]

To my eyes that timing chain looks like it is wearing against the metal return guide. You say you replaced the tensioner. Is the chain tight when you reach your finger in the oil fill and try to lift it from the cam sprocket?

I would pull the oil pan and check for broken plastic. Worth the $20 gasket for the peace of mind.

When my guides went the engine sounded similar to yours and I could clearly tell the chain was loose on the cam sprocket (vanos for my car).

Chain is extremely tight, I can't move it at all with my fingers through the oil cap. Not even a millimeter. I also removed the oil cap with the engine running (and protected the middle of the engine from the oil spray off the chain) and listened closely to the chain and it was pretty much quiet. I will buy a new gasket and drop the pan at 3k miles for another oil change. Last oil change there were no plastic bits in the pan.

[clarkitect]

Chain is extremely tight, I can't move it at all with my fingers through the oil cap. Not even a millimeter. I also removed the oil cap with the engine running (and protected the middle of the engine from the oil spray off the chain) and listened closely to the chain and it was pretty much quiet. I will buy a new gasket and drop the pan at 3k miles for another oil change. Last oil change there were no plastic bits in the pan.

Did you drop the pan last time or just check the drained oil? Chain being tight is a good sign but not sure if it is the real test, just my experience. Another test would be to run if for a minute without any accessory drive belts to see if that quiets it down. Not too long to overheat it, just long enough to hear if the noise disappears.

Hope you can get it figured out!

[tylamb19]

Did you drop the pan last time or just check the drained oil? Chain being tight is a good sign but not sure if it is the real test, just my experience. Another test would be to run if for a minute without any accessory drive belts to see if that quiets it down. Not too long to overheat it, just long enough to hear if the noise disappears.

Hope you can get it figured out!

I dropped the pan last time, no plastic. Is there an easy way to pull the belts off? Most of the stuff I’ve seen involves removing a whole bunch of stuff.

[tylamb19]

Something else interesting, the whine is much less noticeable at cold start compared to when the engine is warm.

[clarkitect]

I dropped the pan last time, no plastic. Is there an easy way to pull the belts off? Most of the stuff I’ve seen involves removing a whole bunch of stuff.

Shouldn’t be too hard. Just remove the lower engine cover and the cooling fan. Release a couple tensioners.

Not sure that pulling the pan a second time would be productive if it was fine last time. I was def suspicious of how that chain looks though.

[tylamb19]

I have been poking around with a stethoscope and honestly cannot tell where the whine is coming from. I’ve put it on the valve covers, right behind both the alternator and tensioner pulleys, the water pump, and the power steering pump; yet nothing that sounds exactly like what I hear standing over the engine. I took the fan off and the noise still happens as well.

I am doing some suspension work this weekend so I will probably do an oil change as well along with dropping the pan again just to make sure there’s no plastic in there. Also will be taking the accessory belts off to see if anything clears up then.

[Timm]

That sounds like the alternator - and if not, definitely something on the drive belt - as clarkitect says, remove the main drive belt when the engine is cold - give it a few revs and see if the noise is still there!

[chemmech]

any oil leaks from the power steering pump area or seepage, the 2 hose clamps on the supply line to the reservoir maybe slightly loose allowing air to get sucked in when running maybe slightly aerating the power steering fluid etc. excessive noise not likely but the clamps can loosen up etc.