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Thread: Alignment

  1. #1
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    Alignment

    Who here gets their car aligned to their own specs?
    If so, what are yall doing? Whos making big power and running stock alignment specs?
    Ive been battling issues with stability and think my alignment is f'ed.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by rajicase View Post
    Who here gets their car aligned to their own specs?
    If so, what are yall doing? Whos making big power and running stock alignment specs?
    Ive been battling issues with stability and think my alignment is f'ed.
    I’ll have to pull out my last specs for you. There was a whole thread on it somewhere buddy.


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  3. #3
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    For max straight line traction you flatten and square out the rear. But it won’t handle as well and you should think about that. Maybe max straight line is not what you want. For handling ask a racer like joenationwide.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    For max straight line traction you flatten and square out the rear. But it won’t handle as well and you should think about that. Maybe max straight line is not what you want. For handling ask a racer like joenationwide.
    Traction is not my issue. And I've got drag radials on my car, handling is not my concern. My issue is high speed stability especially during hard pulls; the car feels very unstable, and wanders a lot.

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  5. #5
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    If you add in a little bit of toe you'll probably be in good shape.

    If you don't know where the current alignment sits I'd recommend aligning the vehicle as close to factory as they can.


    From your description I would ensure everything in the rear suspension is in good shape. I've had some sketchy times with trailing arm bushings in various states of disrepair. You might want to consider one of the sealed spherical bearing options for that location.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin325i View Post
    If you add in a little bit of toe you'll probably be in good shape.

    If you don't know where the current alignment sits I'd recommend aligning the vehicle as close to factory as they can.


    From your description I would ensure everything in the rear suspension is in good shape. I've had some sketchy times with trailing arm bushings in various states of disrepair. You might want to consider one of the sealed spherical bearing options for that location.
    Everything in the rear has been replaced; all ball joints, bushings, mounts, etc...
    I will get it in for an alignment soon. I had to raise the rear end quite a bit to fit my tires and I am betting that messed with my alignment enough...

  7. #7
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    Yeah it will. I've also had the trailing arms move so check that the bolts are tight.

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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by rajicase View Post
    Traction is not my issue. And I've got drag radials on my car, handling is not my concern. My issue is high speed stability especially during hard pulls; the car feels very unstable, and wanders a lot.

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    What drag radials? The softer and squishier the better the traction off the line but the less stable. R compound street legal race tires won’t be as forgiving off the line but will give good traction and be stable.

    I do think you are onto something with the jacked up rear. Maybe flare and lower. A bigger front spoiler might help as well.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    What drag radials? The softer and squishier the better the traction off the line but the less stable. R compound street legal race tires won’t be as forgiving off the line but will give good traction and be stable.

    I do think you are onto something with the jacked up rear. Maybe flare and lower. A bigger front spoiler might help as well.
    Ive got two sets; I have a set of Mickey ET Street R 275/50/15 and a set of Mickey ET street SS 274/40/17.
    I initially thought it was just the 15s causing my high speed stability issues until I tried the 17s. The 17s are DEFNITELY an improvement, but still doesn't feel 'normal.'

    My car is flared, and as low as it possibly can be and still fit big tires.

    I am going to get an alignment soon and dial in some camber; Im gonna try -1 0 -1.5 in the rear paired with 0.10 toe in per side and 0 toe up front and see how she does. Im thinking that has to be my issue at this point.

  11. #11
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    Are you using limiters in the RTABs?

  12. #12
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    Honestly for high speed stability, the factory spec should be close to perfect.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    Are you using limiters in the RTABs?
    Poly rtabs, no limiters.

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    Can you elaborate on what you mean by unstable and wandering? Is the rear wandering, or the front? Does accelerating, steady state or decelerating make a difference? What happens when you hit bumps? Is it worse over a certain speed (and then is it linear or is it solid up to a point and then starts misbehaving)?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJuggernaut View Post
    Can you elaborate on what you mean by unstable and wandering? Is the rear wandering, or the front? Does accelerating, steady state or decelerating make a difference? What happens when you hit bumps? Is it worse over a certain speed (and then is it linear or is it solid up to a point and then starts misbehaving)?
    Its most pronounced during hard 3rd-4th pulls. Cruising much above 70-80 is also mildly unpleasant; rear end feels like its "floating" for lack of a better word. Car sways from left to right, especially under WOT pulls, very hard to keep it straight without a lot of correction from the steering wheel.
    Nothing noticeable while decelerating or going over bumps. Not sure if that is a good enough description, but the best way I can describe it is that the rear end feels very light and "floaty," and likes to wander left and right for no apparent reason. Annoying while cruising but kind of scary during hard pulls.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rajicase View Post
    Its most pronounced during hard 3rd-4th pulls. Cruising much above 70-80 is also mildly unpleasant; rear end feels like its "floating" for lack of a better word. Car sways from left to right, especially under WOT pulls, very hard to keep it straight without a lot of correction from the steering wheel.
    Nothing noticeable while decelerating or going over bumps. Not sure if that is a good enough description, but the best way I can describe it is that the rear end feels very light and "floaty," and likes to wander left and right for no apparent reason. Annoying while cruising but kind of scary during hard pulls.
    If you are running drag radials on the street I don’t think you’ll find them ever as good as a ultra high performance tires/r comps others have mentioned.


