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Thread: Cam Timing Help ... I'm stumped

  1. #1
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    Angry Cam Timing Help ... I'm stumped

    I'm in the middle of a HG job and am installing Schrick Cams 264/256. I spent two hours trying to understand how the timing works and how the sprockets are suppose to be able to rotate within the oval cut outs. I made sure at full right rotation both pins were at maximum travel. I made sure on full left rotation both pins were at maximum travel. I triple checked everything to make sure there was no way I would be off.

    I referenced the Bently, Pelican, and the Besian Vanos website. I used the Cam locks. I used the pin at TDC. I used the lower chain tensioner tool. The holes on the sprocket were centered. The Sprockets were rotated right during vanos installation. The Vanos was fully retracted when installing.

    When done. I rotated the the crank manually. The exhaust cam lines up perfectly every time. The intake Cam is off (angled left) and may even be getting worse on each rotation.

    I cant imagine what is off. Is this a sprocket alignment issue. Is this a vanos issue?

    PS - No idea why my pictures always show sideways. And I'm too pissed to figure that out at the moment
    Attached Images Attached Images

  2. #2
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    If the exhaust cam is dead on after rotation, your issue is not there, so focus on the intake cam. The Besian site is the best one and easiest to understand. The key is really the vanos install ... you MUST not allow the vanos worm gear to push the intake cam spline gear ... as soon as it engages, stop pushing and let the rotation of the sprocket draw the vanos in. And as soon as it touches the face of the head, do not keep rotating the cam sprocket. If you do, your intake will always be off. Basically when the vanos is fully seated, the vanos gear must still be fully retracted.

    Also, in that pic, your cams do not appear to be at TDC. The cam block are only checked at TDC. I assume you installed the cams at TDC (front lobes pointing at each other at 45*), or you'll be in a world of hurt with bent valves
    Last edited by ScotcH; 01-30-2019 at 11:26 PM.
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  3. #3
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    Thanks for the quick response. I'm packing it in for the night and will try again tomorrow. I'm hoping it's as simple as redoing the vanos. Don't think I overly backed it on but maybe I did. In the picture TDC was short by about 3/16 of an inch rotation. Are you that obsevant or are you seeing something significantly wrong? They were locked in place 45 degree pointing toward end other.
    Last edited by cashmancab; 01-30-2019 at 11:53 PM.

  4. #4
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    Always rotate the crank in the direction of engine rotation. Don’t back into tdc. Use a mirror to make sure you see tdc given the angle the engine is mounted. Use the Beisan instructions or the DR Vanos stage 2 instructions. Stop your crank rotation to tdc at the beginning. There is a tiny bit of play and you could be misled by it. After doing the timing, rotate two turns of crank back to tdc. Timing can be frustrating until you figure it out. I have had several sets of cams, several engines, and pulled the head at least once on each engine so I have gotten used to the job (supercharged or turbocharged since 2006).
    Last edited by pbonsalb; 01-31-2019 at 07:32 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by cashmancab View Post
    Thanks for the quick response. I'm packing it in for the night and will try again tomorrow. I'm hoping it's as simple as redoing the vanos. Don't think I overly backed it on but maybe I did. In the picture TDC was short by about 3/16 of an inch rotation. Are you that obsevant or are you seeing something significantly wrong? They were locked in place 45 degree pointing toward end other.
    What I'm seeing is that your REAR lobes are pointing at each other at 45* … TDC should be the FRONT lobes pointing at each other. Take a pick of the whole head and cams with the blocks on.
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  6. #6
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    Also, the rear of the cams where the blocks mount should have a mark on the side that is meant to face up. But as Scotch says, the front lobs have to be pointing upward at each other.

    Something like this:


  7. #7
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    ScotchH -very observant. You are correct the crank was at TDC but on the opposite stroke. I was really hoping this was the issue. I rotated 360 degrees and the cams on cylinder 1 point towards each other at TDC. Problem still exists. I cant get to it tonight but I'm thinking its a chain tension issue or vanos install gone wrong some how. Will report back once I figure it out. Thanks for all the responses.

  8. #8
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    There are a ton of YouTube videos on how to setup your timing chains and vanos installation. It took me several tries to get it right as I had never done it before. Once you do it right there is kind of an ah ha moment where everything makes sense.
    Having the right tools, such as the temporary chain tensioner, helps a lot. Here are some links. Your mileage may vary.

    http://www.adkusters.dsmynas.com/Web.../11_31_505.pdf

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_jcqe1QlIQ&list=PLVaxrCrxn-sHrFspvtuoBSO9Bk-Rs97cK&index=16
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1gV...oBSO9Bk-Rs97cK

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPlKrOC718w
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23jXHhkpV_I

  9. #9
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    You have to spin the crank twice by the way to get the cams back to the position you set them at.

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