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Thread: Electric fan Conversion gone wrong!

  1. #1
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    Electric fan Conversion gone wrong!

    I have recently purchased an SPAL electric fan kit from online and it came with the SPAL relay kit and the fan, I have mounted the fan up to the radiator and followed the diagram to the relay.

    It says the yellow goes to the jumper positive terminal along with the fuse, the orange goes to pin 16 of the 20 pin round connector under the hood (green wire with white stripe) and the red goes to the pigtail harness of the fan and the black goes to ground, as for the grey wire I tapped it into the black and gray wire of the aux fan switch which I believe is the high temp.

    I allowed the car to idle and reach 208f but the fan never kicked on. I am confused why, I followed the diagram correct so I’m not sure. The 30a fuse is also receiving 12v so did I mess up something. Just note po deleted the aux fan so not sure if that has to do with something. I just wanted one main fan in front of the radiator to cool everything down since my ac doesent work anyway.
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    Not sure about the rest of the wiring (don't know the specs), but if you use the original stock aux fan switch in the radiator, and then use the high-speed (high temp) wire, then your fan will only start to run when the temperature is way, way too high, in or almost in the red on the temp gauge in the instrument panel..

    So, I would advise to get the lower temp rated aux fan switch (80 deg C low speed trigger, 88 deg C high speed trigger), and then first connect it to the low speed connection.. Then you'll be sure it should trigger at a healthy temperature. (in my E36, it triggers the low-speed aux fan at 80C and the high speed at 88C and that works perfectly fine with the stock thermostat@92C).


    1997 E36 BMW 323i
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    Same as ed323i, it works perfect in this configuration. This with a Zionsville radiator and silicon hoses covered with braided stainless steel keep my heavily modded 328's engine cool even in Arizona summers.
    Last edited by GuildenNL; 02-01-2019 at 04:31 PM.

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    I thought the stock aux fan switch would kick the high temp fan on at 98c and low temp at 90. So 98c is like 208f so I don’t know why it won’t kick on. Guess I’ll get a lower temp switch cuz I’m afraid of overheating. Did your guys fan not come on when you had the stock fan switch? N do you have a link to the lower temp switch

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    Stock it almost never comes on.. Remember, the aux fan switch is on the cool side of the radiator. So, when the coolant is 105 degrees C, and it passes through the radiator, then it's probably only 95 degrees C at the cool side of the radiator. So, effectively the fan almost never turns on, and when it does (especially the high speed one), it's almost too late already to prevent the engine from overheating (with all heat soak going on in and around the engine).. I strongly advise to swap to the 318i aux fan switch (you need the newer model with the small pins; look it up in the viscous fan delete faq) so the fan turns on at 80 degrees C.. Even with the stock thermostat that works perfectly fine..

    P.S. Just to be clear: with your current setup, you're seriously risking overheating the engine..
    Last edited by ed323i; 02-01-2019 at 03:13 PM.


    1997 E36 BMW 323i
    (European) 275k km (171k miles), with following small mods:

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    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    Stock it almost never comes on.. Remember, the aux fan switch is on the cool side of the radiator. So, when the coolant is 105 degrees C, and it passes through the radiator, then it's probably only 95 degrees C at the cool side of the radiator. So, effectively the fan almost never turns on, and when it does (especially the high speed one), it's almost too late already to prevent the engine from overheating (with all heat soak going on in and around the engine).. I strongly advise to swap to the 318i aux fan switch (you need the newer model with the small pins; look it up in the viscous fan delete faq) so the fan turns on at 80 degrees C.. Even with the stock thermostat that works perfectly fine..

    and howcome you have such a high temp thermostat, 92 woah! thats like almost 200f, are they suppose to run that hot.

