Dead battery = cluster problems?

[fuzzy530i]

Went on vacation for a week so my 02 530i sat the whole time. Car was running fine when I left but when I went to leave this morning the car wouldn't unlock with the key or the clicker. When I got home this afternoon the car unlocked manually. Took the battery to the parts store and it was bad so I bought a new one (13.6-8V while running, 12.26 with key on), I installed it and the car unlocked like normal. Started the car and the tach isn't working, temp gauge immediately pegs to red, yellow brake light is on, the radio will not let me set the time, the "fasten seatbelt" message wont go away when I click the OBC button anymore (only goes away when I put on the seatbelt), neither turn signal indicators on the cluster work, high beam indicator works if i pull back not push it forwards. If I turn the headlight knob to "on" instead of "auto" the high beam indicator works when I push it forward, regardless of the indicators on the cluster working all lights work as they should. The car runs and drives, only took it up the street and back so I know the ODO and speedo work but tach still won't. Sometimes when I turn the key to the "on" position the temp gauge will read correctly for a second then peg red.

Checked all fuses and they're good, did the cluster test and all lights come on and all gauges go through their range of motion like they should. When I check the coolant temp through the cluster it says -128 *C, and engine speed at idle through the cluster test said 65,XXX U/MIN.

Any ideas what's going on? TIA

[edjack]

Battery slowly dying and weird results

There is some anecdotal evidence that suggests that, when the battery slowly dies, the various electronic modules enter an undefined state.

Wake the car up (open the boot) and let it go to sleep (16 min). Disconnect the negative terminal of the battery and let the car set for an hour or so. Reconnect, and observe the results.

Report back.

BTW, 12.26 = 50% charge. Before doing the above, charge the battery for 24 hours at 6-10 A rate, hopefully with a smart charger. Batteries can set for weeks (or months) in the distribution channel, and lose charge. I ALWAYS charge a new battery before putting it in service.

[Chedley]

Bad or discharged battery.
Plus, you did not drive the car long enough to warm up the alternator and give it a chance to recharge the new battery.

I'd take the battery back to the vendor, and ask them to fully recharge it, then re-install it and take the car on a long drive. Monitor the voltage of the new battery with OBC test #9. It should be 13.5 volts, with engine warm and idling.

[StephenVA]

+1 low battery will cause all kinds of weird behavior. Clear all codes and restart.

[fuzzy530i]

So left the battery unplugged for 5+ hours and nothing changed when I hooked it back up. I picked up a charger while I was out so I will charge it until tomorrow night and see what happens. The reading of 12.2 was after having the key on for about 20 mins, and it is 13.6-13.8 V while running when checking with test 9. Also no check engine lights just the yellow brake light is on.

I was going to take it for a longer drive but wasn't sure how safe it was with the temp gauge being pegged. Is it more than likely from the battery or a faulty temp sensor?

[fuzzy530i]

Charged the battery until the charger said it was good, read 13.5x-13.6. Put it back in the car and no change except that the yellow brake light goes on and off periodically, cluster test said the voltage was 13.6 while running. Only ran it for less than 5 mins and the voltage dropped to 12.5-12.6 with the car/key off.

[geargrinder]

Scenario: whatever fault actually kilt the battree in first place is actually still active maybe? Hows your water levels in the passenger floor? Checked the cluster connectors? (not that those should randomly go bad but... in case like this... just confirm what you can easily...)

[fuzzy530i]

I have not checked those, the "water on in the passenger floor" actually sounds like it could be the problem. A couple days before I left town someone spilt a coffee all over the front passenger floor board, but it did run perfectly fine before then.

[makenzie71]

I had water in the dme plug on mine...I’m sure that contributed to my problem. After about a dozen power cycles my issue went away.

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Oops forgot link https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...where-to-start

[geargrinder]

I have not checked those, the "water on in the passenger floor" actually sounds like it could be the problem. A couple days before I left town someone spilt a coffee all over the front passenger floor board, but it did run perfectly fine before then.

Yeah that shouldn't do it. The known problem is more LOTS of water getting in under the carpet unbeknownst to the owner... Usually coming through the door or the sunroof drain and making a puddle under there that you may or may not sense from above - you end up with a giant swamp under there that causes all kinda crazy shorts and problems. Most people don't know - there's a load of fuses and wiring connections sitting right under the passengers leg-area.

[fuzzy530i]

So took the car to work (3 mile drive there), on start up battery was 13.6V, while driving it never went above 13.7 V. When it hit 13.7 V the brake light would go away. While driving it would bounce between 13.4, 13.6, and 13.7 while driving; at idle it would bounce anywhere between 13.3V and 13.6V. The heated seats still work but not as well as before and the rear defroster doesn't work at all even though the light comes on when I press the button, heat/AC work as normal.

When heading home from work it was 13.2 to 13.3 on start up then went up to 13.6, when I turned on the front and rear defroster it dropped to 13.2 at idle, then worked its way back to 13.4 V. The drive was about twice as long but nothing changed with the cluster and the voltage values were pretty much the same as above when running and idling.

Also from what I was told it rained quite a bit when I was gone on vacation, car doesn't usually leak water anywhere but when I first discovered the problems and went to check the fuses in the glove box the leather book thing that holds my owner manuals etc had some condensation on the side that faced the "felt" of the glovebox door.

[JimLev]

There is a sun roof drain in both front A pillars, drains in the rears too.
The pass side A pillar drain could be leaking into the cabin.
Turning on the blower and defroster will cause the voltage to drop, yours looks OK.
Alternators don't need to "warm up" they will start pumping out current a few seconds after the engine has started.
For piece of mind you might want to check under the pass side carpet (and foam) just in front of the pass side right hand seat slide rail. That's where the fuse box is located.

Go Tigers!

[geargrinder]

Ding **^^

[fuzzy530i]

The only time it has leaked is if I parked in a parking lot and the car was "leaned" towards the passenger front and there's a big thunderstorm. When it happened I took out the headliner and ran wire through all the drains and nothing came out, also waited for an other severe rainstorms and it didn't overflow with A pillar and headliner out. So I put everything back in and make sure not to park like that.

Took the car to class this morning (around 15 miles to class), and voltage stayed pretty much same as before, but when I was pulling in at idle it dropped to 13.0. Also noticed my heat wont get warm, its 22 *F here and it got to maybe 50 *F and the test 7 still read -128 * when I got to class.

I will check the floorboard this weekend when I get time, also going to recharge the battery because I borrowed a charger from a friend and it turns green at 80% or more and flashes when done whereas the one I used to have would be solid when at 100% so I took it off mistakenly when it turned green at 80% +.

[geargrinder]

Well, the glove box stays boner dry all other things being normal, so, I'd say no doubt you got a leak down there still or again.

Might check to see if the front corner rubber tube has pulled off its nipple. You don't need to pull whole headliner to do that, just pull A-pillar trim off and pull down the corner of the HL.

There's also a little bitty plug at each side of the sunroof rails/channels that some guys have reported popping out. Its hard to ID and notice but that could account for this situation because it only leaks under heavy rain conditions. For the most part the cassette is 100% reliable and "leakproof" in and of itself, and that failure is pretty rare it seems (more often its the rubber tube...) but there have been a couple reports of that little guy popping out somehow.

The bummer thing about the passenger wading pool problem is that the nice E39 sound/temp insulation keeps all that water down there, so even if that leaks only under heavy rain, it can pile up under there.

[fuzzy530i]

From what I have found they're different types of fuses in the floorboard, are they dealer only? And I haven't been able to find a break down of what fuses are for what? Also I guess test them by seeing if it has 12V on both ends of the fuse and if not disconnect it and see if it reads 0 or infinity ohms?

[geargrinder]

Yeah they are the big ass bolt-in high amp fuses like used on the trunk power distribution panel (if you've never looked at that you can pop the plastic cover off and look). They are standard. "ANL" I think.

Circuit-Protection-1.jpg

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BTW in your case the question is less if any are blown than if there's soup down there then are they are shorting out all over the place where wires are not supposed to connect...

[JimLev]

13 volts is still OK, you were at idle. The regulator will regulate the voltage, it will be higher with more RPM, when driving it will be around 13.6 volts.

Test 7 reading -128º isn't good, you did say negative, right?
If it's a +128º your t-stat is bad.

[geargrinder]

BTW to shortcut a bit of the 'whats the floor water problem look like'... here's a great example:

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...nder-pass-seat

[JimLev]

Good pic GG.
The fuses are F107 to F114. 50A and 80A.
They supply power to many other fused circuits. If one of them was bad you'd have lots of noticeable problems.
Bentley manual page 610-35 has a description to all the circuits the above fuses feed.

[fuzzy530i]

-128 is correct, I was assuming it may be one of the temp sensors but wanted to wait until I got the cluster in working order before I replaced them. And wow I hope mine does not look like that, Ill make sure to test those two and clean any corrosion if there is any. Probably wont happen until I have time on Friday or Saturday.

[fuzzy530i]

Well ended up getting time today to check those fuses and the MID connectors, no corrosion or rust found, 12V was found on both sides of all fuses. Let the car go to sleep and disconnected the battery, going to ensure it gets fully charged and see if that does anything. If not then I will check the cluster next I guess.

Dumb question but does the fuel gauge only consider the float in the tank or does the MPG gauge and estimated range get considered? The MPG gauge isn't working so the range is constantly increasing since it is seeing 99.9 mpg and the fuel gauge appears to be slowly rising.

Edit: not sure how much it matters but realized today that the gear selection in the cluster doesn't show what gear it's in, and the clock on the radio shows no time.

[Qsilver7]

From what I have found they're different types of fuses in the floorboard, are they dealer only? And I haven't been able to find a break down of what fuses are for what? Also I guess test them by seeing if it has 12V on both ends of the fuse and if not disconnect it and see if it reads 0 or infinity ohms?

Bluebee covered this extensively (fuse locations). The fuses below the front passenger seat are high amp fuses (see #9 in the diagram and link to the part nbr database).

Just do a simple google search using a search phrase like "BMW Fuses Bluebee" and this should pull up her threads on this subject that has images and illustrations as to what fuse is what.

http://bmwfans.info/parts-catalog/E3..._for_fuse_box/

[fuzzy530i]

I saw his thread when I was searching, didn't recall it containing the info for exactly what fuse was what but I did remember it having the numbers and breakdowns of everything. All of those were in great shape and not a problem unfortunately. Still charging the battery so I will see what happens tomorrow.

[fuzzy530i]

Well charged the battery over night, fresh off the charger it read 13.3, 30 minutes later it read 12.92, and then 3 hours later it was 12.86. Plugged it back into the car, right before I started the car it read 10V on the cluster, started it and it went to 11 then 13.4. After I shut off the car the battery read 12.4. No changes in the cluster or the clock on the radio.

Not entirely sure where to go from here or what to do about the -128 reading for coolant temp.