Oil experts unite!

[spyderg0d]

Ive driven my obd1 car all cold and desperate winter. Very short drives of maybe 3 to 4 miles. The car gets to ot about 1/4 mile before home or work. Thats the only driving the car has.. And doing so has accumulated alot of moisture in the oil.. (No, its not a headgasket. Yes, im 10000000% posative).
Basically, i use 10-30 conventional just because i do regular oil changes and dont feel the need to spend the extra for synthetic.. I also use this on the family e46 that gets frozen ccv every 2 years.
But.. Im wondering if conventional oil is more prone to condensation collection than synthetic. It seems that coworkers vehicles that run synthetic dont have condensate that drive the very similar short distances. Wondering if its just due to obd1, rich tune, or just a unavoidable consequence of winter and short drives.

[gdavid]

I don't have a oil suggestion but a oil sump heater on your car would reduce this problem. The heater would not get the oil to sufficient temp alone but it would be starting from a warmer temp on short drives and therefore reach a higher temp.

[gdavid]

Or how about running an oil catch can instead of the ccv. If the moisture trying to burn off in the crankcase is condensing in the CCV and draining back into the oil, you could break the cycle with a catch can. I'm a bit surprised the dry air during winter months are creating that much moisture but this has been a really odd winter.

[pbonsalb]

Catch can won’t break the cycle. Drive the car, get it to operating temp and shut if off in cold weather and you get condensation whether there is a catch can or stock PCV. Just drive the car on longer drives once or twice a week to burn off the contaminants.

I use synthetic in my 3 cars. I don’t think synthetic vs regular oil makes a difference. Your friends may have newer cars that run hotter. That is the key.

I would use 5W30 or 0W40, not 10W30 to reduce wear on cold starts.

[spyderg0d]

Well. After this winter the car will not be used in the winter ever again. Also, the engine is high toleranced, so thinner oil was demanded at higher temps over the summer. However with synthetic it very well may need 10-40.
The car is obd1 and has no pcv,.. Or better. Its literally 2 hoses running to the intake at different points as the pcv. Lol. 1 to the boot and 1 to the under intake icv elbow.
Right now, the oil is milky and quite thin which is giving me pretty bad chain rattle. So, long drives are out of the question until an oil change occurs... Which i think is my only option at this point since its already whitish and thin. No cooking this stuff back from the dead.
After this week cold weather is probably over for the most part. Should be safe for an oilchange this week withoutfearof another milk machine episode.

[pbonsalb]

Why would you need thinner oil at high temps in summer? That is when you may want thicker oil. I often run thinner in winter and thicker in summer. But if you engine is actually loosely built, you may need thicker oil year round.

[spyderg0d]

10 40 is thicker than 10-30 at ot..
10-40 left me with a dry bearing during engine break in after engine warm ups. Luckily only 1 was damaged. (Yes, before anyone has a comment on that, the entire engine was went through again and checked extensively proffessionally with massively experienced engine technicians to see what happened)
10 30 and 5 30 work well in the summer especially at the high revs the engine sees with the gearing paired that 10_40 just could not afford to high tolerances. I imagine the synthetic will have the same viscosity as measured of sae oil, but will have better protection since it is after all made to be exactly that.

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Wait... I went from a 10-40 to a 5-30... Got that mixed up.. Excuse the correction, and sorry for the misunderstanding.

[pbonsalb]

BMW S65 engine has closer tolerances than your motor, a factory 8400 rpm limiter, a 3.85 factory diff, and a factory 10W60 oil spec. I personally think that is thicker than necessary and may increase wear on cold starts, especially in winter. Some also believe it is too thick under some conditions for the factory bearing clearances.

You should have no problem with 10W40 in summer at high rpm on an M50/M52/S50/S52. That said, I don’t think 10W40 is the best choice and would instead recommend 5W30, 0W40 or 5W40 synthetic. I have a fully built motor, an M52 taken to S52 specs with a 7200 rpm limiter that is much more stressed than your motor and I use 0W40 or 5W40 although I have also used 5W50.

[Mike WW]

Condensation doesn't care about dino or synthetic oil, it's humidity and temps. Get it hot every week or two, take the long way home after work Fridays, or every other and work it a bit for a 20 mile drive. That should burn off most of it.

[spyderg0d]

I think you miss the point...
However, the example of engine spec reference does make sense ..
Its true that condensate will happen whether synthetic or sae oil is used... But....if its resistant to absorbing the water it would make a difference..

[jclausen]

Condensation is a byproduct of cold start engine, that's why the steam out the exhaust, the oil has nothing to do with it, the short driving is probably the most damaging over time other than the engine sitting for long periods then starting and waiting for oil pressure in the mean time crank and rod bearings are dry wiping in the bearing shells until the pressure is developing. The oil pressure centers the journals in the bearing shell, the bearing shell is there to protect the journal while the pressures build up. Some people install pre lubing pumps to build up oil pressure before starting. Either way short trips with long sitting before the next start is not good for the engine or anything else

[JDStrickland]

Ive driven my obd1 car all cold and desperate winter. Very short drives of maybe 3 to 4 miles. The car gets to ot about 1/4 mile before home or work. Thats the only driving the car has.. And doing so has accumulated alot of moisture in the oil.. (No, its not a headgasket. Yes, im 10000000% posative).
Basically, i use 10-30 conventional just because i do regular oil changes and dont feel the need to spend the extra for synthetic.. I also use this on the family e46 that gets frozen ccv every 2 years.
But.. Im wondering if conventional oil is more prone to condensation collection than synthetic. It seems that coworkers vehicles that run synthetic dont have condensate that drive the very similar short distances. Wondering if its just due to obd1, rich tune, or just a unavoidable consequence of winter and short drives.

This.

[pizzaman09]

I had condensation issues in my e39 M5 back when the only trips it made in the winter were the 7 minute drive to work or back. The amount of water that ends up in your oil is such a small percentage, I would not even worry about it. A lot of the condensation went away once I replaced the thermostat and the car was no longer running cold.

In a project car of mine, a 328is, I did have a blown head gasket. I lost oil pressure around two quarts of coolant mixed into the 7 quarts of oil. So yes I pulled 9 quarts of liquid out of the sump. 7 fresh quarts of oil and a new head gasket restored the oil pressure. Point of that story is, a little water from condensation isn't going to wreck your engine. It might cause some rust.

[jclausen]

You should get a Toyota or something if your drive is seven mins

[spyderg0d]

Smh.. Smmmhhhhh

[pbonsalb]

Just take the car on a longer drive once or twice a week. No need to not drive the car you like.

[spyderg0d]

Welp.. Changed oil. It was slightly wet.. The oil was like a olive green. But kinda thin.. Went to 10-30.. My vanos rattle subsided slightly. Lol. Now it rattles mostpy only when at coasting at speed.

[samy01]

Just curious, why do you guys often use conventional oil (i guess that means non-synthetic ?), and on top of that also ratings like 10W-30, which is worse for the engine at cold starts than a 5W or a 0W. Is that a price question ? Where i live i get 1 quart of Castrol 5W-40 synthetic for 3.60 Dollars, and if i wanted to get Castrol 0W-40 synthetic it'd cost 7 Dollars per quart. It is debatable if -30 is suitable for a high mileage engine, like alot of us do have, but there is absolutely no reason to have 10W over a 5W or a 0W. 5W or 0W are way better for the engine on cold starts in the winter.

[spyderg0d]

I use conventional just because of the price and how often i do oil changes.. I think the consensus on synthetic is even though its the same grade, its still a thinner oil at that grade, (exactly how its marketed as a smaller chemical chain) and also because of the usually higher detergent or the sort addativesb so it finds cracks in gaskets or the sort and can seep through, where sae has a higher surface tension and sort of doesnt seep out as much. Then theres also gasket or o ring or whatever plastic or rubber type,. Some do well with a type of oil over the other. I havent gotten that deep into our engines and whether or not that even comes to play, but its a factor on some manufacturers or models.
Also, i think the w is a wide range of variable.. Its certainly there for a reason.. Otherwise everyone would just have constant10wt oil or 20wt oil.. Or atleast they wouldnt bother selling. I honestly havent thoaght about it before. I think it is the difference between surface tension and viscosity.. Much like that slime stuff my kids play with, it can run like water and seep into the tiniest of cracks in my wood floor with a small wt number, but be unable to break apart with any sort of fast movement.. I assume this might be a big thing people over look in oilb or atleast they dont discuss in explanations.

[enf1945]

i was advised that in high mileage cars 0W40 can leak. too thin. I did use it once and started to see lower pan leaks. I use 10W40 synthetic.
I dont live in North Dakota. They have cold winter issues.

[samy01]

What makes you think that a 0w-40 ist thinner at operating temp than let's say a 10w-30 ? A Xw-40 oil is thicker at the same operating temp than any Xw-30, that's the reason for it's higher rear number rating. That's exactly what you want for a high mileage engine. The only scenario where a 0w-40 is thinner than a 10w-30 is when the engine is cold and it's sitting outside, and that's also what you want, on startup you want a thin oil so it can lubricate the engine fast. But still, at operating temp a 10w-30 is still thinner than a 0w-40 on a cold start, so a 0w-40 won't cause leaks, otherwise it would leak way earlier at operating temp with the 10w-30, too.

0w-40:

The first number says that this oil behaves in winter (cold start) the same as a SAE 0 oil.

The second number says that this oil behaves under operating temp the same as a SAE 40 oil.

the first number does not give you any information about viscosity under operating temp. that's what seems to confuse people.

that's why these oil are more expensive. they are able to withstand a bigger temperature range better.

[spyderg0d]

Indeed. ... What the fuck was i thinking? Uber brain fart..

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Good thing ive only driven like 50 miles max since the oil change. Back to a 10-40.