    P.S. Just to be clear: with your current setup, you're seriously risking overheating the engine..
    ye i was thinkink of getting the 318i fan switch, not sure if getting a used one from the junkyard will work but i think you mean to get the obd2 fan switch with the small pins, i believe the obd1 cars have a diffrent switch, and ye i really am risking driving it around town with a non working electric fan, need to get that to work before i go out and have fun driving it, whenever im at a stoplight i just keep staring at the coolant temp.

    and howcome you have such a high temp thermostat, 92 woah! thats like almost 200f, are they suppose to run that hot.
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  7. #7
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    92 degrees C is the stock thermostat for my European 323i, M52B25: See number 5 on http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...diagId=11_6080 .. I think some M52 models are equipped with an 88 deg C one, but not sure.

    Modern BMW engines run even a lot hotter, and also the 4-cylinder M43 (never sold in the US) E36 had a 'hotter' thermostat. 95C: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...diagId=11_6057 .

    This is the part you need. 61318376440 for my 1997 323i, so it should fit your 1998 328i. I bought one for 18 or 22 euro if remember correctly (some German brand, works fine), so I'd advise to buy a new one, because they are known to die with the years, and it's an important enough part to better be safe than sorry.


    1997 E36 BMW 323i
    (European) 275k km (171k miles), with following small mods:

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    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    Stock it almost never comes on.. Remember, the aux fan switch is on the cool side of the radiator. So, when the coolant is 105 degrees C, and it passes through the radiator, then it's probably only 95 degrees C at the cool side of the radiator. So, effectively the fan almost never turns on, and when it does (especially the high speed one), it's almost too late already to prevent the engine from overheating (with all heat soak going on in and around the engine)..
    Hi just a few thoughts. I can say that this is completely wrong. That the double temperature switch is at the cool side of the radiator, and heat soak, is something that has been obviously factored in by bmw. Secondly, the high speed fan comes on LONG before the needle gets to red. Like within 1-2 needle's width past centre and the high speed is coming on.

    If it never came on for your or came on very late, you have a fault somewhere there. Most likely, its a bad double temperature switch - it is 20+ years old after all. You could also have a blown high speed fuse, or a damaged auxiliary fan. Very rarely it would be something blocking the particular radiator passages right next to the double temp switch.
    Last edited by Thomas525; 02-02-2019 at 07:36 AM.

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    Remember that in stock configuration, the aux fan is just a last-resort backup solution.. The mechanical fan is what's doing most/all of the work. In Europe lots of cars don't even have A/C and hence no aux fan, so they only have the mechanical fan.

    If you connect your electric fan to only the high speed circuit of the stock aux fan switch it will turn on very late, later than what is healthy for you cooling system/engine.

    In my current setup with the 80/88 temp switch, the low speed fan only turns on after driving and then idling more than a few minutes. High speed virtually never turns on. Like only in racing conditions and then next idling on a very hot day, over a very hot road surface.


    1997 E36 BMW 323i
    (European) 275k km (171k miles), with following small mods:

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    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    Remember that in stock configuration, the aux fan is just a last-resort backup solution.. The mechanical fan is what's doing most/all of the work. In Europe lots of cars don't even have A/C and hence no aux fan, so they only have the mechanical fan.
    I understand that its a backup. That doesn't mean it has to work abnormally.
    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    If you connect your electric fan to only the high speed circuit of the stock aux fan switch it will turn on very late, later than what is healthy for you cooling system/engine.
    This is, again, completely wrong. Have you considered why anyone would design it that way ?

    The aux fan runs at high speed long before the 3/4 mark is reached.

    You are stating the experience of your own car. The double temp switch or something else was faulty and you didn't realise it. This is understandable. I drove for 5 years before realising that my double temp switch was actually not working.

    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    In my current setup with the 80/88 temp switch, the low speed fan only turns on after driving and then idling more than a few minutes. High speed virtually never turns on. Like only in racing conditions and then next idling on a very hot day, over a very hot road surface.
    When you're driving normally especially on a highway, the clutch fan, if installed, freewheels. The bimetallic strip on the fan clutch sees to that. It is not needed to cool the engine - the onrushing air is sufficient. So it makes sense that your electric fan only comes on after some idling time. The clutch fan too mainly works during idling time or low speed travel. I.e. cooling systems are designed to work that way.

  11. #11
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    You're right.. And, also, my aux fan temp. switch was indeed defective.. But I wouldn't be comfortable driving with an E36 with no mechanical fan and the aux fan (or any fan) only turning on at 98 degrees C, at the cold side of the radiator. I personally don't want the temp gauge to show anything above 12 o'clock, because then you're very, very close to very expensive trouble.

    I think we can agree to disagree on how well engineered the E36 cooling system is. I personally think there are some serious flaws, like:
    * No low coolant level indicator if you don't have check control; this should have been standard, especially with the expensive 6-cylinder engine
    * If you're lucky to have the low-coolant indicator, it's a poor, weak design with a very low life-span
    * No audible alarm once coolant temperature goes above say 105 degrees C
    * The very poorly designed, way over-buffered temperature gauge which, once it passes the 12 o'clock, means you're in trouble or very, very close to it
    * The bad radiator design incorporating both plastic and aluminum, which makes the radiators die prematurely
    * The mechanical fan that has the potential to indirectly destroy your engine, by first destroying the coolant hoses, and then causing instant overheating (again, with no alarm going off) (this happens especially if water pump is bad, or if transmission mounts are bad)

    And there are definitely more things that could have been done better..

    If you say the high speed fan engages before the 3/4-mark (which is where the red zone should have started) on the temp gauge, I assume you're right. I haven't tested it myself.. But I feel it's way too late for it to engage either way. And I maintain my position that if a lot of heat soak has gone on, in hot weather, and you're using the BMW advised coolant mixture (I use a lot more water, for better cooling performance, and with no ill effects in the climate I live in), and with the A/C full on, and the mechanical fan not working or removed, the aux fan won't save you in a lot of cases. And you'll end up with a warped/cracked head, which means your engine, and often also the car itself, is a total-loss for most people.
    Last edited by ed323i; 02-02-2019 at 01:45 PM.


    1997 E36 BMW 323i
    (European) 275k km (171k miles), with following small mods:

  12. #12
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    You can manually short the pins on the connector that plugs into the radiator temp switch to at least make sure you wired in your Spal correctly. Then you know if it is your fan wiring that is wrong or if you have a dead radiator temp switch.

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    How to short them out?

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    One of the three pins is a ground connection. So, if the switch activates, it connects ground to the wire connected to the switch (either low or high speed).
    So, you can connect a good source of ground to the wire that goes to the fan. Ground you can get from one of the three bolts on the shock tower.


    1997 E36 BMW 323i
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    So, you can connect a good source of ground to the wire that goes to the fan. Ground you can get from one of the three bolts on the shock tower.
    Note that this didn't work for me which was very strange as I picked up the ground using an ohmeter. I think that I ended up grounding on an AC freon pipe hold down. From memory, but it was extremely close to the switch. Was one of the strangest electrical puzzles I've run across and my background is in electrical engineering.

    All I could determine was the resistance was a wee bit more and must have crossed an imaginary line the Spal could handle.
    Last edited by GuildenNL; 02-02-2019 at 04:06 PM.

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    While testing my fan delete mod, this is how I did it. I think I inserted a needle in the pin of the wiring harness connector that activates the low-speed fan. Then I connected a cable from a shock tower bolt to this pin, and, behold, the relay turned on, and the low speed fan activated. Then I put the needle in the high speed fan pin/opening and repeated, and then the high speed relay, and high speed fan activated..


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    The connector to the stock double temp switch has 3 sockets. They can be shorted internally using a short wire through the socket on the outside. . And the fan will come on at low and high speeds accordingly. It is real easy, just take 2 minutes to try the various combinations and you will figure it outThis is how you test the fan.

