Innovadrive NXG-39 / OEM look Double DIN Fascial for the E38

[franco90]

So all credit goes to Dennis Please stand by until he posts what need to be done and how much and what you have to do to make it so here it is the final product


Hi everyone,


I'm pleased to announce the first custom manufactured solution from Innovadrive for BMW E39 owners!


The BMW E39 5 series OEM audio systems and packages have become outdated in recent years due to the fast paced nature of the car audio and electronics industry. Many owners have faced the dilemma of wanting to upgrade their cars to have the latest audio and safety features, but have been reluctant to lose the aesthetics within the dashboard. This issue has now been resolved with a new solution which combines the best of both worlds - the very latest technology and an OEM look !


The Innovadrive NXG-39 is a combination fascia and fitting kit allowing a double DIN head unit to be installed whilst maintaining the design aesthetic of the sought after OEM 16:9 monitor fitted to some E39's optioned at the factory.


Features & Highlights
* Combined fascia & fitting kit - Designed primarily for the latest generation of shallow depth head units the NXG-39 is a single piece solution. No extra fitting kits are required to be purchased and installed, additionally, the existing mounting holes in the dash pieces are utilized to securely mount it. The fitting process reqires a modest level of technical knowledge in order remove/refit the car's cabin trim and to make mounting holes on the fascia's inner mounting panels. The locations of those holes would be determined by whichever head unit is chosen.


* Design - Close resemblance to the OEM button and rotary knob sizing, shape and press feel to match the OEM 16:9 monitor. The rest of the design has been proportionally altered whilst cleverly maintaining OEM styling and aesthetics to suit the fitment of a larger double DIN head unit. Dimmable backlighting when connected to the cars loom is integrated along with a close resemblence to the car's original dash backlight colour. The laser etching for the characters and symbols is extremely precise as would be expected at this level of quality. The full cycle of design, CAD modeling, prototyping, manufacturing and finishing has all been in partnership with UK based automotive manufacturing specialists. Innovadrive's close involvement with each of these stages maintains very high quality standards and are similarly trusted by some of the worlds most famous marques such as Bentley, Jaguar Land Rover, Aston Martin, Rolls Royce etc.


* Strength & Resilience - An over engineered design results in an extremely sturdy item using the correct automotive grade materials and components throughout. Japanese (Matsushita) soft press buttons and LED's are specified for the PCB and the overall design of the electronics components. The fascia's strength is derived using CAD modeling where the best levels of strength were acheived for the entire piece taking into account technical characteristics of the actual material and moulding process.


* Automotive grade finishing - The specific automotive interior paint used to give a very high quality and robust finish has a light texture feel to it and is found in some of the worlds finest automobile manufacturers vehicles. Technical characteristics include excellent levels of UV, temperature and humidity resistance along with common contaminants often found in cars from different climates around the globe.


* Future development - A 'phase' 2 which is currently in initial stages of R&D - the button symbols and characters can be changed to custom choices as the PCB can recognise which button has been pressed. A separate control/interface unit can interpret those and can then subsequently be used to control other aftermarket products/features such as, heated seats, massaging seats, air ride controllers, TPMS systems etc. The development process will also evaluate the potential to relocate the OEM ASC, DSC, Sport, Window Blind switches.


Price: £239 inc UK delivery. Please get in touch if your location is in a higher delivery charge location or international for a customised shipping quote.


LAUNCH OFFER - 15% off for the first five BMW5 Gold Members ! (Please reply below to this thread with your name)


Pictures:
NXG-39 & Parrot Asteroid Smart installed in my own car













NXG-39 & Alpine iLX-700 installed in an M5










FAQ's
* Q - Can I fit a standard depth double DIN head unit? A - Absolutely! Just the modification to the cars airbox to make the space needed for the extra depth of the head unit is required to be done. Due to the strength of the NXG-39 design, there's no extra expense to get a fitting kit to hold the deeper head unit in place.
* Q - What do the buttons do? A - The buttons and rotary knob detail are for aesthetic purposes in order to give as best an OEM look to the fascia as possible. The minimum design specification was to have the buttons as backlit, dimmable and pressable. Future development and options means that the button caps can be swapped and the PCB connected to an interface unit to which specific aftermarket products can be connected and controlled. Innovadrive is currently developing these elements!
* Q - Can I fit my own screen panel and make use of the buttons the way I want? A - Definitely! with the NXG-39, you can choose which hardware you'd like to fit giving flexibility to any personal projects you may have in mind.
* Q - Why aren't there any fixing holes on the inner panels? A - Due to the myriad of head units, screens and other modular displays available and their differing fixing mount locations too many pre-made holes would need to be incorporated into those fixing panels.
* Q - Is the material easily drillable to make holes when installing? A - Yes, using a good sharp drill bit means only modest pressure and spin speed is needed when using a small drill.
* Q - When I switch the car lights on but the head unit is off, do the buttons illuminate? A - Yes! When connected to the correct panel illumination wire in the cars wiring loom. The intensity can also be varied by using the car's dimming wheel.
* Q - Whats the dimensions of the area to fit a head unit into? A - In order to fit a head unit like in the pictures, the bezel around it's screen panel needs measure within 172 x 96 mm. If a head unit's bezel dimension is slightly larger, then using a sharp file, some material can be removed to have the bezel fit snugly.



Cheers, Dennis!



PLEASE WAIT UNTIL DENNIS POST THE PRICE AND WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE

- - - Updated - - -

Hi,

I'll list model numbers here for the ones I know fit directly & others where slight/minimal modification is required , one unit for instance is 1mm too 'tall'

Direct Fitment head units;

Parrot Asteroid Smart (Discontinued. New old stock is still available from retailers from £375 and used units from around £175)
Alpine iLX-700 (Discontinued. New old stock is still available from retailers from £310 and used units from around £200)
Alpine iLX-W650 (Current model. USA model & needs to be imported in if outside the USA and costs around £310 inclusive of all taxes/VAT/Shipping)
Kenwood DMX7018DABS (Current Model. Typical discount retailer pricing is around £350+)
Kenwood eXcelon DMX706s (Current model. USA model & needs to be imported if outside the USA and costs around £330 inclusive of all taxes/VAT/Shipping)

The above head units are all Shallow depth physically meaning no requirement to cut/modify the cabin Airbox and also have been fitted by owners using the NXG-39.

Head units that require minimal modification of the NXG-39

Kenwood DMX125DAB - This unit is 1mm too tall to fit into the NXG-39's aperture for the 'nose' of the head unit to fit through. Filing/cutting down by 1mm will allow the unit to fit. Current model and typical UK Retail pricing is around £180. ( I have one of these I'm just about to fit into an NXG-39 by filing down by 1mm for test fitting & pictures)

Other shallow depth, fully features Double DIN head units

Sony XAV-AX3005DB - This unit has an 'L' shaped, single DIN full depth rear chassis but crucially, the chassis body sits above where the E39 cabin airbox is. Typical UK discounted retail price is around £300+
JVC KW-M745DBT - Shallow Depth double DIN. Typical UK discounted retail price is around £340+
JVC KW-M741BT - Shallow Depth double DIN. Typical UK discounted retail price is around £299+
Pioneer SPH-EVO62DAB-UNI - A new style of unit with a screen section mounted to a single DIN full depth chassis or, seems it's can be connected via a lead to have the chassis mounted elsewhere. I've not had a chance to get this unit physically in my hands to test as yet and currently seems to be the only unit from Pioneer UK that could work. Their other potential head units aren't shallow enough for clearing the E39 cabin air box.

I'm in regular contact with the above brands UK product management teams at their respective UK HQ's and feed back to them about making full feature and shallow enough depth head units for the 1995/6 to 2005/6 era BMW's from the 3,5,7 series and X5. The CES 2020 show is a couple weeks away now so keeping an eye if any new models are announced for release next year.

I'll create a separate thread with pictures of the units fitted with the NXG-39 in customers cars.

Cheers, Dennis!

[franco90]

Guys let’s do a group but I think it’s like under $300 x 40 guys and we can have this made.

Any takers


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[franco90]

BUMP

1. Franco90
2. 282HP

[282hp]

I'm interested.

Guys let’s do a group but I think it’s like under $300 x 40 guys and we can have this made.

Any takers


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[franco90]

I'm interested.

lol let see if we can get others I think This is worth it

[franco90]

I will post pics once I get a model for those that DON'T BELIEVE

- - - Updated - - -

Pricing is always something which needs careful consideration. To give you some context, there's other E39 specific fascia's which vary in price from £25 or so to around £160'ish. As Stu mentions above, none have any buttons/illumination for a much closer OEM look and you'd need to fabricate your own secure fitting solution. Some are oddly shaped and a little flimsy, the most expensive one requiring the cutting of the airbox to fit the mounting bracket. If a car audio shop needs to do that, then you'd be looking at perhaps 2/3 hours of labour charges on top. The NX-G39 I've designed to include the fitting solution for both traditional depth Double DIN and the latest shallow depth ones, there's nothing separate to fabricate/buy and you potentially save on any labour costs if professional fitting is needed as I'd say an hours worth of time is what would be charged. There's a few similar solutions for other brand and specific cars , one for an Audi TT which has no electronics/illumination for £349. I wish you good luck with your audio upgrade plan if it's my solution or any of the other existing ones that you go with.


Dan101 - There's two internal panels which are blank and leave perhaps 5-7mm gap to the head unit chassis. Given there's different head units out there which all have multiple screw holes, it's not feasible for me to have many holes drilled at manufacture. By looking at the head unit chosen to be used and test fitting, it can be determining where on the panel holes can be drilled to match the mounting holes on the head unit chassis. Some Hex head screws/bolts can be then used to securely fix the head unit in place. Some pics below;







DIY fitting ease was integral to my design and I'd say a modest level of DIY competence is needed. The head unit is first affixed to the NX-G39 and then the complete package installed into the car's dash.


Stu08 - I have all the same unit's you purchased as well ! Will try to modify them to re-purpose them somehow !


Cheers, Dennis!

[franco90]

I am getting this radio
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUguAHuFsMg

[DennisCooper]

Hi,

Franco - Thanks for your interest & discussion and now this thread to spread the word amongst E38 owners!

Et al - The NXG-39 is what I designed and manufacture for the E39 and my plans have always included doing an E38 version as well. The difference is the shape of the top front edge of the fascia as the OEM dash contours/shaping is slightly different between the E39 & E38 despite using the exact same 16:9 monitor unit. It's the finishing 'trim' ring which differs from the E39 to the E38 (and E53). I've not physically test fitted an NXG-39 into an E38 to see what it looks like, however my plan is to create an E38 specific shaped solution.

I will need to have a specific mould designed & manufactured once all sizing/fitment testing is completed and as I'm sure most of you will be aware, this requires significant investment in order to achieve the OEM quality level I manufacture at. I will get in touch with my specialist manufacturing partners to get cost levels in order to create the NXG-38. The good thing is the PCB & components, buttons are all shared with the NXG-39 so I don't have to design and develop those - just the main fascia mould for the specific E38 shape. Once I have the cost details I will update here along with timeframes etc. I'm thinking of a specific 'kick starter' type of setup where those who'd like one can pledge the funds in order to expedite the manufacturing process. Unit retail pricing will be 'similar' to the NXG-39 solution and in the interests of the project and owners wishing to have one, I will do the keenest pricing possible :

If there's any questions and feedback or ideas, please reply back on this thread to discuss, I'll take everything on board and respond back.

Cheers, Dennis!

[SilverIris]

I'm definitely interested in this, I've had an iBus interface sitting in the garage for over a year now. One thing that comes to mind about existing solutions is that using an E39 android unit in an E38 is that the HVAC duct/actuator on the right-hand side of the opening (for LHD cars, RHD may be mirrored). This seems to be what stops most standard-length (7" or 178mm) double din units from being installed.

Call me crazy, but I'm a bit oldschool and still listen to CDs. Lack of an optical drive in current plug & play units has been what stopped me from pulling the trigger on any existing E38/E39 aftermarket audio system so far. In the FAQ section, it is mentioned that modification to the airbox is needed to use a standard length double din unit. With existing units like the Xtrons ones, I've heard many different tales of "it wont fit no matter what" to "it'll disable the HVAC" to "just cut it", but it seems to get murkier with each telling of the story.

Since it is a rare treat to discuss such with the person whom created the mounting kit, I'm sure that everyone here would love to understand exactly what is needed for this modification, straight from the horse's mouth.

One thing I would suggest for easier mounting of the double din unit is to add slotted holes to the side rails. Most aftermarket install kits go this route to accommodate as many radio manufactures as realistically possible. You may wish to look at the Metra 95-2009 or 99-8231 kit's side plates to visualize as a template to create the best possible solution. If memory serves, most radios use M4x0.7 hardware for these areas.

[stevick]

SilverIris, I am just now installing an Xtrons 9" android unit in my 750 that was designed for the E53 - it is the "slim" unit, so it does not have the concerns with the HVAC box (the unit is very shallow as it has no integrated optical drive). It fits quite nicely in the dash. I have also installed the Resler interface w/DSP License. Since you are a CD guy, you should know that the Resler will control the original trunk CD Changer through the I-Bus app. It appears you will only have to create RCA female connections (L & R) for the CDC audio output and run an RCA interconnect to the head unit's aux RCA audio input. Let me know if you want more info on this. I had the whole thing mocked up and working in the trunk and just finished running the harness for the final dash install. I tried the CDC control through the I-Bus app - it shows the CDC control screen, but my CDC is acting up (makes strange noises when cassette is inserted) so I could not test it fully. I may pick up a CDC PI to replace it, once everything is installed.

[DennisCooper]

Hi,

SilverIris - Thanks for the response from you! I'll go through the various aspects you mention. With the E39, traditional depth double DIN head units can't sit back 'far enough' to then have the front of the units sit 'flush' with the dash contours. The lower rear edge of the head unit 'hits' the top front edge of the airbox. Modifying the airbox to create the room is possible and plnety of E39 guys over the years did that and then used a plain fascia to finish the front aesthetics off. The alternative was to use a fascia & fitting kit which 'tilted' the head unit up so that the lower rear edge of the head unit cleared the top front edge of the airbox. This meant no modification/cutting needed of the airbox, but the downside was the front upper edge of the head unit protruded out by 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch or or so and many E39 owners didn't like that. The cheap chinese units had a single DIN chassis with a specific car shaped face with a larger front screen fitted, the single DIN chassis sitting higher up, so clearing the airbox top front edge and still allowing a full depth chassis that contained the CD mechanism. I've heard in the E38, there's differences in the position of the airbox/airducts between LHD/RHD and I think also slight variances between model years. Developing specific fascia & fitting kits for me would be way too expensive. The trend over the last few years is omiting the disk mechanism as disk useage in the car is on a progressively increasing decline. More and more people are streaming their audio from online services as cellular signal and data quality increases and also, use of smaller USB sticks or SD cards becomes much easier to use and transport around not to mention have far more capacity than a audio CD disk. The 'shallow' depth head units mean there's no interference with the airboxes in BMW's so installation becomes much easier and for those who can't/don't wish to DIY, a lot cheaper to have a pro installer do the work. Specific now to the E38, given that some shallow depth head units are perhaps 7-9cm deep then chances are high that there'll not be any airbox/pipes interference between LHD & RHD examples - there should be enough space in all E38's. I say it this way as I've not physically been able to test. I need to check things out with each version of an E38 to see if anything does get in the way. Pending that confirmation, then it removes the issue you mention. I'd suggest to you copying your favourite CD's to a USB stick or Micro SD card and using that to 'play your CD's from' - you don't have to carry the original disks around and you can have much more capacity - ie carry most if not ALL of your music library around. Adding / deleting albums or tracks is easy, just unplug and take to your computer, make the changes and next time you go out to the car, just plug it back in.

I made the descision not to have mounting holes with the NXG-39 both for the side panels for fixing the unit in place and also the inner panels for fixing a head unit to for a few reasons. At the manufacturing level, the cost is increased as the mould tool needs to have machine movement from the 'sides' to create the mounting holes when the injection moulding of each piece takes place. Also, over time, the interiors of actual cars can change slightly but enough to be 'out of line' with pieces like this ie, the original mounting holes/screws have moved a bit. I'd potentially have customers saying my fascia holes don't line up with their particular car's interior mounting holes. Related to that, if I had pre made holes like you suggest by referencing the Metra kits, it'd be sods law a new head unit model comes out in the future where the mounting holes won't match up/are in a totally different position. By leaving these blank, it means a bespoke fitting to the car and head unit can be done and for some 'adjustibility' by making drilling the holes a few mm oversize and using washers, the fascia and head unit can be 'jiggled' for a better fitment before the fixing screws/bolts are tightened up.

(I'm away from home right now, so will edit this response to have some pictures later)

Stevick - I created the NXG-39 to give an OEM aesthetic when fitting a high quality, reliable head unit from one of the reputable car audio brands like Alpine, Sony, Kenwood, Pioneer and JVC. I have close links from before I designed the NXG-39 with the car audio industry (electronics and tech as a whole as well) and did my research and due diligence perhaps in late 2008 it was when the initial cheap chinese replacement head units first came about. I did this research with a view to being an importer/reseller here in the UK. Having previously been in the family business and importing products in from China, I saw it as a potential opportunity. However, once I spoke to industry representatives at trade shows here in the UK and the CES show in Vegas, talking to actual chinese electronics manufacturers at the same shows and directly, I found that the internal electronics for these units is at the generic level of quality, i.e cheapest. Given there's no proper support or warranty after sales channel for importers of these units, I quickly ended the idea of being a representive in the UK for such 'brands'. Over the last decade, the situation is pretty much the same as it was back then, low quality, generic level electronics, poor reliability, poor sound quality and problematic units with next to nil support for dealers. The price for some of these items was also laughable, some units costing more than a premium brand unit that was significantly better in every aspect except the OEM looks that BMW owners wanted. Whilst I know nowadays with the use of Android, and the Resler Interface, some of the chinese units can also now show IBus information, all other aspects remain as they always have been - poor reliability, poor sound quality, poor build, poor performance. I fully understand owners who don't really care about quality/reliability/performance and just want OEM looks and the 'functionality' to be there and all the various Chinese units exist for them. I created the NXG-39 for those who do prefer high quality and reliability with excellent performance for their money spent. I wish you good luck that your Xtrons works well and longer term for you in your E38 (and E53!)

Cheers, Dennis!

[bigperm206]

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[SilverIris]

Maybe the answer is simpler than you think? If memory serves, most Double DIN units have similar if not standardized mounting points. Adding these and slotting them slightly to account for dashboard warpage/manufacturing variances would be a wise choice.

A quick check on Ebay produced this:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Android-9-1...0AAOSwNopdyUb7

For comparison, check out this stock Mitsubishi 3000GT radio:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1993-99-MIT...EAAOSwdQhd6J6F

Those bolt holes sure look like they're in the same location. Seems like every shallow Double din unit uses the same 4 mounting holes, and ever regular double din unit also has them. The brackets with the referenced android unit seem like the perfect template.

I briefly pulled my stock 16:9 navigation screen last year for a 1/8" Aux in retrofit and it does seem like the HVAC actuators/ducting would present a problem with a standard 7" deep double din unit. That's why I've waited before giving it an android upgrade. While having the CD changer working via the Resler iBus adapter is pretty darn awesome (and I scored a CD changer magazine for $1 at the salvage yard a few months ago...), there are two downsides to it.

1. Switching discs requires getting out and opening the trunk. Not exactly handy in rain/snow.
2. It is limited by the capabilities of the original hardware (can't read MP3 discs/DVDs/etc)
Plus, I have an annoying habit of sending USB flash drives through the washer by forgetting they were in my pockets

For perspective, my 1997 Ford Expedition had its factory CD changer in the MASSIVE center console. When I removed it in favor of a $130 ebay Double Din Android unit a few years ago, it was a blessing. There's something about having everything work the first time, right out of the box, including the DVD player popping up when I feed it a DVD, CD player opening when fed a CD, etc.

It seems unbecoming that an E38 A/V setup would be less functional than a cheap ebay unit put in a Ford truck, wouldn't you agree? Since we're limited by depth on the E38, why not go with an external optical drive then? With a little work, one might fit in the center console storage box. If the OS can auto-recognize media from an external optical drive and launch the appropriate software like my Expedition's android unit can, that would sell me completely on it.

There was an optional cassette storage box for that location. Kind of like BMW was trying to tell us something...

[DennisCooper]

Hi SilverIris,

I'd never use a chinese head unit as any kind of reference point ! chances are the mount holes will be off by a few mm!

I understand where you are coming from to include ready made mounting holes in my designs. I can do exactly what you are suggesting, however it increases development and machining costs for the mould tool and then also the manufacturing run for the pieces as I'd have to use the mould in a more complex and thus, expensive to run/use machine. That'd translate to higher production costs and thus higher retail pricing! For those reasons I decided not to make pre-existing holes. Other reasons are that I leave the choice of what to mount up to the customer, I know some for instance will want to install just a stand alone screen and use with a CarPC or Raspberry Pi type solution and as those don't have standard double DIN head unit fixings/locations, its best to leave a 'blank' panel so that any mounting solution/kit they do use can be fixed anywhere without incurring a 'hole'.

For your second point, then the E38 audio setups were designed back in the mid 1990's as well, with updates and variants coming out over the next 5 years which overlapped the E39/E46/E53 series cars. The cheap chinese option does give you the modern functionality for not much money, which as per my last response, fine if you aren't overly concerned with quality/reliability. When it comes to BMW's many opwners want better or significantly better quality/performance but as the cars get older and more of them are less well looked after, the 'cheap' retail pricing for the head unit becomes more tempting. Again, that's fine for those owners who aren't overly bothered with quality and reliability, and just want something that gives sound, does GPS and allows mobile phone hands free. As many have found out the hard way, those units often/more than likely don't last long or begin to have issues/problems and plenty have then found their $250-350 USD head unit either stops working completely or causes a lot of frustration.

I guess losing a small USB stick with copies of your favourite CD's in the washing machine, is better than opening the car door and dropping the original CD's on the road/them getting bent or scratched when handling in the car etc ! The reason no one has added a CD slim drive to the OEM E38 audio setup is that those using CD's will just use the OEM CD changer, no point in creating extra work for little gain to install a slim CD drive somewhere near the drivers seat!

My NXG-39 (NXG-38) is for those who want an OEM level quality fascia & fitting kit to easily and quickly install a modern shallow depth high quality head unit and have excellent OEM aesthetics at the same time

Cheers, Dennis!

[SilverIris]

After a few PMs with Dennis, I have come to the following conclusions. Unfortunately, it's pretty much a dead stop on every single one, and I realistically don't see this idea coming to fruition. Fair warning, I am a BRUTAL critic when it comes to anything that could go into my own E38.

I come from Mazda Rotaries, where a hard critique is the difference between driving home and being towed off the track with a blown engine. Few terms can justify a price jump are "Efini" "20B" "Eunos" "Infini" and "Spirit R" because each of them are exceedingly limited production. Only 1500 Spirit R's were made and 1000 Infini IVs. I do not see any terms that are analogous here that would be applicable to this product. As for aftermarket products, "RE-Amemiya" "Finish Line" "FEED" are the red-letter names. Finish Line being rarely-purchased dealer-only accessories in the 1980s, to which most did not survive.

First off is the price, relative to the current price of the E38. Nobody in their right mind is going to spend $300+ for a plastic radio bracket when the car was $3000 or so. Even FD RX7s, known for expensive, fragile trim are a hard sell even when made from Carbon Fiber at such a price. Currently the 4-piece interior trim kit (cluster hood, gauge trim, radio trim, shifter trim) is $650 in full carbon fiber.

Second is the materials. Dennis has touted "automotive grade" a few times when I inquired about materials, but never specified. To the well-read petrolhead, this is code for "we pulled it out of Ford's dumpster". Based on similar products, I would wager common ABS plastic, no different than a cheap Scosche mounting kit. ABS falls apart when it sees UV light from the sun. My 1986 RX7 hatch louvers were one of 4 survivors in the US, I sold it to see reproductions made out of better materials. Those are made out of steel, or carbon fiber if desired.

As for the electronic components, a TIP120 transistor is the same no matter what shiny name is on the package. Same with resistors, capacitors, ICs, etc. Do your homework, and you can use parts from anywhere wtith no issues whatsoever. Show me materials datasheets from their manufacturers and I'll be a bit more forgiving.

Third is the manufacturing method: Plastic molding is labor-intensive in a miserable environment and requires constant babysitting of the equipment by several people. In such a place, average person with any sanity would not be in. Cost goes up because the manufacturer can't keep people. I've seen it firsthand, time and time again. CNC is a one-person operation where you press the "go" button and walk away. The rest is all in the CAD drawing's accuracy.

Fourth is the "structural logic". This is made as a single complicated piece with LOTS of ways it can go wrong due to complexity. Literally EVERY other radio bracket is 2-3 pieces because it is easier to make (cost goes down), simpler to make (cost goes down more), easier to package (more units shipped per box) and installation is straightforward.

Fifth is what I like to call "Reinvention Complex", where one's attitude toward off-the-shelf parts is complete refusal because they believe they're too good for such. For example, the knobs on the E39 version were painstakingly re-created when the original BMW parts can be bought from FCP Euro for $9 each and use the industry-standard D-shaft potentiometer. Let's be realistic, they're not original 1953 Corvette parts.

Sixth is "Chrysler Syndrome". DIN standards work just fine. Simply put, some guys got together in the 1970s and they all hammered out a single standard for car radios to make manufacturing easy. It went into use in 1984, though some companies did so earlier. It's quite literally all the same s**t, the bolt holes are all the same, and it's been working flawlessly for nearly 40 years. But apparently, it's just too hard to put standardized holes on this radio bracket...

While I can appreciate the effort in fabricating the buttons to the original fit/finish, and a PCB to suit, those are unfortunately the only pluses I see on this bracket. Without the buttons, it's a $20 part that anyone can and has made. So, what makes this better than the 'cheap/flimsy' ones?

[franco90]

This is Getting interesting

[franco90]

So I want to do an update thinking of getting
Alpine iLX-W650




and use Sirius-XM SIR-ALP1 off my old intravee II set up .

