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Thread: New bushings / Sway bars / End links

  1. #26
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    I'm going to throw out some things I've read on this forum over the past few years, but you'll have to do a search to find the specifics.

    - offset eccentric control arm bushings for more caster on non-M: one of the resident experts, RF900rkw, has given explanations of why this isn't a good idea. The suspension geometry isn't right if you do that, you'd need to also replace some other parts. I don't remember specifics though.

    - Meyle HD control arms. They sound good on paper (I actually got a set too, just haven't installed). But some say that Meyle quality isn't great any more, and you should go with Lemfoerder. Again, just what I've read, I can't say.

    - Strut bar - I've had Strong Strut steel one for practically the life of the car. Personally I would want one that has a complete ring on top of the shock tower (some don't) to better protect the shock towers (more sheet metal that can deform).

  2. #27
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    Tim @ BMW of Dallas
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    Quote Originally Posted by solimans View Post
    i like the sound of more caster. i worry about fitment issues. i have 18 inch rims and the fronts needed 5mm spacers. tires were rubbing the coilovers.

    how much more caster are we talking about? Hard question to answer i guess.

    did you go with the H&R or GC sway bars?
    It's just going to push the wheel a little farther forward in the arch, so rubbing the front of the liner while hitting a bump mid-turn is a possibility.

    Also, don't switch to M sway bars. The non-M front bar is 26mm, while the M bar is 23mm. Differences in geometry, I suppose. I run the stock front bar on my coupe, but tied into the strut housing like the M cars. I run a GC large front bar on my roadster.
    Last edited by Tim95M3; 02-21-2019 at 09:04 AM.
    96 320i Touring
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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by raubritter View Post
    I'm going to throw out some things I've read on this forum over the past few years, but you'll have to do a search to find the specifics.

    - offset eccentric control arm bushings for more caster on non-M: one of the resident experts, RF900rkw, has given explanations of why this isn't a good idea. The suspension geometry isn't right if you do that, you'd need to also replace some other parts. I don't remember specifics though.

    - Meyle HD control arms. They sound good on paper (I actually got a set too, just haven't installed). But some say that Meyle quality isn't great any more, and you should go with Lemfoerder. Again, just what I've read, I can't say.

    - Strut bar - I've had Strong Strut steel one for practically the life of the car. Personally I would want one that has a complete ring on top of the shock tower (some don't) to better protect the shock towers (more sheet metal that can deform).
    Good information. Those were my thoughts on the suspension also. I’ll try and find more information via search.

    The ring on the strut bar seems like a better design. The search continues.


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  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim95M3 View Post
    It's just going to push the wheel a little farther forward in the arch, so rubbing the front of the liner while hitting a bump mid-turn is a possibility.

    Also, don't switch to M sway bars. The non-M front bar is 26mm, while the M bar is 23mm. Differences in geometry, I suppose. I run the stock front bar on my coupe, but tied into the strut housing like the M cars. I run a GC large front bar on my roadster.
    Ok so rear sway bar only. I’m going to check the thickness on the h&r, GC (front). Might be an upgrade. Maybe not necessary. 26mm seems like plenty.


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  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by solimans View Post
    oh the M sway bars fit, that fantastic! front and back? did not think they would. i understand the rear ends are different on the M...

    i looked it up. the M sway bar is 19mm vs 17mm on the non-M in the rear. i imagine the fronts are thicker as well.

    i'm going to lookup the Meyle control arms. wondering how much more expensive they are from stock...many thanks
    My Coupe is all M underneath except for rear trailing arms and rear brakes. Front knuckles, strut housings, brakes, etc. are all M which is why I have an M front sway bar. For the rear, I think all you'd do is grab the M sway bar links and bushings, but don't quote me. I bought the car this way swapped over by Clown Shoe Motorsports. I just wish they went one step further and swapped an S52/54 in there. I make do with headers, M54 intake manifold and a 3.46 rear.
    Last edited by s8ilver; 02-21-2019 at 05:42 PM.
    Nathan in Denver

    1999 M Roadster, VFE V3 S/C, Randy Forbes Reinforced, Hardtop, H&R/Bilstein, Apex PS-7, Supersprint
    1999 Z3 2.8 Coupe, Headers, 3.46, Manual Swap, H&R/Koni, M Geometry/Brakes, M54B30 Manifold, Style 42

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by s8ilver View Post
    My Coupe is all M underneath except for rear trailing arms and rear brakes. Front knuckles, strut housings, brakes, etc. are all M which is why I have an M front sway bar. For the rear, I think all you'd do is grab the M sway bar links and bushings, but don't quote me. I bought the car this way swapped over by Clown Shoe Motorsports. I just wish they went one step further and swapped an S52/54 in there. I make do with headers, M54 intake manifold and a 3.46 rear.
    Nice! I’ll get to the manifold eventually. For now its all suspension baby


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  7. #32
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    Can anyone confirm that the stock M coupe differential bushing will fit the stock z3 coupe 2.8 differential cover (1999)?