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    Hi Ed,

    a. I said the high speed fan should come on about 1-2 needle's width after centre (post #. It does not get to 3/4 before it comes on. No matter what, definitely before 3/4.

    b. Thank you for admitting that there was somethign wrong with your own car's double temperature switch. Perhaps you can reconsider all of your positions re the cooling system that was built on this since then.

    c. The engine will not suffer damage until it hits the red mark, and generally, only when it stays there for a few minutes. That's because even when the engine is hotter than red the guage will show red, and in a catastrophi overheat, you get to above red. Like way above red. All this I'm telling you from direct experience.

    d. 3/4 etc is not ideal for engine combustion metrics, but will not damage an engine. So you can consider stopping treating the car as if it was fragile. That is the subconscious impression you are conveying.

    e. I agree with your list of cooling system cockups from BMW. I can and I'm sure all of us can add a WHOLE list of other shortcomings about the rest of the car. Why is there no small backup fuel pump for instance. Why is there no warning indicator for low starter and low alternator carbon that comes on 2 weeks before it dies completely ? It would have increased the manufacturing cost by what $200 to do this? Maybe a total of $300 to incorporate all of your cooling system initiatives? Is $300 extra selling price such a big deal for a luxury marque ? They probably don't do this for today's models as well.
    Last edited by Thomas525; 02-02-2019 at 08:41 PM.

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    Thomas, thanks for your extensive reply.
    I can admit I'm spooked by an experience that was caused by the bad switch.. Once the temp gauge goes past 12 o'clock it moves scarily fast if there is no fan, and you're in a traffic jam. Just when I thought about turning off the engine to prevent damage, as the gauge went in the direction of the red zone, traffic started to move. Turning on the cabin heater full-power helped a bit too. Perhaps I'm too concerned, but, on the other hand, I've read quite some stories from people that say their head gasket died or head warped/cracked when it only touched the red zone, or even a bit before that (M50/M52).

    So, what I'm scared about of being at 3/4 is that you're seconds or a few minutes away from the red zone, in which the damage can be extensive. I will personally not test it to confirm you're right about the head and head gasket being way stronger, and I'll turn off the engine if the gauge needle creeps past 12 o'clock. My idea is that when the highly buffered gauge moves past 12 o'clock you can be certain something is wrong: The mechanical fan is worn or stuck, and/or the electric fan or relay is dead, and/or the water pump or thermostat are bad, and/or you've lost coolant.. Better be safe than sorry, and just park the car and turn off the engine. I'll leave it to more daring people to see if the head can indeed withstand the temperatures of the red zone (120-something degrees C?)..

    Good suggestions for other improvements. Big other one: Strengthening the subframe mounting points and the rear shock mounts.. But that the BMW engineers decided not to protect the most advanced and expensive part of the car, the marvelous price-winning, super smooth, unique 6-cylinder engine, with a 10-20 euro alarm buzzer, that really dazzles me.
    Last edited by ed323i; 02-02-2019 at 09:52 PM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by ed323i View Post
    Thomas, thanks for your extensive reply.

    Good suggestions for other improvements. Big other one: Strengthening the subframe mounting points and the rear shock mounts.. But that the BMW engineers decided not to protect the most advanced and expensive part of the car, the marvelous price-winning, super smooth, unique 6-cylinder engine, with a 10-20 euro alarm buzzer, that really dazzles me.
    Try one euro. It can't cost more than that. Leaving out and overheat alarm is a real doozy. Its like this company was not around since before WWII.

    Re the rest of your post, I understand your abundance of caution. But that needs to be clearly reflected as a personal choice. And yes temps can climb quickly. In that situation rev the engine to 3k, the clutch fan will compensate for a short while. Oh right you don't have that.

    Then I say, damn the traffic and shut the engine down for 1-2 minutes. Temps will still be at or near red after that but you can move to the curb, people will be terrified enough of your brazen impudence to give you way. But in your case you really need to make sure that fan functions properly. If i were you, I would have a second aux fan able to run on demand via a switch from the cabin. There is already space for that behind the bumper, it is already there, the E36's curved 6 blader is a very efficient aux fan I've put it on my E34, there's probably a way for you to wire it up without putting something ugly on your dash. Or wire both in, but use a higher thermostat for the stock aux fan.

    No actually, use a bypass switch. Basically a switch that switches to circuit B (which would be the stock aux fan) if circuit A is found to be dead (which would be the case if a relay or the fan itself died). There must be a simple inexpensive way to do this, simple for the folks who do basic electronics and electricals of course.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Then the aux fan runs at high speed only when activated by the bypass.

