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Thread: Rear Tranny seal on 98 M' Roadster

  1. #1
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    Rear Tranny seal on 98 M' Roadster

    Hello,
    Looks like I have a slow leak from the rear transmission seal. Does anyone have an idea how many hours it would take a shop to replace the seal? Looks like the exhaust needs to be removed to perform this job. Just trying to get an idea of how much to expect to pay without the shop trying to gouge me.
    Thanks for your input!

  2. #2
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    Hello - take a look at the link below to our site's DIY tech articles on the transmission. It'll give you a good idea of the time-frame and cost for certain procedures. Hope this helps you out a bit.

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  3. #3
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    Are you sure that its the rear transmission seal that is leaking? The gear shifter seal above it is the usual culprit.
    1999 2.8L Z3 Roadster,
    2000 3.0L Z3 Roadster,

    There is only one thing more pleasurable than working on a Z3, that's driving it top down on a fine day.

  4. #4
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    No, I'm not sure. That's good advice, i'll need to verify. Thanks

  5. #5
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    You have a ZF transmission. It is not the same as the Getrag Pelican pointed you to.

    The bad news. If it is the rear seal, it can not be changed without special tools. The flange is a serious interference fit, requiring a hefty puller to remove and a special tool to press it back on. If you try and drive it on with a hammer as suggested in the DIY, you will destroy the 5th gear synchronizer assembly.

    The good news. On the ZF it's always the shifter shaft seal.


    /.randy

  6. #6
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    Shift-shaft seal; I've replaced dozens upon dozens of them.


  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Forbes View Post
    Shift-shaft seal; I've replaced dozens upon dozens of them.

    Is the Shift Shaft seal the same as the Selector shaft seal? If thats the case then I already replaced it a few months ago and perhaps its leaking again.

  8. #8
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    I need to do this one now on the coupe. I noticed it on the roadster I sold but the coupe is definitely leaking. Easier to spot in roadsters because they don't have that plastic floor that retains much of the drip.

    Anyway, is the concencus to still tap another one in vs trying to remove?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by workhurts View Post
    I need to do this one now on the coupe. I noticed it on the roadster I sold but the coupe is definitely leaking. Easier to spot in roadsters because they don't have that plastic floor that retains much of the drip.

    Anyway, is the concencus to still tap another one in vs trying to remove?
    Or a good tip on how to get the old one out. In for answers.

  10. #10
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    How many hours would it take a competent mechanic to replace the shift shaft seal on an M roadster assuming exhaust needs to be removed. Thanks

  11. #11
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    3 hours, per Pelican.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by OCRentAPopo View Post
    Or a good tip on how to get the old one out. In for answers.
    I have long been an advocate of pushing the existing seal inward (1/4-5/16"?) and putting the new seal in over the top of it.

    The primary reason is to eliminate any potential damage to the surface of the shaft (shift or selector, same thing here) as once it's scored, you're screwed as far as sealing goes. A secondary benefit is that the old seal will now be working on a new section of the shaft and the new one only has to deal with the slight dribble that gets past it.

    ALWAYS (ALWAYS, ALWAYS!) lubricate the seal before installation. ALWAYS!

    Our (other) esteemed Randy on here warns that if the seal is driven in too far, that it will foul the range of motion, so only go in as far as necessary to seat the second seal (I've probably done this seal replacement 40-50 times, and never experienced too far__and that was before the warning).

    There are however, a couple of tools that I only recently discovered__thanks to someone on here posting about them__and one removes the existing seal and the other is to drive a new one in. I'm undecided if I'll continue doubling up the seals, although I do get a kick out of working with new single-purpose tools...

    Extractor:





    Installer:



    Last edited by Randy Forbes; 01-12-2019 at 07:14 AM.

  13. #13
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    Awesome write-up as always, Randy. Truly appreciated.

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    No one does tool porn like Randy

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by z3forlife View Post
    No one does tool porn like Randy
    I must insist on the removal of gloves for future pics plus more oil. Thanks.

    Were the tools expensive or difficult to order?

  16. #16
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    Sorry to bring this back, but has anyone done this without removing the exhaust and the driveshaft?
    Check out my M Roadster projects and DIYs:
    Cooling system part 1: https://youtu.be/ERqztIL1DPw
    Cooling system part 2: https://youtu.be/-DnclDkn2hI
    Power convertible top: https://youtu.be/KLYNqkCBh_M
    Head unit removal: https://youtu.be/LKe9fPKrAqE

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andryuha View Post
    Sorry to bring this back, but has anyone done this without removing the exhaust and the driveshaft?
    I just did this a week or so ago. I don't think it's possible, here's some pics and you can see the transmission tunnel all around the top and sides. Then look at where the Giubo attaches, if it wasn't off, you wouldn't be able to see it. Plus you have to disassemble part of the shifter linkage to be able to slide the new seal over the shaft.
    Screenshot_20240311_074045_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20240311_074107_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20240311_074121_Gallery.jpg

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndianaRoadster View Post
    I just did this a week or so ago. I don't think it's possible, here's some pics and you can see the transmission tunnel all around the top and sides. Then look at where the Giubo attaches, if it wasn't off, you wouldn't be able to see it. Plus you have to disassemble part of the shifter linkage to be able to slide the new seal over the shaft.
    Screenshot_20240311_074045_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20240311_074107_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20240311_074121_Gallery.jpg
    So I guess the bronze looking end of the seal goes to the outside. I haven't done the job yet but I was wondering.

    Did you double up the seals? If not, how did you remove the existing one?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndianaRoadster View Post
    I just did this a week or so ago. I don't think it's possible, here's some pics and you can see the transmission tunnel all around the top and sides. Then look at where the Giubo attaches, if it wasn't off, you wouldn't be able to see it. Plus you have to disassemble part of the shifter linkage to be able to slide the new seal over the shaft.
    Screenshot_20240311_074045_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20240311_074107_Gallery.jpg
    Screenshot_20240311_074121_Gallery.jpg
    Argh, I just replaced my guibo and CSB, but I needed to have the car back together. I guess I'm going to have to disassemble it all again. FML.
    Check out my M Roadster projects and DIYs:
    Cooling system part 1: https://youtu.be/ERqztIL1DPw
    Cooling system part 2: https://youtu.be/-DnclDkn2hI
    Power convertible top: https://youtu.be/KLYNqkCBh_M
    Head unit removal: https://youtu.be/LKe9fPKrAqE

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andryuha View Post
    Argh, I just replaced my guibo and CSB, but I needed to have the car back together. I guess I'm going to have to disassemble it all again. FML.
    When you go back in, that would be a good time to replace the shifter linkage bushings. It's pretty easy job and not expensive at all.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoyt Clagwell View Post
    So I guess the bronze looking end of the seal goes to the outside. I haven't done the job yet but I was wondering.

    Did you double up the seals? If not, how did you remove the existing one?
    I doubled up the seals. One of the Randy's said there was enough room. If you turn the seal around, you would be driving the socket against rubber. The brass side only shows on one side, the other side is covered in rubber.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndianaRoadster View Post
    - - - Updated - -
    I doubled up the seals. One of the Randy's said there was enough room. If you turn the seal around, you would be driving the socket against rubber. The brass side only shows on one side, the other side is covered in rubber.
    Thanks. I should've done it when I had my tranny out (identifies as it, that). I think the seal has started to leak a little since reinstalling the transmission last Spring.

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