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  1. #1
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    No words...

    The Valkyrie's V12...

    https://youtu.be/pk8ZrN__nmA
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
    5spd E46 "3XX": 328i engine, 330i Intake and exhaust, CAI, 323i diff.

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    Quite an engineering exercise.
    I don't see the point of making the engine a stressed element in a road car but nicely done, if it will survive in a real world.

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

  3. #3
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    Weight reduction and increased rigidity (not sure about that one) I guess ? The Valkyrie is going to be their flagship car so that probably explains that...
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
    5spd E46 "3XX": 328i engine, 330i Intake and exhaust, CAI, 323i diff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Breeze1 View Post
    Weight reduction and increased rigidity (not sure about that one) I guess ? The Valkyrie is going to be their flagship car so that probably explains that...
    The durability requirements of a road car are worlds different than that of a racing car. A couple hundred hours screaming away on test stand is nice but I can't wait to see Sheik Yerboutie's kids honing around the curbs of Dubai in one of these.
    Colin Chapman first did this to save weight("add lightness"), hanging a gear box and rear suspension of F1 is one thing, the weight of a road car another.
    Last edited by ross1; 12-13-2018 at 01:21 PM.

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

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    Quote Originally Posted by ross1 View Post
    The durability requirements of a road car are worlds different than that of a racing car. A couple hundred hours screaming away on test stand is nice but I can't wait to see Sheik Yerboutie's kids honing around the curbs of Dubai in one of these.
    Colin Chapman first did this to save weight("add lightness"), hanging a gear box and rear suspension of F1 is one thing, the weight of a road car another.
    He does say that they spent a great deal of time making that possible. I guess it'll have to be proven. I still think a 6.5l V12 revving up to 11000RPM on a road car is very impressive, all the more when it sounds that good doing it. If the 1000hp figure doesn't include hybrid motors we're looking at 153Hp/l on a NA engine...
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
    5spd E46 "3XX": 328i engine, 330i Intake and exhaust, CAI, 323i diff.

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    "Road car" is a relative thing. Ross's point about the potential buyers of this car are quite valid. When you have a "stable" of multi mega million dollar cars, do you even really care if one spends more time in the shop, than on the road?

    That said, using the engine as a stressed member is fine, in my (never humble) opinion. Revving 11,000 rpm, with a street 6.5 V12? No, sorry. That's ~2000 rpm beyond anything Porsche, Honda, or Ferrari have sent out on the street, and those weren't 6.5 litre V-12's.

    Personally, I'd rather have the 20 year old McLaren F1.

    My 2 cents.
    Last edited by bmwdirtracer; 12-13-2018 at 09:47 PM.

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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breeze1 View Post
    ...... If the 1000hp figure doesn't include hybrid motors we're looking at 153Hp/l on a NA engine...
    About what a DTM prepped 2.5 S14 was producing per liter 30 years ago. I know, it didn't pass emissions.
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    Okay, now you guys have done it. McLaren and 1000 NA HP mentioned in the same thread.
    Enjoy; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBNh8LMShyE
    So, what would you rather have? Some sissified, driver assisted, air conditioned "super car" or this bad ass MF scaring your pants off?
    Last edited by ross1; 12-14-2018 at 09:25 AM.

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

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    Quote Originally Posted by ross1 View Post
    Okay, now you guys have done it. McLaren and 1000 NA HP mentioned in the same thread.
    Enjoy; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBNh8LMShyE
    So, what would you rather have? Some sissified, driver assisted, air conditioned "super car" or this bad ass MF scaring your pants off?
    Thanks for sharing. I don't think the Valkyrie will be designed the way you mentioned (just look at those specs, the chassis and body design...actually it makes me think of the F1 in many ways!) and there are still cars with 0 driver assists being released (think of the Noble M600 which doesn't even have ABS, and a fully disconnectable traction control, while having a twin turbo V8 engine). But I would still take the F1 over it, because everthing about that car is, well... a Mc Laren F1!
    Last edited by Breeze1; 12-14-2018 at 12:11 PM.
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
    5spd E46 "3XX": 328i engine, 330i Intake and exhaust, CAI, 323i diff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Breeze1 View Post
    Thanks for sharing. I don't think the Valkyrie will be designed the way you mentioned (just look at those specs, the chassis and body design...actually it makes me think of the F1 in many ways!) and there are still cars with 0 driver assists being released (think of the Noble M600 which doesn't even have ABS, and a fully disconnectable traction control, while having a twin turbo V8 engine). But I would still take the F1 over it, because everthing about that car is, well... a Mc Laren F1!
    The Noble is a barrel of monkey!
    I got a few demonstration laps in one(duratec) at Road America. HUGE fun and compared to other cars of it's ilk is cheap as chips to run.
    You can grenade an engine for the cost of CF brakes on other exotics.
    I plan on owning one and beating the living daylights out of it.

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ross1 View Post
    The Noble is a barrel of monkey!
    I got a few demonstration laps in one(duratec) at Road America. HUGE fun and compared to other cars of it's ilk is cheap as chips to run.
    You can grenade an engine for the cost of CF brakes on other exotics.
    I plan on owning one and beating the living daylights out of it.
    Sounds like a lot of fun!
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
    5spd E46 "3XX": 328i engine, 330i Intake and exhaust, CAI, 323i diff.

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    Are we talking about the same car? I Googled Noble M600, and it's a $450,000 car with a Volvo engine. Those must be some damned expensive chips you're using, Ross! And if I'm going to thrash a half-million dollar car, I damned sure expect it to have ABS. But a VOLVO engine ? Oh hell no. I'll take that aluminum N/A big block Chevy in the McLaren, please.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_M600

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    Quote Originally Posted by bmwdirtracer View Post
    Are we talking about the same car? I Googled Noble M600, and it's a $450,000 car with a Volvo engine. Those must be some damned expensive chips you're using, Ross! And if I'm going to thrash a half-million dollar car, I damned sure expect it to have ABS. But a VOLVO engine ? Oh hell no. I'll take that aluminum N/A big block Chevy in the McLaren, please.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_M600
    No
    My experience is with the M12/400 which uses a boosted Ford "Duratec" V6 lifted straight out of the Mondeo(Mercury Mystique). Nothing exotic about it. It was a "kit" car, sold fully assembled less engine which would be installed stateside. Around $60k worth as I recall at the time. The rights to build this model were later sold to the US importer who is the fellow that offered me the ride.
    See Rossion Q1 for Lee Noble's original version. I think now built by Superformance is SA.
    Clarkson was giddy over it too;
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lENg5Zpw-cA

    I'd also take the rat motored M8 McLaren but it is well out my price range and the price will only go up.
    Take note of the machinery this car effortlessly drives past and hear it breaking the tires(more than a yard's width of sticky Avons!) loose at a buck fifty or so cresting the hill on RA's long front straight.
    I had an opportunity to chat with the owner of it and asked him about the engine. It is a bit shy of 600ci with something like 14:1 compression and a crazy wild cam, built strong enough to stay together to 7k or so. Again, nothing exotic just a huge brute this time.
    The car has since been sold and is still kicking around but with a different, less powerful engine these days.
    Last edited by ross1; 12-15-2018 at 02:54 AM.

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

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    There's always the Ultima; beginning at a price of (quote) "a mundane M3":

    http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/Models/EvoCoupe

    Still, no ABS, and I'd bet the 1000 horsepower version costs a bit more....
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by bmwdirtracer; 12-15-2018 at 09:44 AM.

    Chris Powell
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    I'm thinking a well built LS wouldn't be hard to find closer to home at a lesser price than one built England.
    Another one to dream about. Mosler is another but just so damn ugly

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

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    I'm not so sure....the Brits have been making track toys aplenty for SO many decades, that I think they have an edge. And, yeah, the Ultima's a whole lot prettier than any Mosler I've ever seen.

    Well, I guess when it's as aggressive looking as the Ultima, you can hardly call it "pretty".

    In my younger days, I used to put rat motors in every car I owned. On this forum, there probably aren't many people who know what "porcupine head" means. But these days, everything is bigger and better. Maybe an Ultima would fit this critter, detuned just a little from its 2150 normally aspirated horsepower:

    https://www.hotrod.com/articles/1211...-block-engine/

    That is 16 and a half liters. Damn. 6 inch stroke. One inch valve lift. And there's a street version. DROOL.
    Last edited by bmwdirtracer; 12-15-2018 at 12:51 PM.

    Chris Powell
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  17. #17
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    That's certainly a big engine. Even though it may emulate BBC architecture, calling it one strains credulity. Chevrolet BB's have 4.84 bore spacing so those 5.22 pistons are an impossibility. I don't think the long arms of that crank wouldn't even fit into a BBC crankcase, much less turn without hitting anything.
    Regardless I love it. There is a danish guy who also "built" a mammoth big block "Chevy".https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_YzoupDoAs
    Looks quite a bit like Sonny's motor doesn't it?
    Last edited by ross1; 12-15-2018 at 01:51 PM.

    If you can leave two black stripes from the exit of one corner to the braking zone of the next, you have enough horsepower. - Mark Donohue

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    Yup. I dare say either could leave two black stripes all way down any straight

    Chris Powell
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  19. #19
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    Some impressive cars shared here! I'd personally always choose drivability over sheer hp figures, and these do fit the bill! The M12 and the Ultima are quite the bargain when compared to the Aston, but at the expense of an NA V12. It's all about compromise.
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
    5spd E46 "3XX": 328i engine, 330i Intake and exhaust, CAI, 323i diff.

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