    - - - Updated - - -

    And the bypass is activated when the primary electric fan fails. I mean of course this should be done. The aux fan is already there.
    Last edited by Thomas525; 02-02-2019 at 11:21 PM.

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    A single electric fan that is properly sized, fitted, wired and controlled can be fine. Many cars are set up this way, including my 2008 E90 M3 and E61 535xi.

    On my 99 E36 M3, I have aftermarket electric puller and pusher fans, separately wired and controlled, in part for redundancy/safety like you mention, but also in part to higher cooling demands — 700 rwhp turbo motor — and reduced airflow — in addition to the AC condenser in front of the radiator there is an air to air intercooler.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    A single electric fan that is properly sized, fitted, wired and controlled can be fine. Many cars are set up this way, including my 2008 E90 M3 and E61 535xi.
    I agree. But a backup for such a critical system that can come on when you can't realistically stop the car (such as within a slow moving major jam) is nice if it can be done on an E36. And since there literally is space behind the bumper for an aux fan, because that's where its supposed to be for the E36 if you had the a/c option in Europe, then perhaps that should be done as a matter of long term insurance, peace of mind, etc. But if you don't have such an option, fitting one in will not be easy. You'll have to remove the front bumper without damaging the bumper trim, then get a new fan - around $100, new resistor, drill mounting points if needed, install that, wire it up, test, replace the bumper...not a set of skills that an average diyer has. You don't want to screw up something that is going to be really complicated to fix later.So perhaps this is worth paying somebody to do. Its a one time cost. Maybe around 2 hours for a professional to do up. You just need to help him for ten minutes total, when removing and reinstalling the bumper. Pay him $250 for everything including wiring and bypass relay tapped to the main electrical fan, fan costs $100 new. $350. I can certainly see the logic of that if this is a car I love, its my daily driver, and I'm planning to keep it for a couple of years at least. Will also raise the resale price of my car if I ever want to sell it.
    Last edited by Thomas525; 02-03-2019 at 03:33 PM.

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    I like overheat buzzer idea. Curious about the sender and wiring for that. Every E36 I have seen in the US has air conditioning and the aux fan. They can fail with age and these cars are 20+ years old now, so the aux fan may not be working. Easy test -- undo the connector underneath and jump by applying power and ground. At least here in the US, the temperature gauges are buffered so the gauge reads dead center from about 160 to 240 F. Not sure what the C range would be. From 240 F, its not far to overheat, which is probably in the 265-275 F range given a standard pressure cap and coolant mix.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    At least here in the US, the temperature gauges are buffered so the gauge reads dead center from about 160 to 240 F. Not sure what the C range would be.
    That would be a range of 71C-115C. This is definitely not the range. Firstly the buffer cannot be more than 5 degrees C. It would be pointless otherwise and the temp sensor is sensitive enough for more precise readings.

    Second, the engine's operating temperature - which is what the middle of dash gauge represents - is about 95C. Or a number right just about the boiling point of water.

    I can't be exactly sure about this right now but its definitely not between 71-115C. Radiator temperatures are not the same as cylinder head temps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas525 View Post
    That would be a range of 71C-115C. This is definitely not the range. Firstly the buffer cannot be more than 5 degrees C. It would be pointless otherwise and the temp sensor is sensitive enough for more precise readings.

    Second, the engine's operating temperature - which is what the middle of dash gauge represents - is about 95C. Or a number right just about the boiling point of water.

    I can't be exactly sure about this right now but its definitely not between 71-115C. Radiator temperatures are not the same as cylinder head temps.
    M50 uses two different engine temp sensors, one for DME, one for instrument cluster. M52 uses one temp sensor and signal is split in the harness going to DME and cluster. Radiator temp switch is completely different.

    Accuracy of the sensor does not imply accuracy of the gauge.

    I don't know the specific numbers of the buffer range but I'm sure the data can be dug up somewhere on here. There's at least one thread about how to remove the buffer, wouldn't be surprised if the info is in there.

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