    A proper alinement should help some, but dr’s aren’t great for the street.
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  17. #17
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    My guess is that when you raised it you also got some toe out which will definitely cause instability. I would not recommend ‘stock specs’ as that would also give you too much negative camber. What I would suggest is 1/8” or 0.1° total toe in and 0°- 0.5° camber in the rear. For the front, 0 toe and 1° - 2° negative camber. You will be limiter for front camber unless you have installed camber plates. Having less camber in the front would be fine for what you are doing.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by chikinhed View Post
    My guess is that when you raised it you also got some toe out which will definitely cause instability. I would not recommend ‘stock specs’ as that would also give you too much negative camber. What I would suggest is 1/8” or 0.1° total toe in and 0°- 0.5° camber in the rear. For the front, 0 toe and 1° - 2° negative camber. You will be limiter for front camber unless you have installed camber plates. Having less camber in the front would be fine for what you are doing.
    Yeah I have camber plates I was going to do -1.5-2 up front with 0 to. From what I've been reading what you suggest for the rear sounds reasonable and is what I will try.

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  19. #19
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    Don't do too much at one time or you learn nothing if it doesn't solve the problem. One thing at a time. Check rear alignment. What are your rear tire pressures? Going up might help make the car feel better when not racing. Are your dampers adjustable? You might have a blown or too loose a damper but you would know it with the car behaving badly going over bumps, esp when turning, it will want to hop to the side.

  20. #20
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    0 toe will actually end up positive toe in the front and in back slightly negative. You can get away with this in the back but you want - toe in front even if it's only a small amount. positive toe is uncontrollable.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rajicase View Post
    Its most pronounced during hard 3rd-4th pulls. Cruising much above 70-80 is also mildly unpleasant; rear end feels like its "floating" for lack of a better word. Car sways from left to right, especially under WOT pulls, very hard to keep it straight without a lot of correction from the steering wheel.
    Nothing noticeable while decelerating or going over bumps. Not sure if that is a good enough description, but the best way I can describe it is that the rear end feels very light and "floaty," and likes to wander left and right for no apparent reason. Annoying while cruising but kind of scary during hard pulls.
    Your chosen tire isn't helping. What's the power level? Even with traction, the rear end can walk around a bit under higher horsepower levels. If you're needing a "lot"(whatever that is) of steering wheel input to keep the car on course, something isn't right, or you're spinning.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by somebody5788 View Post
    0 toe will actually end up positive toe in the front and in back slightly negative. You can get away with this in the back but you want - toe in front even if it's only a small amount. positive toe is uncontrollable.
    I gotta say I disagree. Toe is usually expressed as toe in or toe out. If the front wheels pivot aft due to FCAB deflection under drag or braking it will result in toe in on an e36. The amount of toe in will depend on FCAB stiffness, static control arm angle and spring rates. I have been running 0 toe on the street for years and love it. When I do track events I add a degree or so of camber which also adds a bit of toe out and the car feels great, far from uncontrollable.

    Toe in is great for when you are texting, doing your lipstick and trying to find that french fry you dropped while cruising down the highway as well as causing your tires to wear out faster.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by chikinhed View Post
    Toe in is great for when you are texting, doing your lipstick and trying to find that french fry you dropped while cruising down the highway as well as causing your tires to wear out faster.


    Im always game for a little road-fap.

    Took my car in for an alignment yesterday, and after the dipstick tech stalled my car 3 times, asked another tech to pull it in, who stalled it once himself.... I was told they couldn't get the car on the rack. Which makes no sense to me as the car has been aligned plenty of times without issue. And my car is far from 'slammed.' Its probably close to stock height, honestly.. But regardless, figured they shouldn't be touching my car either way and left...
    Last edited by rajicase; 12-19-2018 at 10:45 AM.

  24. #24
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    I get mine done by a buddy at the dealership. Im pretty slammed so i have to pull my front bumper off to get on the rack. Other than that there are never any issues. Those other guys are just tards.

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  25. #25
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    Yeah my car def is not that low. Ill take it somewhere else soon.

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