Windshield header seal replacement?

[JesusFreakToo]

Hi Folks:

I've been searching for pics/instructions on how to remove and replace the rubber seal that runs on top of windshield and gaskets the roof. Can anyone point me to a link?

Thank you!
Lee

[Vintage42]

... searching for pics/instructions on how to remove and replace the rubber seal that runs on top of windshield and gaskets the roof...

That gasket is continuous from the bottom of one door up the A-pillar, across the windshield and down the other A-pillar to the bottom of the other door. The long rubber gasket has a gutter across the top and a passage or tube down inside each leg. The whole gasket forms a conduit to intercept and drain water that tries to pass between the windshield and the convertible top.
Click on Images to see all the views here:
http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/51718410169/ES130255/

I have not seen anyone need to replace this very large and expensive gasket. If you have water entry at the corners of the windshield, that could be caused by the "A-pillar" leak described here:
https://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=254611
https://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sh...4&postcount=49

[JesusFreakToo]

Thanks. I purchased one as I was afraid I would need it and they might become unavailable. Yes, getting water in on the passenger side. I saw some posts about the rubber insert getting loose and allowing water in. I don't like the idea of putting shiny silicone in there. Just looks awful. I know I'm being OCD, but I have the top down most of the time. I may try some silicone with some talcum powder on the seal before giving in on the replacement.

I'm also trying to find one of Randy Forbes reinforcement kits. Again, just in case. My luck is when I have a problem, parts tend to go off market. Maybe too late on his kit already. :-(

First link to ECS is not working. I was trying to find out if there was any glue or special order to removing and replacing the seal.

Cheers!
Lee

[Vintage42]

... I saw some posts about the rubber insert getting loose and allowing water in. I don't like the idea of putting shiny silicone in there. Just looks awful...
First link to ECS is not working...

The rubber plug in the A-pillar should not be glued in. It should be removed, cleaned and dried, and string trimmer line pushed down the jamb section of the gasket to clear any dirt that may be obstructing drainage. Then the plug would be replaced with a thin film of black silicone across the top.
The ECST link in Post #2 works for me. Since no one has needed to replace that $470 gasket part, I have seen no DIYs on it.

[JesusFreakToo]

The rubber plug in the A-pillar should not be glued in. It should be removed, cleaned and dried, and string trimmer line pushed down the jamb section of the gasket to clear any dirt that may be obstructing drainage. Then the plug would be replaced with a thin film of black silicone across the top.
The ECST link in Post #2 works for me. Since no one has needed to replace that $470 gasket part, I have seen no DIYs on it.

Will give it a go. My gasket has a few tears in it where the latches have hit (prior to my ownership). They are not causing leaks, but don't look good and based on my experience will eventually deteriorate further. But I'll keep it alive a bit longer. Link is working now. Go figure. I didn't pay that much. I think about $350. Not pocket change. But I'd like to get some insight on replacing it. I'll have to see if there is anything in the Bentley manual.

Lee

[Vintage42]

... My gasket has a few tears in it where the latches have hit...

The top has stubby pins that fit down into the windshield frame behind the gasket. To the rear of the pins, the top has latches that engage up under the windshield frame. It is not possible for either the pins or the latches to contact the gasket. Something else must have damaged the gasket.

[JesusFreakToo]

Thank you. IDK, the gashes in the gasket are right near where the pins would go in. Appreciate the info.

Would you have any idea where I could find a Randy Forbes rear suspension kit?

[spfd72]

Just an added suggestion re the A pillar triangular plug that shrinks with age (if you look at that area with the top down, the window compresses that seal and plug-I just noticed one day when I wondered about the design. With age the plug shrinks and doesn't seal as well). Back on point..I used flexible gasket seal (black) and then applied a circular bicycle tube patch-they are precut (measure ~1in diameter or so) and have a non-adherent outer surface. It hides whatever sealant you use and looks clean.

[Vintage42]

... Would you have any idea where I could find a Randy Forbes rear suspension kit?

They are sold by:
Randy Forbes
Sports Cars Plus, LLC
6005 Mulholland Rd.
Parrish FL 34219
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=1&theater
People either ship their cars to him, or there are certain shops across the country that can do the job with the instructions included with the kit.
Do you know whether you need the kit? Do you know how to look for existing damage, or is this preventive because you want to autocross without worry?

[Vintage42]

... the gashes in the gasket are right near where the pins would go in...

The pins cannot reach the gasket. Unless... the installer lowered the front of the top onto the windshield when the rear of the top was not yet attached to the body. Maybe the loose frame would then allow the pins to reach the rubber gasket. I have not installed a top myself and don't know the sequence of the procedure, but I suppose that could happen somehow.

[JesusFreakToo]

They are sold by:
Randy Forbes
Sports Cars Plus, LLC
6005 Mulholland Rd.
Parrish FL 34219
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=1&theater
People either ship their cars to him, or there are certain shops across the country that can do the job with the instructions included with the kit.
Do you know whether you need the kit? Do you know how to look for existing damage, or is this preventive because you want to autocross without worry?

