Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: 2003 325xi Starts, Idles, Dies (help!!!)

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6
    My Cars
    2003 325xi

    Exclamation 2003 325xi Starts, Idles, Dies (help!!!)

    Hey there,

    Iím 17 w a 2003 325xi, with a pretty low budget and some handy garage tools

    so hereís my story with my e46 so far...

    about a month or two ago I went out to start my car in the morning, and nothing. The car wouldnít even cold start. Eventually after jumpstarting the car, I can get the car to idle at least for a few seconds before the rpm drops and the car just dies - I honestly have no clue what it is at this point. Iíve gone through countless forums and threads in addition to what YouTube had to offer, but I seem to keep coming up empty handed. So far Iíve replaced spark plugs, cleaned the ICV, replaced the battery, rebuilt the DISA valve assembly, replaced the fuel filter, replaced the crankshaft position sensor, and previously checked for any possible vacuum leaks, etc. Itís all just a big mess at this point. When I turn the key, I can hear the fuel pump working, donít know if that would be the issue but it doesnít appear to sound that way.

    i read somewhere that it could be a blown fuse, or the intake/exhaust camshaft sensors

    Iím currently working on putting the intake manifold back into place, as the crankshaft position sensor was a b***h to get to.

    Anyways, if anyone is to come across this post and has any input or advice they could lend me, it would be greatly appreciated. Iíll keep searching for now. Godspeed

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    ATLANTA GA
    Posts
    88
    My Cars
    456 X3s

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Oldham UK
    Posts
    2,590
    My Cars
    '00 330i Sprt '92 525i
    Go back to basics. Find out if you have a reliable fuel supply and spark. You know that the pump sounds like it is priming when you turn the key. But you need to confirm that the fuel pressure and flow rate are in spec. Also confirm that when the engine dies, you still have spark when you crank it. Do the plugs stink of fuel or are they dry?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    Test fuel pressure at the rail using the Shrader valve. Turn ignition to position 2 but donít start engine. Pressure should read 50 psi.

    Turn ignition off, wait 20 minutes, then make sure it is still 50. First test is for the pump, second for the filter.

    Once that is done replace your pre-cat o2 sensors if they are older than 100k.

    Then get OBDfusion and a veepeak adaptor and start logging. Most important is LTFTs and MAF airflow. You may need a new MAF and may still have vacuum leaks.

    Did you replace the DISA oring? Did you check the dipstick oring? Did you replace the 1/4Ē vacuum line for the sap (behind the manifold). Did you check that the caps are still in place at the rear of the manifold?

    I suspect you are running lean, and some combination of leaks, fuel pump and sensors is to blame. Far more likely to be o2 than cps. And very likely fuel pump.

    Please donít buy an eBay fuel pump. Get VDO/Siemens

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6
    My Cars
    2003 325xi

    Question Interrogation

    Wow, I really was not expecting this level of support from this thread. Damn!

    ill try and provide as much detail and questions I have in each of these replies as I can..

    Unfortunately I don’t have a fuel pressure gauge or any other gauge handy that I can tinker with, so I previously did actually pop the cap off the shrader valve and take a flathead to the pin, and quite a bit of gas came out for the little amount of pressure I applied to the center pin (thankfully I had a rag handy). I may just have to invest the $ into getting that gauge, but I’d rather avoid that for the time being, if possible.

    For the old spark plugs (which were replaced) they all seem to be pretty dry. There’s some oil in the threads of them, but other than that the coil packs, etc. seemed dry.

    ill have to go ahead and order some pre-cat o2 sensors, as my car’s running probably ~160k miles on her.

    Tomorrow after school I’ll have to do some more investigating, but I will note that I did replace the DISA oring, however I have not yet looked into the dipstick oring, nor have I begun to replace any sort of vacuum lining.

    ALTHOUGH, I did just come across something interesting, though my guts telling me this wasn’t the only issue:
    - on this black cylindrical vacuum unit, right around the starter and crankshaft position sensor, there’s a male plastic end where a small vacuum line should connect to -... (part number :: 1740207)
    Any idea where this line leads to, or what symptoms would come of this?? Knowing the size of the line may help a little as well

    Anyways, one thing I forgot to mention at the very beginning of this thread is that the system isn’t throwing any codes when I boot up the obdII scanner. That’s kind of the reason this whole process has been as extensive as it is. Could either of my camshaft sensors be causing a problem?? You guys are f***ing awesome btw - completely blew my mind when I checked the bookmark earlier.

    {I’ll try an attach photos of the spark plugs and the vacuum unit at some point tonight}
    D751FED1-92FF-4741-9FD9-8B83F4CEFAFA.jpgDC661480-A2C8-429D-B301-1C0409A95B80.jpg

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    That is a vacuum tank that helps actuate the exhaust flapper. On this diagram:
    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...28#18101740207

    There is a t fitting (I think!) that comes off of the manifold to the tank. The other end goes to a hose that goes to the back of the car.

