Car gets flooded over night

[tritschalex]

m54 is the 525/530 engine, 2001 and up. you have one of the m52 engines,yours being a 528, dunno which as you have no year of your car posted. are you getting a smell of raw gas from the exhaust when first cranking in the morn? this would be an indication of flooding. that your fuel pressure held for 45 mins at 50 psi with the engine off kinda tells that youre not bleeding fuel in to the cylinders, or anywhere else. have you access to a compression tester to prove/disprove the compression theory? borewash would be raw gas washing oil off the inner wall of the cylinders, lessening the oil coating, reducing compression by not allowing the piston rings to seal well to the unoiled cylinder walls. but you dont know this is happening in your car.

Yes I’m getting a raw gas smell out the pipes, I don’t think the tester was reading properly I tested again with a brand new tester today and it went down after about 20 minutes slowly but enough over night I’m guessing to do this borewash issue . New update car is driving great now ! I bought a new maf sensor and boot put that in and popped a code for the idle control sensor that it was stuck . I took it off hit it with brake cleaner and got it freed up reinstalled it and no codes no engine light and car idles amazing no issues with the ac on nothing !! I’m very happy can’t wait till tomorrow morning to see if this borewash happens again now that I hit the road a bit with the new gas and sensors . I will update you tomorrow thanks allot for the info it has been a blessing !!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[tritschalex]

m54 is the 525/530 engine, 2001 and up. you have one of the m52 engines,yours being a 528, dunno which as you have no year of your car posted. are you getting a smell of raw gas from the exhaust when first cranking in the morn? this would be an indication of flooding. that your fuel pressure held for 45 mins at 50 psi with the engine off kinda tells that youre not bleeding fuel in to the cylinders, or anywhere else. have you access to a compression tester to prove/disprove the compression theory? borewash would be raw gas washing oil off the inner wall of the cylinders, lessening the oil coating, reducing compression by not allowing the piston rings to seal well to the unoiled cylinder walls. but you dont know this is happening in your car.

Ok new update car started great this morning!!! Very happy I drove all night got on 95 and ran the cobwebs out of it ! It has a little lag in power on the gas pedal at first but picks it self up after and is gone in the wind ! She runnnssssss !! Haha I’m happy as a pig in Sh!t .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JimLev]

Just to let you know the spec on fuel pressure drop is 7PSI or less in 20 min.
It leaks back thru the regulator to the tank.

[geargrinder]

You might have just had some gummy stuck injectors that were leaking an assload of gas over night. They might have cleaned up just from driving, since modern gas tends to have 'cleaners' in it already. I'd prob run extra Techron for a few tanks of gas but fingers crossed it keeps running well.

[Mike WW]

You might have just had some gummy stuck injectors that were leaking an assload of gas over night. They might have cleaned up just from driving, since modern gas tends to have 'cleaners' in it already. I'd prob run extra Techron for a few tanks of gas but fingers crossed it keeps running well.

Having tried an assortment of different FI cleaners with the aforementioned E28, I found plain Techron, not cleaner with Techron, was the only one that did any good at all. I forget what all I tried, but they included one from Redline, whose products I generally think well of. Techron's a little on the pricey side, but IMO it's the only one that works at all.

[tritschalex]

You might have just had some gummy stuck injectors that were leaking an assload of gas over night. They might have cleaned up just from driving, since modern gas tends to have 'cleaners' in it already. I'd prob run extra Techron for a few tanks of gas but fingers crossed it keeps running well.

Yup fingers crossed , I get a slight lag in throttle with the ac on sorta feels like no power till like 2500 rpm gotta step on the gas a little to get it past that and then runs fine . Not horrible to whereyou can’t drive but enough to notice power loss and lag . Might just be the intake manifold Needs a good cleaning


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[geargrinder]

Having tried an assortment of different FI cleaners with the aforementioned E28, I found plain Techron, not cleaner with Techron, was the only one that did any good at all. I forget what all I tried, but they included one from Redline, whose products I generally think well of. Techron's a little on the pricey side, but IMO it's the only one that works at all.

Yeah I think a number of places have tested a ton of those additives and found only a very few - Techron being the main one - that did anything. Yeah I forgot they have those confusing variations... IIRC the "cleaner with Techron" is cheaper and probably purely exists because some people choked on the price of 'real' Techron. The other one is probably same exact stuff just diluted!

Yup fingers crossed , I get a slight lag in throttle with the ac on sorta feels like no power till like 2500 rpm gotta step on the gas a little to get it past that and then runs fine . Not horrible to whereyou can’t drive but enough to notice power loss and lag . Might just be the intake manifold Needs a good cleaning

MMMMmmm I doubt that the intake manifolds cleanliness has anything to do with anything. On WOT stomps the AC clutch will cut back for a second so you probably are purely just feeling that. With a car like this just keep driving it for a while and see where things lie. A lot of symptoms might be 'temporary' until gum and cobwebs (figurative cobwebs) get cleaned out.

