Recalibrating the water temperature gauge

[IndianaRoadster]

I came across an interesting idea being discussed by the e46 crowd several years ago. It involved changing the buffer range on the stock water temperature gauge. They wanted to make the stock gauge more reflective of the actual temperature in the mid range which I would really be interested in. Has anybody heard of this?
Screenshot_20200414-180052_Chrome.jpg

[BladeRunner919]

What we really need is the BMW equivalent of this: http://www.thejagwrangler.com/xk8--x...realgauge.html

I have a Jag XK8 which, like all cars now, has the buffered temp gauge, but this bit of kit intercepts the real temp reading and drives the temp gauge so that it is a genuine reading. It can even be calibrated directly for each car to account for slight variations in the gauge readings, and it has an alarm that sounds if the temp gets too high.

[IndianaRoadster]

What we really need is the BMW equivalent of this: http://www.thejagwrangler.com/xk8--x...realgauge.html

I have a Jag XK8 which, like all cars now, has the buffered temp gauge, but this bit of kit intercepts the real temp reading and drives the temp gauge so that it is a genuine reading. It can even be calibrated directly for each car to account for slight variations in the gauge readings, and it has an alarm that sounds if the temp gets too high.

Maybe our fourms IT expert, 328 power 04, might give us some insight. I just got the INPA program loaded up, thanks to my son-in-law, and waiting on my cord to come in Friday. I wonder if you could do something with a program like that? I've wanted to add a water temperature and oil pressure gauge and if I could get the factory water temperature gauge to be accurate, I could replace the clock with a oil pressure gauge. That would give me the info I want and keep the stock look.

[z3forlife]

What about a boost gauge ? Once you’re set up on the laptop you can upload a copy of your ECU flash and Abel can probably direct you or possibly assist (he’s probably really busy right now)with the coding. There are some threads here where it’s discussed.

[IndianaRoadster]

What about a boost gauge ? Once you’re set up on the laptop you can upload a copy of your ECU flash and Abel can probably direct you or possibly assist (he’s probably really busy right now)with the coding. There are some threads here where it’s discussed.

I wouldn't mind having a boost gauge. Not sure where to put it, maybe on the steering column? Concerning the water temp gauge, maybe I'll PM him when he gets caught up, just don't like imposing on others when they are really busy.

[rf900rkw]

Someone in this forum has changed the Kombi coding to realize a more linear temp gauge. As I remember it was for the later E46 based Z3 cluster. I don't remember if his changes worked on the M cluster. I drive by the oil temp, which is accurate and a good indication of coolant temp.

[BimmerBreaker]

I debuffered my coolant gauge. Can be done on S54 and I think M54 too, as well as M52TU. I dont recommend it. I went back to a buffered gauge after awhile. Its crazy how much temps will actually fluctuate in different circumstances and I spent too much time watching the temps

Isnt theres a "secret menu" you can access on all Z3 clusters that will show you temp? Maybe use that on particularly hard drives to keep an eye on things?

[Vintage42]

I debuffered my coolant gauge... I dont recommend it. I went back to a buffered gauge after awhile. Its crazy how much temps will actually fluctuate in different circumstances and I spent too much time watching the temps...

I don't understand that at all.
When I first mounted a ScanGauge, I watched the temps fluctuate a lot with different circumstances. But after I replaced the thermostat, the temps stayed at 206F no matter what the circumstances.
If the thermostat is good, the temps should not fluctuate.
But you are right in that I do love to watch the temps as they warm up and stabilize.

[rf900rkw]

You mean "if the thermostat is good AND you have an M44". The E46 based engines have a computer controlled thermostat that can be anywhere from 80C to 97C depending on the conditions, load, vehicle speed, etc.

[Vintage42]

You mean "if the thermostat is good AND you have an M44". The E46 based engines have a computer controlled thermostat that can be anywhere from 80C to 97C depending on the conditions, load, vehicle speed, etc.

I did not know that. :-(

[ptony101]

I modified mine so that the nominal zone (12:00 position) was narrower. Instead of 75-115deg, I made it 75-105, with the start of red zone at 115 (vs 120) and max at 120 (vs 125). This was to hopefully give me an earlier warning if something were amiss as I did the simple fan delete. This is on an M54. I believe that the S54B32 came factory programmed with a different characteristic curve (85-95 nominal zone, 105, 115). I don't know about the S52.

[IndianaRoadster]

I modified mine so that the nominal zone (12:00 position) was narrower. Instead of 75-115deg, I made it 75-105, with the start of red zone at 115 (vs 120) and max at 120 (vs 125). This was to hopefully give me an earlier warning if something were amiss as I did the simple fan delete. This is on an M54. I believe that the S54B32 came factory programmed with a different characteristic curve (85-95 nominal zone, 105, 115). I don't know about the S52.