Dennis do you think this will work

[SilverIris]

I don't see why it wouldn't work. Looks like a fairly standard shallow Double DIN unit. But to be completely honest, the manufacturer of a radio bracket cannot realistically be expected to perfectly fit every possible radio choice due to differences in their individual fascias/trim rings. It's just the way it is. But at the same time, there is a solution to this and the other points I mentioned. A small redesign of the button pods so that they attach to the Double DIN rails will make them much better.

Dennis, let me preface this by saying you have a great idea with the button pods and I really like it. How exactly do they interface with with the radio to perform their desired functions? In the pictures, I see two wires which seem to be for backlighting, but nothing else.

Each time a button is pressed, the current front-mount setup is loaded in tension (being stretched). Force is imparted on the material in a concentrated area where it is weakest due to tiny cross-section, where the screws thread into plastic cylinders on the fascia/faceplate. This is a well-known issue with 86-91 RX-7 headlight/wiper switch mounts, they crack and crumble because it is made of sun-damaged ABS. Gluing it back together means it cracks right next to the repaired area, resulting in a "treadmill" of repairs.

By making the button pods rear mount instead of front mount (similar to a PC motherboard) and then attaching them to the DIN slots (radio mounting holes) with a 90 degree bracket, it further simplifies the product and works to the material's strengths while avoiding its weaknesses. Add a brace for triangulation and the entire setup becomes a LOT stronger as you're loading it in compression (pushing together) over a MUCH larger area and using geometry so the material can do the best job it can. It's how bridges are built. Plus, it means you can use them with any E39/E38 radio bracket such as the ones from Scosche or Metra

The end user can cut out the button/knob holes with a dremel and finish to their liking. Or you can offer those as an add-on service, similar to what the NXG-39 in its current form.

Your specialized top-level molding/manufacturing partners aren't going to tell you this stuff. Their goal is you spending the most money per unit and making them as cheaply as possible so they break and have to be replaced. It's against their interests to save the customer money.

If you redo the button pods as I suggested and offer them separately with a schematic for proper interfacing at a realistic price that respects your time/labor and the average owner, it will sell like you couldn't imagine. Overall, it's a great base idea, but just needs a couple tweaks for it to truly shine and be put in the hands of EVERY E38/E39 owner. Send me a button pod set with a schematic for proper interfacing and I'll prototype it for you.

[SilverIris]

So I just found this:
https://forum.bmw5.co.uk/topic/41137...-not-required/

In this link, Dennis mentions two versions, one with and one without tilt for clearing the E39 HVAC system.

Except for the vertical "channels" (fill in with some plastic welding), this is pretty much exactly what I was thinking. Looks like there are generic clones of the non-tilt version on Ebay, but lacking the white/silver "ring" bracket (first picture, upper right corner). Wouldn't be too difficult to fab up some button pod brackets for a retrofit too.

How about it Dennis? Looks like you already created the solution 10 years ago. How about adding those nice button pods to it, like I suggested in my last post? Would be a LOT less work and you'd sell a lot more button pods which is kind of the point of this thread

[DennisCooper]

Hi,

I'm away from home for a few days and likely back later during this upcoming weekend - a more comprehensive reply then - Thanks

Franco - The iLX-W650 is an excellent choice & a number of E39 owners have this head unit and very happy with it given it's very keen pricing level !

SilverIris - I'll respond back to you and your various points very soon!

Cheers, Dennis!

[franco90]

so now I have to buy the custom harness to go from front to the back of the car
Dennis any ideas on what harness to buy

[LongRuf]

Subscribed!!

[franco90]

Subscribed!!

trust me this is going to be bad ass I promised you

[franco90]

harness



option 1
https://www.germanaudiotech.com/prod...n-radio-system

option 2
https://www.installer.com/item/displ...hp?it=ct20bm05

[franco90]

ok got the harness ALL wire up with an old kenwood dvd radio I have sound and everything works I am using the oem amp AND OEM bm53 radio