    This part: 33172228425

    It is significantly more expensive.

  8. #33
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    02 LSB Z3M Coupe
    Can confirm. They are the same OD. The M part is stiffer with more metal ribs in the rubber.
    There's also a solid-ish version from E30 325ix (33171134802) that also fits, but it's also crazy expensive.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by scenturion View Post
    Can confirm. They are the same OD. The M part is stiffer with more metal ribs in the rubber.
    There's also a solid-ish version from E30 325ix (33171134802) that also fits, but it's also crazy expensive.
    thank you, scenturion. seems like your sayin the M version is the best of the three?

  10. #35
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    I don't really know how to define "best" for your use case.
    If I were you I'd probably save the $200+ for other performance parts and put a new original non-M part back in.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by scenturion View Post
    I don't really know how to define "best" for your use case.
    If I were you I'd probably save the $200+ for other performance parts and put a new original non-M part back in.
    Fair enough. It is hard to define best for someone else. I should have said most durable, or maybe lasting. But I’m still not sure that would mean best.

    I found a good price and went for it. Gonna send the cheaper one back.

    Thank you for the feedback, sir. Much appreciated


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  12. #37
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    Gathering all of the parts to do this job soon...

    Anyone know what the part numbers are for the bracket(s) that holds the speed sensor connector to the trailing arms are?

    On the right side it also holds the brake wear sensor connector.

    Think mine may be broken.

    attached a pic...

    pic06.jpg

  13. #38
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    1998 S50 ACS M COUPE
    They do a L and R version of the cable holder , the L as pictured is 61138367937 I think

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by UK MCOUPE View Post
    They do a L and R version of the cable holder , the L as pictured is 61138367937 I think
    i think you're right, sir. Many thanks! I also found the right one and the smaller ones (also in the picture).

    Bracket F.Right Rear Axle Pl H6110D - 61-13-8-367-936
    ABS Sensor Clip (smaller ones in the pic) -
    34-52-1-164-653

    hope these are right...i'll find out soon enough

  15. #40
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    Not sure if the part ending 653 is correct as that type of holder fits into a round hole rather than a T shaped peg,

    my coupe has two holders a single and double shown here,

    https://www.z3mcoupe.com/forum/showp...6&postcount=13

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by UK MCOUPE View Post
    Not sure if the part ending 653 is correct as that type of holder fits into a round hole rather than a T shaped peg,

    my coupe has two holders a single and double shown here,

    https://www.z3mcoupe.com/forum/showp...6&postcount=13
    Many thanks, sir. I bought those as well. Once into this job I’ll be able to see what works and send the rest back.

    So many clips in the rear end...brake line clips, parking brake cable clips...


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  17. #42
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    More preparation...can't be too prepared

    How much torque can I safely put on these bolts (photo) to the frame? They are the bolts that hold the rear subframe.

    Also I can't seem to find a deep socket that will fit over this bolt. Anyone find one that will do it?

    Unknown-2.jpg

  18. #43
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    Silly question:

    Why do you want to change your sway bar? Does that typically need replacement?

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffPortland View Post
    Silly question:

    Why do you want to change your sway bar? Does that typically need replacement?
    mine is rusted. so i was thinking i'd go with an upgraded one, thicker, more resistance to the twisting forces they take. i'm not sure after reading about how sway bars work that a thicker one is necessarily better.

    sway bars decrease body roll but that does not always mean more grip. if you have understeer, increasing stiffness in the rear (sway bar) would help. if you have oversteer increasing stiffness in front would help. that is how i understood it.

    so I'm really not sure i'm doing this right. i do have new r&h ("upgraded") sway bars here waiting to be installed. figured i'd do that while doing the bushings.

    i guess i could just strip and paint the stock ones. or order the stock ones new. they were about the same price...maybe more?

    maybe someone who really understands this can chime in.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by solimans View Post
    mine is rusted. so i was thinking i'd go with an upgraded one, thicker, more resistance to the twisting forces they take. i'm not sure after reading about how sway bars work that a thicker one is necessarily better.

    sway bars decrease body roll but that does not always mean more grip. if you have understeer, increasing stiffness in the rear (sway bar) would help. if you have oversteer increasing stiffness in front would help. that is how i understood it.

    so I'm really not sure i'm doing this right. i do have new r&h ("upgraded") sway bars here waiting to be installed. figured i'd do that while doing the bushings.

    i guess i could just strip and paint the stock ones. or order the stock ones new. they were about the same price...maybe more?

    maybe someone who really understands this can chime in.
    You are correct. More, or stiffer bar reduces grip on the end it is installed. So when balancing under and oversteer it can be opposite of what one might think. I will say that a bar change is very noticeable on a tracked coupe.
    You are better off adding spring to correct roll, but like everything on suspension to a limit and with possible other negative effects.
    Dan "PbFut" Rose

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by PbFut View Post
    You are correct. More, or stiffer bar reduces grip on the end it is installed. So when balancing under and oversteer it can be opposite of what one might think. I will say that a bar change is very noticeable on a tracked coupe.
    You are better off adding spring to correct roll, but like everything on suspension to a limit and with possible other negative effects.
    Thank you, pbfut, for the confirmation. It was the opposite of what I thought.

    PO put in ST coilovers. For now I’ll run with those but maybe take a second look at some point. Have lots of work to do before I get to it...


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  22. #47
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    I can second a vote for the offset control arm bushings. I went with the softest poly version revshift offers and my car went from darting all about the road on the philly potholes (and occassional cobblestone road in the historic parts) to being extremely stable and smooth over bumps. It made the car feel much closer to how my E34 felt over bumps with its super heavy duty double control arm setup.

    Would definitely recommend it as an easy upgrade, plus you can more easily fit a bigger wheel if you'd like

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim95M3 View Post
    With your current setup, I'd recommend the 95 M3 offset front control arm bushings, a front sway bar (H&R, GC, etc), and poly rear subframe bushings. A lot of people here think the poly diff bushing will ruin your car but I have had good luck with it in both of my cars. Also, the reason I like the offset bushings is the added caster. Makes the steering feel much more stable and less twitchy. Just my personal feelings.

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  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ihm96 View Post
    I can second a vote for the offset control arm bushings. I went with the softest poly version revshift offers and my car went from darting all about the road on the philly potholes (and occassional cobblestone road in the historic parts) to being extremely stable and smooth over bumps. It made the car feel much closer to how my E34 felt over bumps with its super heavy duty double control arm setup.

    Would definitely recommend it as an easy upgrade, plus you can more easily fit a bigger wheel if you'd like
    thank you for the vote, sir. I'm seriously considering it. I may go with the eccentric / offset M control arm bushings. Doing the rear first this weekend...wish me luck

  24. #49
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    Quick update. Finished the rear this week.

    The exhaust gave me some trouble, rusted nuts. Had to be drilled out (previously) then the bolts were hard to get at. Make sure you have plenty of options ready there.

    A transmission jack is a must imo. I used a cheep one from harbor freight.

    The stock sf bushings are a bear to get out. I did not have the right tool. Tried a bearing press tool, heat gun, hammer and punches...fail. Finally burned them out. Put a touch on them. Takes about an hour each side to burn out. After cooling they can be punched out. Be sure to have some “goo gone” cleaner. Turns into a sticky mess.

    The akg trailing arm bushing tool worked with a little modification for that part.

    The diff bushing went in with the bearing press tool. Had to wire wheel the edges of the diff cover bore a bit to get the bushing started though.

    Look out for the speed sensor clips. Be gentle, they were brittle.

    The e-brake cables take finesse to pull out from the front, rather then force. Twisting and pulling helped in my case. They were rusted in at the trailing arm. Ended up cutting them and going through the lug nut hole, in the wheel hub, with a punch to get them out. Took me a while.

    I’ll post some torque specs below but verify. I have a 1999 z3 coupe 2.8.

    Some pics as well.




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  25. #50
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    rear torque specs:

    shock absorber to upper mount 10.3 ft-lb
    shock absorber upper mount to body 18 ft-lb
    shock absorber to trailing arm 74 ft-lb (on the ground)

    drive axle to differential flange torx 61 ft-lb
    driveshaft to to differential 59 ft-lb

    stabilizer bar bushing bracket to body 16 ft-lb
    stabilizer bar link to trailing arm 16 ft-lb
    differential to body (bushing) 57 ft-lb
    differential to subframe (front mounting bolts) 81 ft-lb
    brake line union 14 ft-lb
    Trailing arm to rear subframe 49 ft-lb (on the ground)
    subframe to frame 103 ft-lb
    subframe to frame top of threaded bolt 120nm?
    subframe to frame bottom of threaded nut to bushing 77nm?


    brake rotor to drive flange 12 ft-lb
    brake caliper to trailing arm 50 ft-lb

    drive axle collar nut to wheel hub 148 ft-lb

    Diff cover to diff 45 nm
    Drain plugs to diff cover 45 nm


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