Did you modify using INPA or another way?

[ptony101]

I used NCS Expert, which is usually included in the various downloads for INPA (all collectively packaged in BMW Standard Tools) and a program called NCS Dummy to help parse and edit the daten file. Are you familiar with them?

[IndianaRoadster]

I used NCS Expert, which is usually included in the various downloads for INPA (all collectively packaged in BMW Standard Tools) and a program called NCS Dummy to help parse and edit the daten file. Are you familiar with them?

No I'm not, but trying to learn. Fortunately my son-in-law works for the Federal Reserve in cybersecurity so he's been helping me. What's the old saying, hard to teach old dogs (65) new tricks! But were both enjoying it, always good to spend time with the family. We will definitely give it a shot. Thanks for the help.

[BimmerBreaker]

INPA is mostly for diagnostics FWIW

For the cool stuff, NCS expert/dummy, PA Soft (which has similar capability to NCS) are a good place to start with for coding. NCS is really cool on the newer cars but fairly limited on the Z3's.

Tbh though I dont remember what was used to reprogram my cluster but it was something im not overtly familiar with. 328i M Power... Abel would be of more help

[ptony101]

NCS Expert was what was needed for my KOMBI module but it might depend on what version cluster you have in your Z. I was lucky that mine was similar to E46 so I could leverage all their work. Some of the earlier versions seemed to need PA Soft, which is a bit more complicated in both HW and SW.

In my module, there were already 3 curves stored: "kennlinie_01" was the active one loaded in my module. The file also had "kennlinie_02" which was much tighter and looked like it was applied to S54 engines (the normal position is 85-95C with the red zone at 105/115C). If you like those values, it's relatively easy to change with NCS Expert. I wanted something in between so I used NCS Dummy to create my own values.

IndianaRodster: when you get into the Kombi file, look for the function: KUEHLMITTELTEMP_ADC_WERT. If you want links to some of the instructions I used, let me know.

[IndianaRoadster]

NCS Expert was what was needed for my KOMBI module but it might depend on what version cluster you have in your Z. I was lucky that mine was similar to E46 so I could leverage all their work. Some of the earlier versions seemed to need PA Soft, which is a bit more complicated in both HW and SW.

In my module, there were already 3 curves stored: "kennlinie_01" was the active one loaded in my module. The file also had "kennlinie_02" which was much tighter and looked like it was applied to S54 engines (the normal position is 85-95C with the red zone at 105/115C). If you like those values, it's relatively easy to change with NCS Expert. I wanted something in between so I used NCS Dummy to create my own values.

IndianaRodster: when you get into the Kombi file, look for the function: KUEHLMITTELTEMP_ADC_WERT. If you want links to some of the instructions I used, let me know.

Thanks ptony101, I'm taking a screenshot of this and putting it in my Samsung Notes. Appreciate your help.

[djb2]

I don't understand that at all.
When I first mounted a ScanGauge, I watched the temps fluctuate a lot with different circumstances. But after I replaced the thermostat, the temps stayed at 206F no matter what the circumstances.
If the thermostat is good, the temps should not fluctuate.
But you are right in that I do love to watch the temps as they warm up and stabilize.

You might double-check that the heater in the thermostat is connected and working. The temperature *should* fluctuate, dropping when under heavy load and remaining somewhat stable at the mechanical setting of 97C under steady light load.

[kaputme]

NCS Expert was what was needed for my KOMBI module but it might depend on what version cluster you have in your Z. I was lucky that mine was similar to E46 so I could leverage all their work. Some of the earlier versions seemed to need PA Soft, which is a bit more complicated in both HW and SW.

In my module, there were already 3 curves stored: "kennlinie_01" was the active one loaded in my module. The file also had "kennlinie_02" which was much tighter and looked like it was applied to S54 engines (the normal position is 85-95C with the red zone at 105/115C). If you like those values, it's relatively easy to change with NCS Expert. I wanted something in between so I used NCS Dummy to create my own values.

IndianaRodster: when you get into the Kombi file, look for the function: KUEHLMITTELTEMP_ADC_WERT. If you want links to some of the instructions I used, let me know.

Hello guys,

Does anyone have a diy for this. I'm interested..
My car had a water pump as and belt fail few months ago, but as soon I felt no power steering I switched off the car..
The temperature gauge stayed dead in centre...

I'd love to have a non buffered Temperature gauge..

Could anyone please help me...