[JimLev]

BG44K is better than Techron, costs even more and needs to be pumped into the fuel rail at the test port, not dumped into the tank. I bought a case of it years ago, all gone now.
Been using Techron concentrate since then. Autozone has Techron on sale a few time a year.

[geargrinder]

BG44K is better than Techron, costs even more and needs to be pumped into the fuel rail at the test port.

I've heard that stuff was good too and I know that there's pro gear to pump stuff into the rail directly, but how'd you do that Jim? Outboard fuel pump? Ultimately the best thing of course is to pull the injectors and clean 'em, and an ultrasonic cleaning is DIY'able and works pretty good, but its a lot harder to do the pressure-cleaning side of it that the cleaner shops do.

I do have a spare fuel rail, I could probably rig up a jig, would have to figure something out for the injector drivers... Either some setup with an ECU that allows injector triggering, or setup some kind of micro/arduino/Rpi/etc. setup + a bank of motor/solenoid drivers...

[tritschalex]

Yeah I think a number of places have tested a ton of those additives and found only a very few - Techron being the main one - that did anything. Yeah I forgot they have those confusing variations... IIRC the "cleaner with Techron" is cheaper and probably purely exists because some people choked on the price of 'real' Techron. The other one is probably same exact stuff just diluted!



MMMMmmm I doubt that the intake manifolds cleanliness has anything to do with anything. On WOT stomps the AC clutch will cut back for a second so you probably are purely just feeling that. With a car like this just keep driving it for a while and see where things lie. A lot of symptoms might be 'temporary' until gum and cobwebs (figurative cobwebs) get cleaned out.

You seem to be right ! It seems to be I just need to drive it more it’s getting better and better as I put more miles on it , I’m at 45 miles of driving now and she’s doing great, no more cold start issues at all . Hopefully that lag in power goes away it seems to not be as much of a issue in sport shift if that helps any ,it acts as is I’m trying to floor it in last gear if I take off fast in normal drive from a stop light , but if I manually shift to first or don’t slow down all the way it runs fine .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JimLev]

I've heard that stuff was good too and I know that there's pro gear to pump stuff into the rail directly, but how'd you do that Jim? Outboard fuel pump? Ultimately the best thing of course is to pull the injectors and clean 'em, and an ultrasonic cleaning is DIY'able and works pretty good.

Yes, I had the injectors out of the rail, connected to an external fuel pump, and used a 555 timer circuit to pulse them on/off. They were spraying into a bottle that the pump would suck from so I didn't need to watch it.
Then sprayed each one for 10 sec into a graduated cylinder to verify they were spraying the same.

I've read some guys have used the small ultrasonic cleaner from Harbor Freight.

[DennisG01]

Thanks all, for the clarification on flooding in a FI engine!

Trits... Maybe you should check out your AC compressor/pulley? If that's hanging up, maybe that's causing the lag issue you're having due to drag? On my 528 I can remove the AC belt as it's a separate belt than the main belt. I assume it's the same for yours? It's pretty quick and easy to do, as well. With the belt removed, you can also drive around - see if the issue goes away or stays.

[geargrinder]

Yes, I had the injectors out of the rail, connected to an external fuel pump, and used a 555 timer circuit to pulse them on/off. They were spraying into a bottle that the pump would suck from so I didn't need to watch it.
Then sprayed each one for 10 sec into a graduated cylinder to verify they were spraying the same.

I've read some guys have used the small ultrasonic cleaner from Harbor Freight.

Cool. Might have to make a rig some day.

Some fancy pro setups I've seen combo the 2 so the injectors are sitting in ultrasonic WHILE the cleaner blasted through them. Seems a lot of work.

Yeah I had a tiny HFT ultrasonic. It was OK but crapped out eventually. My father handmedowned a basically brand big ol' industrial / lab grade stainless unit tho' with fluid heating and everything and its phenomenal.

[tritschalex]

Thanks all, for the clarification on flooding in a FI engine!

Trits... Maybe you should check out your AC compressor/pulley? If that's hanging up, maybe that's causing the lag issue you're having due to drag? On my 528 I can remove the AC belt as it's a separate belt than the main belt. I assume it's the same for yours? It's pretty quick and easy to do, as well. With the belt removed, you can also drive around - see if the issue goes away or stays.

It seems to do it without the ac on too just not as much to notice, I work on allot of American cars and trucks so I know what to hear and look for but I don’t believe it’s the Ac . I think it’s a sensor or something, I’m gunna keep driving and check the codes this week see if anything pops up , as of now she’s running good gets me to work and back .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[geargrinder]

it seems to not be as much of a issue in sport shift if that helps any ,it acts as is I’m trying to floor it in last gear if I take off fast in normal drive from a stop light , but if I manually shift to first or don’t slow down all the way it runs fine .

Re-reading this, I think this might actually be "operating as designed".

A 528 slushbox in D ain't exactly a drag monster, esp with the AC on.

The trans in the car is 'intelligent' so it does adapt to how its being driven, generally these ZF boxes fall back to being sluggish unless you're constantly punching it or keep it in Sport. Sport is a lot different than D.

You could try changing trans fluid and see if that helps (any idea if that's ever been done?) and that's probably a good idea anyway but I'd strongly consider this just being how its supposed to be.

[BimmrMeUpSnotty]

My 525, current and past 528’s never slugged around in drive, but I do shove it into servotronic when I have to downshift and really punch it. In Sport more they are not so bad. All of my E39’s drive the same wether the ac is on or off. I’ve never thought that they loose power because the ac comes on, gas mileage either, has always stayed constant. Maybe that’s what’s wrong with my E39’s! The fact that they’re constantly running perfectly fine! Not a single issue, no extra lights on in the dash, what the hells going on??? Now I’m really worried....

[tritschalex]

Re-reading this, I think this might actually be "operating as designed".

A 528 slushbox in D ain't exactly a drag monster, esp with the AC on.

The trans in the car is 'intelligent' so it does adapt to how its being driven, generally these ZF boxes fall back to being sluggish unless you're constantly punching it or keep it in Sport. Sport is a lot different than D.

You could try changing trans fluid and see if that helps (any idea if that's ever been done?) and that's probably a good idea anyway but I'd strongly consider this just being how its supposed to be.

Yeah but the bogging until it downshifts and then struggling to get back to rpm seems a bit off to me ? it only happens every so often when I come to a complete stop and try to take off it just dies ,


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[philly98540]

Great set up Jim on that injector cleaning!

[tritschalex]

Ok new update gentlemen, car was running great a little sluggish still hon the throttle response but I scanned the car again and read camshaft sensor , so I put a new one still came back sensor again, so I got another one and again the code came up another reason I was changing this the car would stall randomly when I sat in one spot idling . So now with the new one it doesn’t stall and way better response on the peddle but still showed code for cam sensor ,, I reset the codes took the battery off touched the cables together everything and still pops a camshaft sensor code on intake side , wires are all ok no corrosion or frayed wires no oil on connectors nothing I’m stuck here fellas


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[tritschalex]

Stall *** I meant to say randomly stall out


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[geargrinder]

Ok new update gentlemen, car was running great a little sluggish still hon the throttle response but I scanned the car again and read camshaft sensor , so I put a new one still came back sensor again, so I got another one and again the code came up another reason I was changing this the car would stall randomly when I sat in one spot idling . So now with the new one it doesn’t stall and way better response on the peddle but still showed code for cam sensor ,, I reset the codes took the battery off touched the cables together everything and still pops a camshaft sensor code on intake side , wires are all ok no corrosion or frayed wires no oil on connectors nothing I’m stuck here fellas


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It could be a wire problem down in the harness. Now that these cars are getting old thats increasingly being a thing that sometimes happens.

But there's another possible issue to check out: DME connector contamination.

Open your e-box and take the connectors off the DME (gently, if you do it right all the 'lever' ones just fall right pit as soon as you lift the lever and lock it into "full open" position... the big-power end-ones require a good pull but they aren't as fragile as the lever guys). Look for coolant or oil contamination on the connectors or pooled in the DME sockets. Including look for signs of dried up former contamination - this will be brown (oil) or green-blue (coolant) residue in the socket usually. If you catch it in time you can fix the underlying problem and clean the DME and be OK but if it goes too far the DME can burn up parts and pins and need to be either fixed or replaced.

[tritschalex]

It could be a wire problem down in the harness. Now that these cars are getting old thats increasingly being a thing that sometimes happens.

But there's another possible issue to check out: DME connector contamination.

Open your e-box and take the connectors off the DME (gently, if you do it right all the 'lever' ones just fall right pit as soon as you lift the lever and lock it into "full open" position... the big-power end-ones require a good pull but they aren't as fragile as the lever guys). Look for coolant or oil contamination on the connectors or pooled in the DME sockets. Including look for signs of dried up former contamination - this will be brown (oil) or green-blue (coolant) residue in the socket usually. If you catch it in time you can fix the underlying problem and clean the DME and be OK but if it goes too far the DME can burn up parts and pins and need to be either fixed or replaced.

OK, I checked all of that wiring Everything seems to be good but I think the map sensor is going bad but I can’t seem to find a diagram of where it is any help?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[geargrinder]

MAP sensor going bad? And why do you think that?

Do you mean something else? These cars don’t have MAP sensor.

They have a MAF. They have a “Map thermostat”. No manifold air pressure sensor tho.

[tritschalex]

Only codes I’m stuck with now are can shaft pos sensor bank a , car runs sluggish and has a slight ticking now . I put a new camshaft sensor and same issue, put two new vanos Valves and oil changed 5w30 full synthetic idk ??


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk