Contracheatcode's e36 M3 4-Door - LSX Swap - CA CARB Legal

[Contracheatcode]

Hello Bimmerforums,

Today starts the thread for the LSX (most likely LS1) swap. The key is making it California legal. It's been done, so don't tell me it's not possible. Hard, but possible.

Goals:

• Engine: LSX (most likely LS1)
• Transmission: I am really liking what I read about the T56 Magnum
• Timeframe: 6 months
• Budget: $10k
• Kits: Most likely going to go Vorshlag for engine mounts, transmission mount, driveshaft and a few other misc parts to make the conversion easier and faster
• Headers: This is the big issue with California. There are some aftermarket 50 state legal headers. I think I can get away with modifying these headers for the steering shaft AND retain the "unmodified" look. I get some flexibility on catalytic converter location. If the headers are a huge issue, I will move to installing another steering joint to avoid the headers.
• Garage Build, no fancy shop
• Daily Driver

Candidate: My e36 M3. I have owned for 1 year. I am the second owner. No crashes. Suspension (all bushings, coilovers, etc) all upgraded over the past year. M50 Manfiold. Dinan Intake. 6 speed Getrag I just installed. Thinking I will keep the S52 engine, transmission, etc. for an e30 conversion in the future. The engine and transmission just run too good to sell it.

HELP: I will need so much help. I have been researching for months, and read so many amazing threads. So Bimerok, Tim Mc, all the others out there. I NEED YOUR HELP TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN. THANK YOU AHEAD OF TIME.

Day 0: S52 engine removal starts tomorrow.



Thanks,

Mike

[motorV8ed]

I wish you the best! Your budget is for the conversion, not including the car/chassis, right? I think you can do it! (I spent about that on drivetrain + other stuff, not including chassis.)

[Contracheatcode]

I wish you the best! Your budget is for the conversion, not including the car/chassis, right? I think you can do it! (I spent about that on drivetrain + other stuff, not including chassis.)

Yes. The $10k budget does not include the car. I purchased the car for $5.5k have dropped about $5k into it already (new bushings, coilovers, tires, m50, 6-speed Getrag, etc.... it adds up)

[e36m3ls1]

If using 10k budget.... I would go another swap supplier. Vorshlag kit will set you back half of your budget... and take 9mo - 1 yr to get you parts.


There are other cheaper options.

[Contracheatcode]

If using 10k budget.... I would go another swap supplier. Vorshlag kit will set you back half of your budget... and take 9mo - 1 yr to get you parts.


There are other cheaper options.

Thanks. I am open to suggestions. Keep in mind I am not getting their headers so I assume they have those other parts available. Plus I have only read good things about Fair and Vorshlag.


Day 2: Removed most of the wiring harness making note to label most everything that I could forget. Not bad progress. Time to relax the rest of day.

[Contracheatcode]

Day 3: Built wooden stands.




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[RulyLSX]

If using 10k budget.... I would go another swap supplier. Vorshlag kit will set you back half of your budget... and take 9mo - 1 yr to get you parts.


There are other cheaper options.

This so much. Better options out there

Good luck on the swap, looking forward to reading along

[Contracheatcode]

Day X: Engine removed with only 1 random bolt hanging around after that I have no clue where it goes. Not bad.




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[Contracheatcode]

Question: do I need to keep anything from my s52 engine/transmission/wiring/DME?

I am selling it all and want to ensure I don’t get rid of anything essential to the LSx swap.


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[wbrentr]

You should be good to sale it. I don't recall re-using anything on my swap.

Vorshlag has a premium product, and the price reflects that. So staying within your budget will be a bit tougher.

I am running 2 cats on my swap, so I'm not sure why that would be difficult.

Are you doing any engine upgrades or refresh? What about clutch? What are your power goals? Where are you sourcing your engine? You will save a lot of time & money getting it from an F-Body

[Contracheatcode]

Good questions. And open to suggestions.

Vorshlag will probably be my go-to for a lot of stuff. I am ok paying a bit of a premium for something that fits perfectly and works together. Maybe Fair can hook me up with a bulk purchase discount. FAIR - you reading this???

No doubt a f-body LS1 engine, accessories and ECU, from a 2001-2002 Camaro or Firebird.

I like the idea of a new transmission so will go with the t-56 magnum from Vorshlag.

Open to suggestions on where to source. Most likely thinking a local dismantler via cart-parts.com or local listing on Craigslist or facebook.

Don’t get me wrong, I would love an LS3 out of a later Camaro but the prices get a bit high for an LS3.

Engine refresh for sure. I won’t do anything crazy as I need to pass CARB and I believe they dyno the car. And I will have to show that the ECU is stock with no tune via paperwork from Chevy.

Keep the questions coming. They help ensure I am thinking about things correctly.


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[wbrentr]

Yeah, good luck trying to get a discount lol.

I may be switching out my wiring specialties harness soon. I have the 0411 pcm as well that would fit perfectly on your setup. Not sure what CARB requires though.

People unload LS engines all the time on craiglist/FB market place. You can snag a good deal if you have cash in hand and jump quick. Since you are going new trans, what is your clutch going to be? Highly recommend trying to grab the bell housing when you buy your ls1

When you say refresh, what do you mean?

[Laminar]

Any specific reason you're going for new trans over used? In the off chance that there's something wrong with a used trans, you can do a complete bearing/synchro replacement for under $500. It's monumentally easier than an engine refresh. A press makes everything easier but isn't 100% required.

[RulyLSX]

Good questions. And open to suggestions.

Vorshlag will probably be my go-to for a lot of stuff. I am ok paying a bit of a premium for something that fits perfectly and works together. Maybe Fair can hook me up with a bulk purchase discount. FAIR - you reading this???

No doubt a f-body LS1 engine, accessories and ECU, from a 2001-2002 Camaro or Firebird.

I like the idea of a new transmission so will go with the t-56 magnum from Vorshlag.

Open to suggestions on where to source. Most likely thinking a local dismantler via cart-parts.com or local listing on Craigslist or facebook.

Don’t get me wrong, I would love an LS3 out of a later Camaro but the prices get a bit high for an LS3.

Engine refresh for sure. I won’t do anything crazy as I need to pass CARB and I believe they dyno the car. And I will have to show that the ECU is stock with no tune via paperwork from Chevy.

Keep the questions coming. They help ensure I am thinking about things correctly.


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Issue with Vorshlag is you are at the mercy of when they ship stuff out, I had a huge issue with them when I tried buying coil overs from them and had to get the bank involved to get my money back. I also had another order for a abs relocation bracket, ordered in May and didn't get it till November, keep in mind both products were listed as "in stock". Make sure you reach out to them beforehand on shipping times!!!

For sourcing I would stick to craigslist/offerup/dismantler if you have them locally, ideally you would want the engine/pcm combo, I would stay away from the 98ls1 block if you come across that

[wbrentr]

Yeah, 98 ls1 & pcm are limited in their support.

[OKsweetrides]

Get the headers first then make your mounts. Vorshlag, while nice, eh... header spacing is not generous.

[e36m3ls1]

V Shlag also got a little squirrelly w me when I tried calling for tech help after spending 5$k in parts... they basically said they didn’t want to deal w it since I installed in myself... there are better options.

Same exp here ... website says in stock but parts were months out.

Also no amount of adj would fix my drivers v cover clash.

So just because you drop big $$ does not guarantee fitment.

They do some really top notch work in house ... but the sales side and tech support and support after the sale not so bueno.

Maybe it was just me

But I’d shop out your build.



I will sell my v shag trans mount if you want it. I got sick of the nvh of the solid mount.

You will love this build when running.

I just installed 3.91 gears.... woke it up!

[wbrentr]

I will sell my v shag trans mount if you want it. I got sick of the nvh of the solid mount.

Let me know what you figure out on this. I've been thinking about swapping the poly out for rubber. I haven't had any luck finding any rubber to make my own replacement, granted I haven't looked too hard.

[e36m3ls1]

I ended up installing a cx racing trans mount w a poly trans mount. Eliminated the trans nvh. I had to mod the cx trans mount... sawzall.

[bimerok]

If you only read good things about v shlag then you didn’t do your research. There are tons of issues with their parts and customer service/treatment and support. The high price is definitely not indicative of equally high quality or fitment. For example back in the day I was able to have a local fab make 2 sets of equal length headers form my ls swaps almost for the amount of 1 that they were selling. And the fitment of mine is 10x better than theirs. Not sure if it’s still the case, but they didn’t even tell customers after the fact that non of the OEM spark plug fires would work with their headers! Also calling before hand about shipment times means absolutely nothing, same as seeing in-stock on their web site. I was dragged for almost 6 months with them saying next month, in 2 weeks, etc, before just giving up and going my own route. Boy am I happy I did.

Their main slogan is company is always right and customer is always wrong no-matter what! And being a sponsor on this forum they think that it can be amplified 10 fold.

Since you are going off the shelf headers, then most likely most of the kit mounts will not work directly. You are going to be required to modify them or come up with custom built altogether. Like others already said, there are other, much cheaper options available. Do a better research and try to think your project through as much as possible. Otherwise your budget will thin-out before you know it.

[Contracheatcode]

If you only read good things about v shlag then you didn’t do your research. There are tons of issues with their parts and customer service/treatment and support. The high price is definitely not indicative of equally high quality or fitment. For example back in the day I was able to have a local fab make 2 sets of equal length headers form my ls swaps almost for the amount of 1 that they were selling. And the fitment of mine is 10x better than theirs. Not sure if it’s still the case, but they didn’t even tell customers after the fact that non of the OEM spark plug fires would work with their headers! Also calling before hand about shipment times means absolutely nothing, same as seeing in-stock on their web site. I was dragged for almost 6 months with them saying next month, in 2 weeks, etc, before just giving up and going my own route. Boy am I happy I did.

Their main slogan is company is always right and customer is always wrong no-matter what! And being a sponsor on this forum they think that it can be amplified 10 fold.

Since you are going off the shelf headers, then most likely most of the kit mounts will not work directly. You are going to be required to modify them or come up with custom built altogether. Like others already said, there are other, much cheaper options available. Do a better research and try to think your project through as much as possible. Otherwise your budget will thin-out before you know it.

Thanks Bimerok. I appreciate the feedback. A lot to think about. BTW your work is inspirational.

I think one thing is clear, I need to source the engine and see how I am going to negotiate the CARB legal header, cats, etc before I commit to any solutions.

Thank you all. I dint mind a little constructive feedback. I am not engine swap expert.


Mike


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[Contracheatcode]

Update: Not too much progress. Removed additional items in the engine bay. My plan is mock everything up when all the parts are in. Then remove it all again and paint the inside of the engine bay. This will ensure any welding to the body looks like factory.




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[Contracheatcode]

Update: LS1 purchased and on the stand. It’s from a 2001 Camero with 100k miles. Car was factory manual (though I did not purchase) and comes with matching PCM. Since I will CARB I wanted to ensure the car was off a manual.

Time to take off the pan and heads for a quick inspection.



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[Contracheatcode]

Question:
Does the T56 Magnum or Magnum-F fit better? Most likely going custom mounts.
Closed or Wide gear ratio? Going to be mostly daily driver.
Recommended flywheel and clutch? Going to eventually get to 500 whp goal


Thanks. Mike.


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[motorV8ed]

Question:
Does the T56 Magnum or Magnum-F fit better?

Despite being one of the less knowledgable people on this board, I can speak to this issue a bit, at least as far as shifter location. My car has had BOTH a T56 Magnum AND an F-body T56 in it. I did not do the original Magnum installation; IIRC, the person I bought the car from (user C10 LS1 1968 here) said he had to do a mild massage on the tunnel to fit the Magnum, but I am not sure of details.

As to shifter location: I am sure you know that the Magnum shifter is farther forward than BMW, and the F-body location is aft of the BMW position. Here are some pics. The first two pictures show the modifications to fit the Magnum. (Front of the car is at the top.) In the second picture, you can judge where the BMW shifter was centered by the round profile at the bottom (rear) of picture:


DSCN3173 (1).jpg

DSCN3175 (1).jpg

And these last pictures are the modifications necessary for the F-body tranny:

DSCN3178 (1).jpg

DSCN3179 (1).jpg

DSCN3210 (1).jpg

I made up a crude bracket to relocate the shifter a few inches forward, close to the original BMW location.

I think it is kind of a horse apiece!