Thanks in advance .. mine is a E46
Cheers

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

[z3forlife]

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...s-in-your-car!

heres a thread that shows how to access the cluster test modes that will also show water temp. I don’t think it’s buffered data but I haven’t tried it yet

[ptony101]

Hello guys,

Does anyone have a diy for this. I'm interested..
My car had a water pump as and belt fail few months ago, but as soon I felt no power steering I switched off the car..
The temperature gauge stayed dead in centre...

I'd love to have a non buffered Temperature gauge..

Could anyone please help me...

Thanks in advance .. mine is a E46
Cheers

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

The E46 is a bit different than our E36/7's but the principles are the same. The E46 has 2 major things you can change: (1) the angle of the needle for certain temperatures and (2) the temperatures at those angles. The E36/7's I think you can only program the temperature at the pre-determined angles / hash marks. To make it easy, you can just set the temp values, keeping the angles as factory programmed.

You can code it using either NCS Expert and a companion program called NCS Dummy. Or, with an interface and software called PA Soft (aka BMW Scanner 1.4.0). I don't have any experience on the E46 but having read a bunch of stuff on E46 forums I think NCS Expert and Dummy are the way to go. The software is freely available on the web (look for INPA or BMW Standard Tools) and there are many sources for "K+DCAN" cables. Here's a place to buy cables in the US and download the software www.bimmergeeks.net. There's also info on this forum from 328MPwr with links and suggestions.

The disadvantage of NCS Expert is that it is factory level software; not a very elegant interface and many things are in German (but I think you won't have a language problem?). But it is very powerful and, with the other programs included in the bundles, it's useful for other things, including diagnosing error codes.

Here's a link to the E46 Fanatics page where using PA Soft is discussed. https://www.e46fanatics.com/threads/...t-1-4.1013600/

As a bonus, once you figure out all this, you can try to code out the speedometer error. The E46 guys figured this out pretty well too.

[kaputme]

Thanks ptony101,

I already, have the BMW software bundle and cable. I use it to check and erase errors.

Do you also know which module should I check using NCSexpert for the temp gauge coding??

If I find a way and it works I'll post a diy.

Dankeschön
Cheers

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

[ptony101]

Thanks ptony101,

I already, have the BMW software bundle and cable. I use it to check and erase errors.

Do you also know which module should I check using NCSexpert for the temp gauge coding??

If I find a way and it works I'll post a diy.

Dankeschön
Cheers

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

It will be the KOMBI module (something like KMB...). When you scan the car with NCS Expert, it will show the possible modules. When you read the modules, it will tell you which Daten file is used. Format is something like KMB_E46.C03.

The best DIY for this process is the NCS Dummy instruction manual (search for "NCS Dummy Taking the expert out of NCS Expert, by Revtor"). It will tell you how to download and modify trace files, which is what you need to do. Your target is to get to this screen in NCS Dummy. Here you can see the values for temp gauge at various angles. The key is to change the values 75, 115 (temp range in C for the 12 oclock position), 125 (3/4 mark, IIRC) and then 130 (red zone!). NCS Dummy will explain the best ways to do this.

[kaputme]

It will be the KOMBI module (something like KMB...). .... The key is to change the values 75, 115 (temp range in C for the 12 oclock position), 125 (3/4 mark, IIRC) and then 130 (red zone!). NCS Dummy will explain the best ways to do this.

Perfect thanks.. I'll give it try and let you guys know

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

[BimmerBreaker]

The E46 is a bit different than our E36/7's but the principles are the same. The E46 has 2 major things you can change: (1) the angle of the needle for certain temperatures and (2) the temperatures at those angles. The E36/7's I think you can only program the temperature at the pre-determined angles / hash marks. To make it easy, you can just set the temp values, keeping the angles as factory programmed.

You can code it using either NCS Expert and a companion program called NCS Dummy. Or, with an interface and software called PA Soft (aka BMW Scanner 1.4.0). I don't have any experience on the E46 but having read a bunch of stuff on E46 forums I think NCS Expert and Dummy are the way to go. The software is freely available on the web (look for INPA or BMW Standard Tools) and there are many sources for "K+DCAN" cables. Here's a place to buy cables in the US and download the software www.bimmergeeks.net. There's also info on this forum from 328MPwr with links and suggestions.

The disadvantage of NCS Expert is that it is factory level software; not a very elegant interface and many things are in German (but I think you won't have a language problem?). But it is very powerful and, with the other programs included in the bundles, it's useful for other things, including diagnosing error codes.

Here's a link to the E46 Fanatics page where using PA Soft is discussed. https://www.e46fanatics.com/threads/...t-1-4.1013600/

As a bonus, once you figure out all this, you can try to code out the speedometer error. The E46 guys figured this out pretty well too.

We have our very own source for a clean, easy to understand INPA/NCS download... Cables on ebay for $15 and good to go
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...xperimentation