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Thread: 01 E39 winding but no attempt to start where should I start?

  1. #1
    Join Date
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    E39 bmw

    01 E39 winding but no attempt to start where should I start?

    Been here before just another account after issues with password reset .

    Parked my E39 during the winter for maintenance safety and warmth issues to be clear

    Decided to use my free time to replace the coils an plugs today battery was dead so dropped it off at the local oreilys to charge while I conquered the task

    After fully charging the battery I tried to crank the car an it "kind of a successful start" for a fraction of a second when it died I knew I was in for the Long haul of maintenance procedures

    Tried again an got nothing but a windimg sound. with it being dark on New year's Eve now An knowing nothing but what I've read on the similar posts, I'm not attempting to jack with it tonight other than asking for help that I know I'm goin to need...

    While sitting here I decided to check error codes (an delete them like a tard) , good news is, I had a previous issue where I posted all my most recent error codes. I'll update with those if needed since I definitely won't be driving Miss Daisy any time soon

  2. #2
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    There is a schrader valve on the fuel rail (like a tire valve). Use a small screwdriver to CAREFULLY push in the valve in the center. DO NOT BEND IT; it is spring-loaded.

    Does fuel come out at high pressure?

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  3. #3
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    Also if bang on the bottom of the fuel tank with a rubber mallet or chunk of wood and a hammer, while somebody tries to start it and it starts them dies it would be the fuel pump

  4. #4
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    Yes there was high pressure at the Schrader valve (enough for It to come out anyways) an knocking around on the fuel tank done nothing

    - - - Updated - - -

    Would the starter go out like that an cause it to die ... Just to clarify I dont know the term or how to replicate the sound with words but it's not the ordinary sound you hear when starting a vehicle it's more of a winding/humming sound

  5. #5
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    Um, "enough to make it come out" is NOT high pressure. 51 psi, which is what your fuel pressure should be, will shoot 3 or 4 feet.

    That said, the sound you're describing would seem to indicate that you have zero compression. If you have zero compression, you probably need a new engine (Or there are no sparkplugs in it).

    I'm also going to have to wonder why you've found it necessary to start 3 different identities on this forum.

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  6. #6
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    To explain the identity it's because my memory is crap I guess even tho I always use the same password it didn't work an neither does the password reset so here I am

    I didn't fully depress it if that makes any difference but yeah differently nothing like that it just pooled out of the valve

    Nooooo anything but that (I wish I could make you understand the reference to the movie how high I'm thinking of ) ... there are definitely spark plugs in it ...what about it starting just before

  7. #7
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    That's what worries me - the starting, then sounding weird afterwards. Is there another person who can help? If so, take off the oil filler cap on the valve cover, and have that person turn the key, while you watch the timing chain / camshaft gears. Do these turn?

    Can you take a video, and post it at a hosting site, and put a link here?

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  8. #8
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    This issue with the accounts is annoying

    My fault for not being clear which model of E39 I have it's the 530 6 cylinder
    Doing my own looking into this on YouTube, I seen on the 540 models that the cap is right above where the gears seem to be, an mine is just a plastic box it seems.
    So it's not like it's going anywhere, it wouldn't hurt to disassemble it if it's necessary. whatver I need to do to help diagnose the issue
    yes I can make a video of the noise an I have someone to help if needed

  9. #9
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    You're right - the issue with you now having FOUR different accounts IS annoying ! Everyone else here gets along just fine with one account, and you add another one every time you post ! There's really nothing difficult about remembering a password, maybe try pen and paper?

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  10. #10
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    I did but it wasnt a problem with remembering it was my attention to the details of what it was asking for specifically a username not an email so until I figured out what I was doing wrong my only solution was to make another account not hurting my feelers but my bad - back to the subject

  11. #11
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    Should I continue with the idea of watching the timing gears? , what would be the easiest way to access it ? It's a 530i so the cap is above the coils not the timing chains/camshaft gears like the 540

  12. #12
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    Try buying a can of Mass Airflow Sensor cleaner, or even brake cleaner at Autozone. Undo the intake elbow from the air filter box, and spray short shots of MAF cleaner into the engine while someone is holding the key in start position.

    Or, better yet, post a video at a hosting site like YouTube and post a link to that item here, so we can hear this "winding sound".

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  13. #13
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    https://youtu.be/mozo6a3vWmw

    - - - Updated - - -


  14. #14
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    Are you talking about the main peice leading into what seems like the cylinder or the smaller one branching off it the smaller one leading underneath the fuel rail stuff
    would be much easier to get to with a ratchet

  15. #15
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    Let's try it this way: Here is a diagram of your air filter box:
    https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=13_0414

    Here is a diagram of the Mass airflow sensor, (which attaches to the air filter box), and the intake elbow, which comes next in line:
    https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=13_0919

    I want you to unscrew the 6mm hose clamp which attaches the mass airflow sensor to the "Rubber Boot" (part #3), and lift up the rubber boot just enough to spray some of the mass airflow sensor cleaner into the rubber boot while someone is cranking the starter.

    But there's a problem with how you're trying to start that engine: By cranking it like that for about 1 second at a time, you've likely flooded the hell out of the engine, if there's any fuel pressure.

    Never crank the engine for a second or less -- unless it starts. If the engine does not start immediately, you need to keep the key turned for at least five to eight seconds. Repeated very short attempts like the ones in the video will cause the engine to flood, which washes away the compression.

