The 535 that Could

[danespann]

I purchased this car during college years ago and never really thought it would stick around, so we will have to catch up here.

Purchased stock in California with blown shocks and no AC: Flew there and drove it back. December 2017


Previous owner had already replaced all the steering and front suspension stuff with Meyle HD, but threw some bilstein B8's and Vogtland springs at the car immediately.


Valve adjustment too:


How the car sat once vogtlands settled:


I did not like how the Bilsteins rode at all and when I took the car to a track day, the level of front grip was very underwhelming seeing as these cars have zero camber up there. So, I ordered BC racing coilovers and AKG bump steer spacers the following weekend and sold the Bilstein Vogtland Combo.

Around February, my limited slip differential arrived from canada. A 3.91 unit out of a canadian 535is. That pretty much means it has a finned diff cover and the rear mount is aluminum instead of steel.

[MauiM3Mania]

To share photos with us, you will want load the images to a photo hosting site, such as Flicker, Google Photos, 500px, etc. Avoid using Photo Bucket or ImgUr as both make it difficult to link to forums.

Once uploaded to a hosting site, either use the INSERT IMAGE icon when composing your post, or copy the link of the photo into a forum message. The link would be something like; http://hosting_site.com/your_pic.jpg


I hope that helps.

[danespann]

To share photos with us, you will want load the images to a photo hosting site, such as Flicker, Google Photos, 500px, etc. Avoid using Photo Bucket or ImgUr as both make it difficult to link to forums.

Once uploaded to a hosting site, either use the INSERT IMAGE icon when composing your post, or copy the link of the photo into a forum message. The link would be something like; http://hosting_site.com/your_pic.jpg


I hope that helps.

Looks like google broke the imbedding feature a few years back. I'll switch to flickr

[danespann]

So BC's arrived and were installed. Quick tape measure alignment and car rides much nicer than on the Bilsteins


Drove the car to Long Beach and back. September 2018 I think


And this section is where I learned some lessons in the development of this car. I drove it less and less every month for the rest of 2018 and much of 2019

Bought another set of M parallels to have all rears


Put 275/35R18 Proxes RR's on the car and immediately realized i wasn't enjoying the car anymore. I added too much grip for my abilities to progress.


The final time i drove the car on wide 18" wheels with some fairly sticky 265/35R18 S-04 Pole Positions. Yes, I had pretty competitive autocross times for the class I was in, but I was cooking brakes on an autocross course and lost more time by lack of power than i did from having absolute grip. The car was outdriving me and had some definite shortcomings.

[danespann]

At this point, I decided to make the car a great daily driver again. It needed brakes badly. So I took some F40 Brembo 4 piston calipers and threw them on the front of the car along with some (I think) Z4 2-piece calipers and good pads. This would limit my wheel choice to 17" or larger but I already knew what I wanted there.

Old Brakes:


New Brakes:


Next up, some refinished Forged 17x8 M Sytems wrapped in 245/40 Firestone Firehawks (RE003 worldwide)


Daily drove the car for a couple months and then took it to a rainy track day with some other e34 friends. Beat up one m system a bit on an off track excursion and found my LSD wasn't locking up that well.


Post-Track-Day. Took the car over to Heritage Motorworks(Danny the owner has a gold 525i build thread on here). Replaced thrust arms and swapped out differential for a 3.46 lsd that turned out to be noisy. Also Replaced CSB and swapped to e60 545 shifter from the UUC that was in it. Replaced all shifter linkage bushings. I have no pictures of this but I do have a picture of my destroyed bumper and alpina lip from hitting a ladder on the freeway on the way home from the shop:


Put another lip on and swapped in a quiet 3.46 LSD the other day before snapping some photos. 248k miles and counting. Next week the car goes back under the knife for the rear end refresh.

[moroza]

Hello and welcome!

I'm not a fan of oversized 18" wheels, even pretty ones like MPars, but those Nakedstars look *right*. What'd you use for center caps? That last shot is excellent, even in spite/because of the chipped lip and mirror. Is that just brake dust, or are the lips somekinda gunmetal finish?

[danespann]

Hello and welcome!

I'm not a fan of oversized 18" wheels, even pretty ones like MPars, but those Nakedstars look *right*. What'd you use for center caps? That last shot is excellent, even in spite/because of the chipped lip and mirror. Is that just brake dust, or are the lips somekinda gunmetal finish?

Thanks! Lips are just silver and always covered in brake dust.

The center caps are Ocean Spray caps from the early 2000's with bmw stickers on top of them. Unfortunately, I only have 3 and it is proving quite difficult to find another.

[dannyzabolotny]

I kinda miss the M-Pars on Dane’s car, but I have them on my car now (he sold them to me) so it all worked out.

[BleedsBlue]

Just quoting this photo because it’s so hot. I don’t think I’ve even seen this shot on IG?

Love seeing another build thread on ye auld forum!

[danespann]

So biggest thing I've taken this car out of commission for ever happened this week; a full rear subframe refresh.
That included:
1. New wheel bearings
2. e34 M5 Slide Bearing RTAB's
3. Meyle HD Subframe Bushings
4. 540i Rear Brakes and Vented Rotors with ATE Pads
5. All new brake lines

Drove to the shop to get started, but not before getting a flat tire from a truck in front of me dropping a bunch of debris on the road.
13mm wrench was obtained from inside my tire but a fairly new tire lost. Road hazard covered most of the new tire. 32-year-old Pirelli spare did great.
-

Up on the lift at Heritage Motorworks:


Toasted 535 Rear Brakes (NON-VENTED) OEM BMW Pads Suck:


Danny had to cut some of the exhaust bolts to separate the exhaust. I already bought new hardware and new center gaskets because I knew this would probably happen.
This car is supposedly still on the original clutch at 250K miles so most things haven't been messed with too much down here.



Subframe is out!!!



Gross




New subframe bushings in and adjusters welded in:



The next day, control arms were back from having the M5 RTAB's and wheel bearings pressed in at a classic car restoration sort of place down the road.
They even cleaned them quite well. Very im-pressed haha




Subframe Re-assembled:



Threw it back in the car:



Always more fun when some friends stop by:



Got carried away and didn't pull the car out until nearly midnight after bleeding the brakes and flushing old nasty fluid for some fresh DOT4 pentosin.

I should give this car more attention but love that it doesn't demand it. Drove it an hour home no problems.

Rear end of car is much better now.
Combination of a toasty rear wheel bearing and bad subframe bushing was causing a highway shake/driveline vibration sensation around 65-85 mph which resulted in driving 90+ highway all the time.
Car now has 4 fresh wheel bearings and isn't all over the place under acceleration and braking from subframe movement

As for the M5 RTAB bearings, it's tough to tell how much they actually changed things.
My original RTAB's were in excellent shape when removed after 250k miles and most noticeable differences are probably from replacing the subframe bushings.

[dannyzabolotny]

Glad I could help with the rear subframe overhaul! I'm very pleased with how it all came out, and I'm stoked to see how all the new parts behave next time we hit the track.

[fo3]

Nice. I've got an early model white e34 and when bought was pretty low all around and had rear neg camber with tire wear problems - the rears were near brand new but totally worn on the inner edges. It was only after working on it I found out the front had lowered springs but the rear was all original, just low due to wear.

I had bought kmacs to fix the rear camber but just replacing all the rear bushes raised it an inch, and then fitting the kmacs raised it another inch (so it's now at or above stock ride height and on factory original springs and sachs shocks while the front is lowered on bilsteins).
E: I also can't work out why the ride is still so stiff and harsh on those old shocks and springs. I've got to do something about rear springs soon but I've been too busy with my falcon ute for the past 6 mon. But the rear suspension is my next job.

[moroza]

fitting the kmacs raised it another inch

How could arm bushings affect ride height that much? The spring isn't affected, while the distance to the other pivot point - the inside/front of the arms at the bushings - is much greater, and there isn't an inch of adjustment room there anyway.

[E38740iMD]

in for progress

[fo3]

How could arm bushings affect ride height that much? The spring isn't affected, while the distance to the other pivot point - the inside/front of the arms at the bushings - is much greater, and there isn't an inch of adjustment room there anyway.

NFI. Basically I've had no time or place to work on it myself for the pasts year and I haven't been able to find anyone good to work on it - everyones lets me down and stuffed it up.
When i bought the car it was lowered front and rear similar to Danny's gold car. I know it had lowered springs at front and assumed the same for the rear. Imagine my suprise when the rear had stock sports springs and it rose up to near stock height.

