E34 All Gears are Reverse (1996 AT)

[E34Driv3r]

Hey guys.

First post on here and I was hoping some of you might be able to shine some light on a problem I'm having with an E34 520i (M50 engine) from 1996 (Not sure which box is in it yet, as I haven't been able to get underneath).

It's a 4 speed automatic transmission and has been left stored for a few years. It was started and moving as recently as about 6-7 months ago but when I tried to get it running recently, the shifter felt a little stiff at first, but loosened up when I shifted it back and forth.

The main issue however is that I have no forward gears.
The reverse gear pulls quite strongly but when I select D or 4,3 I get varying degrees of reverse also. D feels like its trying to go backwards but with some slipping (as if low on fluid). It feels the same in position 4 and 3 but in position 2, it really wants to go in reverse without the slipping.

It's been sitting idle for a long time so I'm thinking that maybe the gearbox filter and/or the solenoids are clogged up/stuck, though It did move fairly recently ok. I'm going to order the filter and fluids for it anyway, but I'm just trying to be better prepared before I get under it so I can hopefully get it done in 1 visit.

Another thought I had was that maybe the selector cable is loose in the lever on the side of the transmission. does that sound like a possible cause? I'm thinking that maybe the box is only moving between neutral and reverse, but the shifter is weeble-wobbling throughout its full range? I'm not 100% convinced by this theory but I'll be doing a general check over when time allows so I'll look at this specifically when I can get under. Maybe if I just check that the car won't roll in Park then that'll confirm that the cable is functioning correctly if the parking pawl is engaging?



Anyway, just hoping I could get some insight from guys who are more experienced with these than I am.
Any help with getting her back to life is greatly appreciated.

Thanks again.

[shogun]

Check with your VIN on realoem.com which transmission is installed. If it is a EURO 520i with M50 and model year 1996 the Automatic transmission is a BMW A5S310Z = ZF 5HP18, so a 5 speed trans.
Check the fluid first, but I assume the manual shift valve is broken, recently many cases, the shift valve swells and then breaks and one can move the shifter in the center console, but nothing happens in the gear. Here I posted info
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...ed-in-D-solved

I will move the thread to the E34 forum

[E34Driv3r]

Hey. Thanks for the info. That does sound pretty promising.

I had some time with it again this evening and I was able to confirm that it shifts to Park and the parking pawl locks in. I still only get reverse and I also got reverse in Neutral earlier. The car struggled to start and made a sort of surge rearwards.

I checked with the VIN on realOEM but it only shows me a variety of available transmissions rather than ID'ing mine specifically. Hopefully I'll have some spare time tomorrow evening to jump underneath and have a look for the tag on the box.

Thanks again.

[E34Driv3r]

Sorry to bump this again.

I'm aiming to get under the car later on today to confirm which box is in there so I can order some service parts.
I was just wondering if Shogun/others could confirm whether the manual shift valve can be replaced without dropping the valve body from the transmission?

Thanks for the help.

[shogun]

well, it is better to remove the valve body, but some members succeeded with partly dropping the valve body, the ATF pan has to come off, then you have to remove the long bolts which hold the valve body under the trans, drop the valve body a bit and then it might be possible.
But you have to know which bolts to remove, there are long and short bolts, the short ones hold the valve body together. And you need something to support the valve body, I have a lift and when I remove the valve body, I have a table with an oil catcher, and I use a small hydraulic jack under the valve body, so it does not drop suddenly when all bolts are removed, and for installing the valve body such a small jack also helps, also for the oil pan.
Here you see which bolts to remove http://www.bmwe34.net/E34main/Troubl...ch%20Guide.pdf

[whiskychaser]

Yes, with care, it can. You only need to remove the part of the VB which holds the valve. But some of the screws also hold another section of the VB which lives on top. So ideally, you need to replace the originals with some long screws. That will enable you to drop the part you want while preventing the top part from moving. If you don't have longer screws, you can take a chance and hope the bit on top stays in place - you will soon find out if it has moved because you will not get the screws back in. In which case, you will have to drop the VB.

The above is for the A5S310Z aka 5HP18 which, as Shogun has pointed out, you almost certainly have. You should find a (ZF) manufacture's plate on the right side of the trans, just above the pan line.

[E34Driv3r]

Brilliant. Thanks for the info guys.

I'll give it a try and see if I can get it out without removing too much but if worst comes to worst I'll just pull the valve body out.
I'm just a bit tight with how high I can get the car where it currently sits and I'm not able to move it for now either.

[whiskychaser]

With the car on stands, you would probably find undoing the wiring plug very difficult. But if you have to drop the VB, try to avoid disconnecting the wiring - the insulation on the connectors is very brittle. Don't forget to hook up the end of the manual valve to the arm inside the trans and check it operates properly before putting everything back together

[E34Driv3r]

Hey.
Just wanted to come back and update on the progress. Thanks a lot for the help so far guys. Shogun, you were right on the money with the diagnosis. I took off the pan earlier and discovered the top piece of the valve just resting in place, beside the rest of the valve that's still inside the valve body.
manual_valve.jpg

Now I just need to try to find a replacement somewhere. I've heard of people buying them for pretty cheap but anything I've found so far is much more expensive.
I have also found a couple of different part numbers for what appears to be the same part.

• 1056327070
• 1056327173

Hopefully she'll be up and running next week.

[shogun]

nice find. Both part number are correct., one is the old one. BMW transmission manual valve 5HP18 5HP19 5HP24 5HP30 1056327070 / 1056327173 (173 is the new number if I remember correct, that is the new material).
check the price here in Poland https://maktrans.net/index.php?route=common/home and ebay U.K.

[E34Driv3r]

Update:
Well the part is on the way. I found one in Germany for €9.00! Hopefully it'll arrive before end of tomrrow and I'll be able to get some work done over the weekend.

On a slightly separate note, can any of you guys confirm whether it'll be bad for the transmission to start the engine without any transmission fluid in?

On one hand I'm thinking, there's no fluid so the torque converter isn't going to turn and the transmission won't be turning over.

On the other hand I'm thinking, what if there's enough residual fluid that I didn't get out when draining, will that allow the torque converter to turn over and will that result in damage to the pump or other components?

Sorry if this seems like silly question.
I'm just trying to set aside some time to do other tasks if the manual valve isn't here before the weekend. I still need to replace the coolant reservoir seal and do a coolant change so I'd need to run the engine. Better to ask than to take the risk, eh.

[shogun]

When you drop the ATF pan and drained the ATF from the pan, there is still a lot of ATF in the system. The total capacity for the 5HP18 is 7.8 liters with torque converter, without torque converter it is 3.2 liters, so you still have 4.6 liters in the system which does not come out when you drop then ATF pan. The TC remains full with a normal drain, there is no drain plug on the TC. That is why one has to change the ATF usually 2-3 times till all the old ATF is replaced respect. is mixed/replaced with new ATF.
And when you start the engine without oil pan, a lot of ATF will splash out of the open trans making a big mess on the floor.
Do not run the engine till the ATF is filled correctly.

[E34Driv3r]

Thanks for the very detailed info, Shogun.
(That actually answers another question I forgot to ask. Now I know how much fluid to order).

I have refitted the pan to prevent any dirt/contamination while I wait for the parts so I wasn't worried about fluid leaking out, but like you said, there could be a lot of ATF still in there so I won't take the risk and I'll just do some work on the brakes instead.

I got a lot of cleaning done today and also jet washed the entire underside of the car. I'm pleasantly surprised by how little rust I've found and the brake and fuel lines look in really good shape. I've had modern BMW's that looked way more scruffy underneath.

Thanks again.

[E34Driv3r]

Hey guys,
Just wanted to come back and post an update on the fix in case anyone else come across this thread while having the same problem.

I finally got the part from Germany and got some time to attack the job today. I discovered that you don't actually need to use longer bolts to partially drop down the valve body, as I've seen mentioned in a few places. I was able to remove the old broken shift valve and install the new one just by backing off the T27 screws to their last couple of turns and it goes together great.

I got her to fire up and got 4 litres of fluid in for now. I reckon it'll take another 1 or 2 until its brimmed but I think I'll just run it a little as it is and then do another drain and fill in a couple of weeks to dilute out some more of the old stuff from the torque converter, cooler etc.

Anyway, Thanks for the help this far guys. It's been very useful and I'm delighted to finally take her out of hibernation!