    Too much fuel? Not enough? Or a completely different issue? It's really hard to tell, when I'm not there to see how much pressure the fuel coming out of the schrader valve has. You can try the MAF cleaner spray into the intake elbow. You might also try pulling the fuel pump fuse, and then, with your foot flat on the gas pedal, crank the starter for 7 0r 8 seconds, then let it rest. Then repeat, 7 or 8 seconds, and rest. Did it try to start during any of that? Then try one more time....but this time, reinsert the fuel pump fuse half way through cranking.

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  16. #16
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    The card shows 22 31 to be the fuel pump , which one is it ?

    Okay makes sense I've never had to keep it turned over for more than a second so I always figured I shouldn't put extra work on the starter by doing that

  17. #17
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    Both fuses 22 and 31 feed the fuel pump relay, which feeds the pump, when activated. Pull fuse 22 though, for the suggested procedure.

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  18. #18
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    Ok it didn't start but it sounded alot more promising
    1. I tried it with fuse in an foot flat to the floor an it gave me a few extra stutters
    2. Tried it with the fuse out an it stuttered real fast like just before it starts
    3. Tried reinserting it half way through an it didn't seen to do anything special *also tried the opposite way pulling it out halfway through*

    I'll continue with the heater cleaner in the intake tommorow afternoon

    I stopped by AutoZone today to see if they had something to measure the fuel pressure at the Schrader valve ...would something basic like that give you the information you need

    I also have the fox well nt510 scanner if there's anything that can do to help

    Also want to say, the advice is very appreciated Chris I've been trying to give as much information as I can (even If it is very dumbed down) to make it easier

    I've been reading a few of the other topics at least I know I'm an a**hole

  19. #19
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    Absolutely, if Autozoo will loan you a fuel pressure gauge that screws to a Schrader valve, we can prove or rule out a fuel pump very quickly. We're working with very little actual evidence here. If you hook up that fuel pressure test gauge, and have 5 or 10 psi, you have the answer.

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  20. #20
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    Another question outside of this issue brought to my attention by another topic ,

    the original reason it was parked, was suddenly one morning when i started it , it was shaking I couldn't pin point exactly where from memory but I'd say I could feel it the most in the steering wheel an floor I assumed this was the misfire after reading codes an having a couple of sudden misfires. what's the chance it's a solenoid or something to do with the cam shaft position

    - - - Updated - - -

    It didn't seem to have low rpms like the issue after overheating an it didn't try to die at all . I never tried to drive it or rev the engine like that I just turned it off an continued to work

  21. #21
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    Okay update to the fuel pressure measurement
    (My common knowledge didn't understand that the key needed to be in the start position to get the fuel pressure )

    1. Tried with the key in the start position go to approx 40 psi
    2. Tried starting it an got approx 35 psi
    3 . Tried starting it with pedal to the floor (almost started much more than yesterday) an got roughly 50 psi

  22. #22
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    Really, all 3 readings should have been the same: 51 psi. Still, you're seeing enough fuel pressure for the engine to start and run, so let's try another tack. (Hang on to the fuel pressure gauge for another couple of days, until it runs).

    Test for spark. Pull out one coil pack, and one spark plug. (While we're here, what exactly does the spark plug say on it? You'll have to read the lettering etched into the metal part. What does it look and smell like? Is it black and crudded up? Does it smell like gas?)

    Now, put that spark plug into the coil boot. I usually wrap a piece of wire around the threads of the spark plug, and attach the other end of the wire to a good ground....but you CAN just lay the threads of the spark plug on top of a good ground, if they will reach. Then, while you are watching the spark plug, have someone else try to start the engine. Do you see a spark?

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  23. #23
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    Okay I returned the pressure gauge today because it was convienent but it's no problem to get it again

    Would it be helpful to make a video of this so you can see my previous plugs an coils I only have two plugs an a coil I trashed the rest last week but foresight I just replaced these the day I posted this topic so "doubtful they will be corroded

    - - - Updated - - -

    There was quite a bit of oil (I haven't looked in it but it was on the threads of the plug so I guess compared to the video I watched in another topic )in my 6th plug so obviously have a leak if that would point to anything

  24. #24
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    Trying to be helpful) If your assuming that I may have misread the pressure the first two times , I assure you I'm being generous with those numbers. it was surely under that point an the last time nearly touched the 50 mark if that might point to anything like a couple bad injector

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmwdirtracer View Post
    Really, all 3 readings should have been the same: 51 psi. Still, you're seeing enough fuel pressure for the engine to start and run, so let's try another tack. (Hang on to the fuel pressure gauge for another couple of days, until it runs).

    Test for spark. Pull out one coil pack, and one spark plug. (While we're here, what exactly does the spark plug say on it? You'll have to read the lettering etched into the metal part. What does it look and smell like? Is it black and crudded up? Does it smell like gas?)

    Now, put that spark plug into the coil boot. I usually wrap a piece of wire around the threads of the spark plug, and attach the other end of the wire to a good ground....but you CAN just lay the threads of the spark plug on top of a good ground, if they will reach. Then, while you are watching the spark plug, have someone else try to start the engine. Do you see a spark?
    DO THIS!!
    Let us know the results,
    Do this for each plug if you have to!
    Post a video of your dashboard while you attempt a key start for 5-7 seconds.

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