I had already bought the kmacs so I thought I may as well get them fitted to adjust toe to get more tyre life anyway. First place stuffed the nut on the pass side and put on the wrong size replacement nut, so it got loose while driving and neg camber splayed out on the pass side. I got the right size nut and tried another alignment place to re-set it up. Ever since then it's even higher, so it's binding or something I don't understand. From what I know it should maybe raise the suspension only 12mm tops. It needs redoing properly because it was never set up or installed properly. Pass side is 10-15mm higher than the driver side and in general the whole rear is jacked up higher.

It's gone from looking like dannys gold car when I bought it to being higher than stock with the clowns I've used working on it. I need to get new lowered springs and start afresh when I have some place to DIY.

[danespann]

Nice. I've got an early model white e34 and when bought was pretty low all around and had rear neg camber with tire wear problems - the rears were near brand new but totally worn on the inner edges. It was only after working on it I found out the front had lowered springs but the rear was all original, just low due to wear.

I had bought kmacs to fix the rear camber but just replacing all the rear bushes raised it an inch, and then fitting the kmacs raised it another inch (so it's now at or above stock ride height and on factory original springs and sachs shocks while the front is lowered on bilsteins).
E: I also can't work out why the ride is still so stiff and harsh on those old shocks and springs. I've got to do something about rear springs soon but I've been too busy with my falcon ute for the past 6 mon. But the rear suspension is my next job.

Hey, good to meet you.

I'll start off with saying I've been an alignment tech for a long time. CAMBER DOES NOT WEAR TIRES!!! Don't know how many times ive told people this but man it gets old fast. Toe wears tires. camber dictates what part of the tire gets worn.
Driving style also affects what part of the tire will be worn.

The consensus on any of those adjustable bushings for these cars is that they are awful. People have nothing but problems and they move around as you drive.
Put new stock or m5 bushings in the rear trailing arms and stop screwing around with stuff that doesnt work.

If you're going to stay with those K-MAC's, please REMOVE YOUR DOGBONES. The adjustable bushings were not meant to be used with dogbones and that's whats both making your car ride awful and what's making your car sit higher.
The bushing binds and cannot deflect like the stock bushings or m5 slide bearings. The poly bushings effectively add to the car's working springrate.

[fo3]

Hey, good to meet you.

I'll start off with saying I've been an alignment tech for a long time. CAMBER DOES NOT WEAR TIRES!!!

Yeah, I agree, as you can see just above on my last post I said I fitted them anyway to make toe adjustable.

please REMOVE YOUR DOGBONES. The adjustable bushings were not meant to be used with dogbones and that's whats both making your car ride awful and what's making your car sit higher.

Yeah, just me looking at it over a few weekends I had that feeling myself actually. I was thinking the dogbones are out of their designed range or were binding. When I first got the car with the rear riding low and the rear tyres trashed the only thing I did on the rear was the dogbones and that raised it up. I did the front susp myself but I had no time to do the rest before I lost my house and garage and had to move. I had a shop put in the kmacs while they did the wheel bearings (again something was real bad in the rear, near new tyres down to the core just on the inside after 10k kms). They didn't try to set the kmacs because they though no point with such ruined tryes. And from my memory the ride height didn't go up by much just by fitting them. The ride height went up after two alignment places started adjusting them to get it set. So I think trying to adjust toe or camber is what makes the susp raise due to the dogbones.
E: I'm going to remove the dogbones and lube up the rtab bushes and see what that does for now.

The bushing binds and cannot deflect like the stock bushings or m5 slide bearings. The poly bushings effectively add to the car's working springrate.


The consensus on any of those adjustable bushings for these cars is that they are awful. People have nothing but problems and they move around as you drive.
Put new stock or m5 bushings in the rear trailing arms and stop screwing around with stuff that doesnt work.

I'll look at those options. I had the rear bumper off my car to replace side mount brackets a while back and thought I might as well repaint the bumper too (took me a few weeks). When refitting the bumper a couple of days ago I swear the susp has moved again because there's more camber on it than I remember last time it was set up or what I noticed when I gave it a look a few months ago...

Now I've got to look at what's available in Australia, or who posts to AU at a decent price, and what I can DIY on a driveway without a press (I don't even have exclusive use of a driveway ). My options will probably be limited...
E: I'll be replacing the springs and mounts soon, what can I do for RTABs? Even the last shop I semi trusted and used for wheel bearings seems to have closed and I've never read before about what is needed for a m5 set up.