    If the vacuum line is not connected to the tank, that would be a meaningful vacuum leak.

    Btw, the OBD app is not for codes in this case, it is for diagnosing fuel trims.

    Donít focus on the plugs. They are not the issue. You have a vacuum leak and old sensors and maybe a failing fuel pump.
    Last edited by harrier; 05-23-2019 at 09:31 PM.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6
    My Cars
    2003 325xi
    Thx harrier,

    ill make sure to download that app and give it a shot tmrw at some point if I get that far.

    Any insight you could give me as to where I should be checking now for vacuum leaks or bad sensors? The hoses and intake boots I’ve taken out thus far seem to be in good shape.

    I happen to have the intake manifold out, so anything you guys could think of that would be faulty with that manifold would be greatly appreciated.

    btw, is that adapter just a normal obdII adapter (?) or is it a specific thing I need to get somewhere.

    Thanks for all the help.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    If you have an OBD Bluetooth adaptor, it may work with OBDfusion. Otherwise get the veepeak Bluetooth LE adaptor.

    As for sensors, there are the pre-cat o2 sensors that tell the emissions control module to adjust fuel to optimize the fuel air ratio. These have a 100k lifespan up to the 2003 mode year and 125k after. If you are meaningfully beyond that mileage just replace them. The other sensor is the MAF, which is the last part I would replace. They seem to soft fail around 150k and definitely cause driveability issues. Sadly they are hard to diagnose and cost money, so I would do the o2 sensors, focus on vacuum leaks and check fuel trims first.

    The manifold itself wonít leak, only the various things that attach like DISA, vacuum lines. Get it put back together.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Oldham UK
    Posts
    2,590
    My Cars
    '00 330i Sprt '92 525i
    Your O2 sensors may be past their best but you have to question whether they are causing your problem. When you first start the car, they are in 'open loop'. That is just shorthand for the DME is ignoring them. I don't believe you will get meaningful fuel trims until your coolant temp is above 75C. Which is a bit of a problem as your car does not run long enough to reach that temperature. You don't have any fault codes indicating that the mixture is lean so it is difficult to advise where to look for a vacuum leak when you may not have one.

    Just so we are clear, maybe confirm that the car will start and run fine (without misfires) for a few seconds - but then it dies? And that you cant keep it running by putting your foot on the gas pedal

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    I would definitely deal with testing fuel supply.

    A vacuum leak can definitely cause stall no start, and since you were messing with the intake the odds something is disconnected or misconnected is quite high.

    I say replace o2 sensors because you are in there and they are going to be a problem so get them out of the way.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    ATLANTA GA
    Posts
    88
    My Cars
    456 X3s
    Let's look the gas pedal itself. Didn't I read some time ago there is a sensor or sorts. Here's my thinking Do you know the one part of the body that is slowest to heal?.....yes, the foot! Now moving our thinking to the automobile on every trip... no matter how long or short the trip the one aspect of the car (there are many) that is sure to get a workout is,,, you got it the gas pedal.

    Sent from my SM-J727T using Tapatalk

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Oldham UK
    Posts
    2,590
    My Cars
    '00 330i Sprt '92 525i
    ^ That is a fair shout. My understanding is that the throttle pedal has two sensors on it as a sort of fail safe. So if one goes rogue, the DME ignores it and takes its input from the good one. Not yet clear if the engine can be kept running by pressing the throttle pedal. Or if pressing it actually kills it

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6
    My Cars
    2003 325xi
    Hey there,

    so under further inspection i think i may have found an issue:

    i started looking at the intake intake manifold itself, and found that on the backside where smaller lines can be found there seemed to be multiple issues.

    FE69B49F-150F-4B6C-9595-4F30FF8F4473.jpg2D81ADEF-E09F-4366-A734-C86792EF31DA.jpgB2359838-034F-47E4-B184-41C8CB9304DB.jpg

    By some crazy coincidence I believe I may have found the missing part that connects two of those lines (b/w plastic piece) laying on the garage floor, from what i’m guessing was long before I attempted taking out the manifold or even diagnosing the issue at large.

    the lines are all in pretty rough shape so I’m thinking it may be best to just go ahead and replace all of them, along with that plastic connector, if possible. I also only found one “cap” in the back still in place, so I’ll have to order new, although I don’t recall which stumps they pair with.

    other than that, nothing really stood out to me, but I’ve attached photos in case my judgement is off. I heard that a gasket on the manifold generally might need replacing before putting it back together, so if anyone knows what it may be called, or where that gasket is, it would be appreciated greatly.

    tonight I’m going to order those pre-cat O2 sensors, since the manifold will be out for a little while longer than I expected, so I might as well replace them. I’ll try and figure out the name of that gasket to replace, and tomorrow maybe stop by the local shop and find some vacuum lining to replace the sh*tters I found.

    Anyways, my apologies it took a little time for me to get back to y’all. I appreciate the continued help.

    Also, a happy Memorial Day, for those who celebrate.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Oldham UK
    Posts
    2,590
    My Cars
    '00 330i Sprt '92 525i
    I would not put the manifold back without new gaskets. If you are not sure which hoses go where, this may help:
    https://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1075402

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    Did you ever test the fuel pump? I know it is making noise, but is it generating 50 psi?

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6
    My Cars
    2003 325xi
    Unfortunately i haven't yet tested the fuel pump to make sure i was getting 50 psi. I was planning on checking that after I reassemble the intake manifold.

    I just went ahead and ordered new pre-cat o2 sensors (those would be described as "front"/"upstream" o2 sensors, correct?), new gaskets for the manifold itself and for the throttle body, and that special socket you need to remove the oxygen sensors. The store wasn't open today for the holiday, but I'm hoping to pick up some vacuum tubing tomorrow for the smaller tubes at the back of the manifold.

    Would anyone happen to know which size the vacuum hoses are? I tried doing some digging but I didn't have much luck. I'll reference a piece of the hose when I go to the shop, but it's always nice to know beforehand i guess lol.

    I'll work on getting the new parts on this week, and hopefully by the weekend or sooner (if I have the time) I'll have the manifold fully assembled and back together to see if we've solved the issue or not.

    Slowly but surely, boys, we'll have her back on the road...

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    Hoses are 3.5x1.8 and ideally silicon or viton. However 1/8" vacuum hose works.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6
    My Cars
    2003 325xi
    So I just got the intake manifold and everything else put back into place and went to start it...

    ... and unfortunately the car didn't start over. You can hear the car trying to turn over but it just never gets there. Battery was at about 11-something volts, but I entertained the idea of jumpstarting it. Nothing good came of that either. The computer still isn't throwing codes and I ensured that the issue was not vacuum related. My thoughts are that now it has to be an electrical issue: failing starter, failing fuel pump, or ignition coils maybe?, not sure.

    I tried my spare key and even tried clearing the DTC for the hell of it, but that didn't seem to solve my problem either.

    So now this is my track record with the pita:
    - new spark plugs
    - new crankshaft position sensor
    - new intake manifold and throttle body gaskets
    - new o2 sensors (pre-cat)
    - new fuel filter
    - cleaned ICV
    - replaced torn, old vacuum hoses with new ones at the back of the intake manifold

    I'll attach a video of the start attempt to give you all a little more insight later on, but for now I'm just going to call it a night.
    *sigh

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Mill Valley, CA
    Posts
    96
    My Cars
    2003 330cic
    Quote Originally Posted by pita325xi View Post
    So I just got the intake manifold and everything else put back into place and went to start it...

    ... and unfortunately the car didn't start over. You can hear the car trying to turn over but it just never gets there. Battery was at about 11-something volts, but I entertained the idea of jumpstarting it. Nothing good came of that either. The computer still isn't throwing codes and I ensured that the issue was not vacuum related. My thoughts are that now it has to be an electrical issue: failing starter, failing fuel pump, or ignition coils maybe?, not sure.

    I tried my spare key and even tried clearing the DTC for the hell of it, but that didn't seem to solve my problem either.

    So now this is my track record with the pita:
    - new spark plugs
    - new crankshaft position sensor
    - new intake manifold and throttle body gaskets
    - new o2 sensors (pre-cat)
    - new fuel filter
    - cleaned ICV
    - replaced torn, old vacuum hoses with new ones at the back of the intake manifold

    I'll attach a video of the start attempt to give you all a little more insight later on, but for now I'm just going to call it a night.
    *sigh
    Have you tested the fuel pump yet? If the engine is not getting adequate fuel is not going to run. Making noise is not an adequate test.

    Also, get OBDFusion and log the fuel trims. If your fuel trims are high at idle and then balance out, then you still likely have vacuum leaks. If they stay high as the engine revs, then you likely have an issue with fuel delivery and/or the MAF. Also, make sure the DISA and the dipstick o-rings seal correctly.

Similar Threads

  1. 2003 540i Starts, then dies. Need help
    By hoontastik in forum General BMW Mechanical Help sponsored by RM European Auto Parts
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 05-25-2017, 01:01 PM
  2. 2003 325xi starting issue
    By tcool1 in forum General BMW Mechanical Help sponsored by RM European Auto Parts
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 12-17-2012, 11:26 PM
  3. 2001 X5 3.0i Starts and Dies - HELP
    By spngr311 in forum 1999+ X5, X6 (E53, E70, E71, F15, F16)
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 04-08-2011, 10:16 PM
  4. Car starts then dies!!! Help!!!!
    By iDrift in forum 1999 - 2006 (E46)
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 11-05-2008, 01:45 PM
  5. m50 starts, then dies. help, please...
    By MIKe30 in forum 1991 - 1999 (E36)
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-18-2007, 06:26 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •