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Thread: Bilstein B8 (Sport / H1) can be paired with stock springs ?

  1. #1
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    Can Bilstein B8 (Sport / H1) be paired with stock springs ?

    Quick check that the Bilstein B8 lower perch will accept the stock E36 M3 spring and that I will be able to fit the rear stock spring and re-attach the shock after.

    I'm importing an M3 in Canada and the H&R springs are failing because they lower the car to much.
    I have the stock springs but don't want to undo everything to realize the geometry does not match.

    I don't care about comfort or making sense the setup will be on the car for the inspection only.

    Thanks as usual for the great feedback.
    Last edited by Franky goes; 12-05-2018 at 03:40 PM.

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    Your alignment will be off, anytime you swap suspension you need to get an alignment done

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    Call Bilstein.

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    I'm surprised this hasn't been answered already.

    Yes they will fit. You'll find that the car will ride like crap with the B8's, but honestly the stock spring is by far the best combination for that particular strut/shock as far as comfort compared to any of the H&R offerings.

    The alignment will be off, but this is relevant with any strut removal.


    Quote Originally Posted by Franky goes View Post
    Quick check that the Bilstein B8 lower perch will accept the stock E36 M3 spring and that I will be able to fit the rear stock spring and re-attach the shock after.

    I'm importing an M3 in Canada and the H&R springs are failing because they lower the car to much.
    I have the stock springs but don't want to undo everything to realize the geometry does not match.

    I don't care about comfort or making sense the setup will be on the car for the inspection only.

    Thanks as usual for the great feedback.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
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  5. #5
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    If you have stock springs they should fit the Bilstein struts as long as there is a sway bar tab on the casing categorically making them E36M3 compatible.


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  6. #6
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    Well I might not agree that the stock is the best. The OE Sport is pretty good for a street car. Only thing is you need to use the 95 top hats for the front springs.

    So, what year M3? Are the front springs the same size top and bottom? (that would be a 95, later cars, the top of the spring is smaller, hence the need for the 95 bigger hat.)

    I do agree that you probably aren't going to like the Billy's....
    No matter where you go, there you are...

  7. #7
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    Bilstein B8 (Sport / H1) can be paired with stock springs ?

    HR Spring Install
    The 1995 M3 has a larger upper spring winding than the 1996-1999 M3 spring winding. This smaller upper spring winding on the later M3 was done to stiffen the front end and help bias to understeer. H&R OE Sport springs will require the 1995 M3 spring ‘hat’ and spring pad to fit properly on 1996+ M3. I am fairly confidant - The 1995 M3 front upper spring winding is the same diameter as the non-M3 springs, but the 1995 M3 has it’s own ‘hat’. The E36 lower spring winding of the non-M front springs are of larger diameter than the M3 lower spring windings and as result the strut casings are not interchangeable with M3 springs.
    As I recall, E36 M3:
    H&R OE Sport springs are dark blue.
    H&R Sport springs are grey.
    H&R Race springs are red.
    Go to www.realoem.com or see a list in this thread https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...E36-M3-spindle



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    Last edited by bluptgm3; 12-06-2018 at 01:52 PM.

  8. #8
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    The OE Sport springs are gray.
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  9. #9
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    How thorough is inspection?

    Can you just jam some spring spacers in for inspection? (or tennis balls, or a football, or or or...)

    get-attachment.jpg
    Last edited by Moron95M3; 12-06-2018 at 08:22 PM.
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  10. #10
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    Wtf?
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by RRSperry View Post
    Wtf?
    you're an engineer, right?

    Efficiency is key, lol. He said for inspection only - I provided an efficient (albeit ghetto) solution. I assume he is leaving the HR setup on once it passes inspection.
    Last edited by Moron95M3; 12-06-2018 at 09:01 PM.
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  12. #12
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    Ah, got it now... there’s also the stack up the 25mm? Rubber spring mounts.
    No matter where you go, there you are...

  13. #13
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    ^^True, the oem mounts are an option, but more difficult to install.
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  14. #14
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    Bilstein B8 (Sport / H1) can be paired with stock springs ?

    Quote Originally Posted by RRSperry View Post
    The OE Sport springs are gray.
    H&R Sports are gray....or nearly black?
    http://www.hrsprings.com/application...s/c29910-2.jpg

    H&R OE Sports are dark blue on my wife’s car…
    Well the 1995 EOs seem to be purple from H&R site…
    http://www.hrsprings.com/application.../c50410-55.jpg



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    Last edited by bluptgm3; 12-06-2018 at 10:53 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hova View Post
    You'll find that the car will ride like crap with the B8's,
    Bilstein went on ‘back order’ last spring and I was under the impression there was a minor redesigned to correct the harshness that caused the ‘back order’ state while they retooled.



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  16. #16
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    Wow !

    Thank you guys for the detailed answers.
    I'm putting the stock springs on the Billies knowing full well that I will have to compress the crap out of the springs, especially in the rear, to assemble everything.
    For the record this set-up will be on the car for one week and the springs (Gray / Sport) will be for sale...

    I talked to the technician yesterday and they accept Bilstein as OE but not the aftermarket springs... Sometimes rules don't make sense.
    I'm having the car inspected so I can plate it before I turn it into a race car that I will drive to and from the track. For the record my max distance is about 400 miles. More than that and I pull with U-Haul and the box on the truck serves as room and 'board'.

    The suspension going on the car is the double adjustable MCS.

    I'm going through all this trouble because the previous race car got bent at Mosport when I missed the debris flag that was out for oil...
    Putting a new half-back was about $8,000 (CAN) so instead I'm rebuilding from a California shell that will supply me with a spare for every part of the car, including engine. Accounting for the value of the spare engine and rebuilding the cage it comes to about $10,000 net. At this point an extra $2,000 is almost inconsequential (Racing changes your relation to money...) and I get to correct all the mistakes I made building the first time :-)

    For the curious here is a video of the crash. If you wait till the end you will see where the oil was at the apex of #2 at 99 miles an hour. Bad combination.
    Please be gentle with your comments. It still stings after spending 6 years building the car. You will not see the flag on the video but it was out. Hard to see, but it was out.
    The 'raining' sound at the end is the rear windshield shattering when I back into the wall - I swore that wall was another 30 feet back but nop.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTB5ZqxOwic
    Last edited by Franky goes; 12-06-2018 at 11:28 PM.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky goes View Post

    For the curious here is a video of the crash. If you wait till the end you will see where the oil was at the apex of #2 at 99 miles an hour. Bad combination.
    Please be gentle with your comments. It still stings after spending 6 years building the car. You will not see the flag on the video but it was out. Hard to see, but it was out.
    The 'raining' sound at the end is the rear windshield shattering when I back into the wall - I swore that wall was another 30 feet back but nop.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTB5ZqxOwic
    Most importantly I'm glad you where able to walk away from that. It looks like you slammed into the wall pretty hard. Always have to keep in mind that cars are replaceable.

    Good news is you'll be able to make this car even better
    Last edited by Hova; 12-07-2018 at 02:02 AM. Reason: Stuff.
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  18. #18
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    Thanks,
    It was actually fairly gentle.
    Vector speed in the fence the first time was something like 15 miles an hour. Backing in the other wall was 10 miles an hour.
    The DL1 only has 2G accelerometers so I had to rely on the GPS calculated vector Gs for the impact. At 10Gs it was noticeable but much better than hitting the stalled car on the outside... Poor choice to park a car outside a 100 mph corner.

  19. #19
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    Back to the inspection I got the front suspension remounted with the stock springs and as pointed out it fits like a glove. I expect the rear to go as well.

    According to the inspection report the rack has play in it on the left side only...
    After changing the rack with a good one the play (1mm) is still there...
    Turns out the Lower Joint assembly upper joint has play in it but only at certain positions.
    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...diagId=32_0640
    The play is too small to see.
    You can only hear it.
    I guess that 'play' gets amplified by the time you wiggle the wheel horizontally.

    I removed the part from the parts car and will be done tomorrow with some luck.
    This is a pain to remove. There is about a 1/4 inch to swing at that part between the ABS pump and the starter.

    I'll let you know how the follow-up inspection goes.
    Fingers crossed.
    Last edited by Franky goes; 12-08-2018 at 10:58 PM.

  20. #20
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    Never mind
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by RRSperry View Post
    Never mind
    Hey at least he didn't shove in a "tennis ball/football".
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  22. #22
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    Good news !!
    Inspection past. I think the technician had pity for me.
    After replacing both front arms, the power steering, steering knuckle and the Lower joint assembly

    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...40#32311159866

    I still had some play in the the left to right axes (Holding the tire at 3 and 9 o'clock).
    While everything was apart on both cars I grabbed the lower end of the upper steering column sticking out the firewall just below the brake booster and there was a good 1 mm play in all directions. Looks like the lower bearing

    http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...35#32311158686

    is worn. If that's not the case the only thing that was not transplanted is the upper steering column and the steering wheel... I doubt it's the steering wheel ! It will be an easy job when the engine is out of the bay.

    ECS even has a kit already put together. It replace the lower and upper bearing.

    https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...32311092949kt/

    I'm not the only E36 with this issue..
    I just wish there was a heavy duty option for race cars.

    Thanks for the help.
    Last edited by Franky goes; 12-12-2018 at 08:07 PM.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hova View Post
    Hey at least he didn't shove in a "tennis ball/football".
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