[moroza]

The adjustable bushings were not meant to be used with dogbones and that's whats both making your car ride awful and what's making your car sit higher.
The bushing binds and cannot deflect like the stock bushings or m5 slide bearings.

Does this apply to stock bushings or bearings used with adjustment tabs, or is the issue with KMAC et al. that they don't allow axial deflection like stock (especially the bearings) do?

E: I'll be replacing the springs and mounts soon, what can I do for RTABs? Even the last shop I semi trusted and used for wheel bearings seems to have closed and I've never read before about what is needed for a m5 set up.

Choices are: rubber bushings 33329061946 (used on most E34 and E32) or rubber-encased slide bearings 33321135808 (used on M5, 740, 750). Either way, you need either a press or a rather special puller. Those bushings are some of the tightest I've ever pressed out or in.

[danespann]

Does this apply to stock bushings or bearings used with adjustment tabs, or is the issue with KMAC et al. that they don't allow axial deflection like stock (especially the bearings) do?



Choices are: rubber bushings 33329061946 (used on most E34 and E32) or rubber-encased slide bearings 33321135808 (used on M5, 740, 750). Either way, you need either a press or a rather special puller. Those bushings are some of the tightest I've ever pressed out or in.

You're correct in that the issue is the lack of axial deflection.

It will probably be a lot more liveable with just the dogbones removed and the alignment may stop moving around.

The oem rubber bushes and the m5 ones are equally difficult to press in so may as well go with the m5 ones if you don't mind spending.

I had a shop that works on old MG's and 70's Rolls Royce's with Hydraulic suspension press in the m5 slide bearings, so they didn't find them very difficult. But everything they do is awful so I'm glad I found them right down the street.

[fo3]

I was looking up how my car would go without the dogbones and I found this thread https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...-link-question

Seems they thought it was an afterthought to hold the soft rubber rtabs from shifting so much and help toe while the suspension moves or to laterally support the rtabs, and earlier cars didn't even have them. What do you think? I wondered after if the m5 had them if they weren't needed with a stiffer bush (like my kmacs are) but realoem seems to indicate even m5s had the dogbones.

E: I don't need a puller to pull the kmacs out so removal would be easy. I'm wondering what I would need to press new ones in. Maybe I could hire a porterpower type press?

[danespann]

I was looking up how my car would go without the dogbones and I found this thread https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...-link-question

Seems they thought it was an afterthought to hold the soft rubber rtabs from shifting so much and help toe while the suspension moves or to laterally support the rtabs, and earlier cars didn't even have them. What do you think? I wondered after if the m5 had them if they weren't needed with a stiffer bush (like my kmacs are) but realoem seems to indicate even m5s had the dogbones.

E: I don't need a puller to pull the kmacs out so removal would be easy. I'm wondering what I would need to press new ones in. Maybe I could hire a porterpower type press?

The m5 ones are a bearing that slides side to side so it would be nearly undrivable without dogbones. we took the dogbones out of a friends car that has poly rtab's and it feels way better now though.

My 535 is very early and it has dogbones. They are a purposeful part of the e34 design to have a better toe curve and better wheel clearance from the fender.

[fo3]

The m5 ones are a bearing that slides side to side so it would be nearly undrivable without dogbones. we took the dogbones out of a friends car that has poly rtab's and it feels way better now though.

My 535 is very early and it has dogbones. They are a purposeful part of the e34 design to have a better toe curve and better wheel clearance from the fender.

Sorry I meant earlier like that thread mentioned, E12 and E21. The dogbones started with the e28 they claimed due to changes in bush mount design (and maybe removing some proper support arms).

E: Anyway, thanks for your input on this matter and I'll let you get back to your scheduled content I'll see what I can get done.

[ZenitramNaes]

I love the early white e34s with the lower black trim. Looking good.

[danespann]

Not a real build update besides new OBC bulbs, but went to California because a long-time friend bought a freshly imported Euro 535i/5 slicktop from Spain and asked me to pick it up and drive it back.
One of the nicest e34's I've driven. I'll convince him to start a build thread too. That blue E34 is s50 powered too.






Empty California Beach:

[sbeckman7]

In for another 535i build!