Thanks. I've tried getting in touch with him a couple of ways, but no replies. I'll try the FB page. I believe my car is OK, just looking to prevent the problem. I don't autocross, but as I said, I'm a bit OCD. I would like to take it to the track for some driving lessons.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks for the idea on the tire tube patch. I may give it a go.

- - - Updated - - -

The pins cannot reach the gasket. Unless... the installer lowered the front of the top onto the windshield when the rear of the top was not yet attached to the body. Maybe the loose frame would then allow the pins to reach the rubber gasket. I have not installed a top myself and don't know the sequence of the procedure, but I suppose that could happen somehow.

IDK, but I have some gashes (small). I believe what you are saying. LOL. Could just be a coincidence. They were there when I got the car, but I didn't notice them until I started hunting for my leak on the right side of the car.

[Dakar Ole]

Don't feel alone as I have small gashes right in front of the one pin hole I usually see, the driver side.

[JesusFreakToo]

They are sold by:
Randy Forbes
Sports Cars Plus, LLC
6005 Mulholland Rd.
Parrish FL 34219
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=1&theater
People either ship their cars to him, or there are certain shops across the country that can do the job with the instructions included with the kit.
Do you know whether you need the kit? Do you know how to look for existing damage, or is this preventive because you want to autocross without worry?

FYI, this facebook page seems to be gone. :-(

[Vintage42]

FYI, this facebook page seems to be gone. :-(

Try sending a PM from his contact page at
https://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/member.php?u=881
If that does not work, I have an email address and two phone numbers for him. Send me a PM with your email and I will send them to you.

[gmushial]

Just an added suggestion re the A pillar triangular plug that shrinks with age (if you look at that area with the top down, the window compresses that seal and plug-I just noticed one day when I wondered about the design. With age the plug shrinks and doesn't seal as well). Back on point..I used flexible gasket seal (black) and then applied a circular bicycle tube patch-they are precut (measure ~1in diameter or so) and have a non-adherent outer surface. It hides whatever sealant you use and looks clean.

One has to wonder about the original intent of the Z3 designers... was the plug designed to actually plug the top of the drain channel? If so, then why the drain line down from it? And why not just silicone seal the plug and around it in to make it watertight? Or if not, then why have the plug at all, and just let the water drain down the drain line? ...

This just became an issue: on the Z3 have never had an issue with the drain line, or leaks there? But with a new low miles Z3M: came back from a week away, with it parked outside, and found an inch plus of water in the passenger footwell :-( x100000 ... so having to decide how to deal with this other than only parking it under cover...

[Vintage42]

One has to wonder about the original intent of the Z3 designers... was the plug designed to actually plug the top of the drain channel? If so, then why the drain line down from it? And why not just silicone seal the plug and around it in to make it watertight? Or if not, then why have the plug at all, and just let the water drain down the drain line? ....

I think the plugs are part of the drains. They are designed to cap the gasket's interior drain tubes down the A-pillars, while passing water through them, and being removable to allow access to clean the tubes if they become clogged.
The grooves or channels in the sides of the plugs are part of the drainage path. The plugs should be turned so that their channels allow water to pass through them, from the top of the gasket into the side tubes. And the channels in the plugs should not become filled with excess silicone.

[gmushial]

I think the plugs part of the drains. They are designed to cap the gasket's interior drain tubes down the A-pillars, while passing water through them, and being removable to allow access to clean the tubes if they become clogged.
The grooves or channels in the sides of the plugs are part of the drainage path. The plugs should be turned so that their channels allow water to pass through them, from the top of the gasket into the side tubes. And the channels in the plugs should not become filled with excess silicone.

Thanks for getting back to me...

I did pull the plug, and try to clean the drain tube... do you know how far down it goes, ie, where is the outlet end? [I'm guessing from looking at it: all the way to the bottom of the door??] ... I tried to get some soft wire down it, but ran into a hard obstruction about a foot in: felt like metal... so don't know if I ran into a corner, or actually something in it. ... But what I'm wondering from your reply is: how much water is it suppose to be able to drain away, and where it that going to be coming from? ... when I hit the roof with the garden hose, there is a serious flow of water from that corner, onto the passenger seat... so I guess the question is: isn't there a seal that should be keeping most of the water out? ie, on the other Z3 I don't see any water coming in when I do the same, ie, is the top to windshield frame seal suppose to keep 99.9% of the water out, and the drains are designed to carry away what tiny bit might get through? Or, is the design that significant amounts are going to get through - maybe driven by forward velocity?? - and the drains are intended to carry significant amounts away? Many thanks.

[Vintage42]

... the drain tube... do you know how far down it goes, ie, where is the outlet end? [I'm guessing from looking at it: all the way to the bottom of the door??] ... ... how much water is it suppose to be able to drain away, and where it that going to be coming from? ... when I hit the roof with the garden hose, there is a serious flow of water from that corner, onto the passenger seat... so I guess the question is: isn't there a seal that should be keeping most of the water out? ie, on the other Z3 I don't see any water coming in when I do the same, ie, is the top to windshield frame seal suppose to keep 99.9% of the water out, and the drains are designed to carry away what tiny bit might get through? Or, is the design that significant amounts are going to get through - maybe driven by forward velocity?? - and the drains are intended to carry significant amounts away? ...

From the photos of the part at < https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...l/51718410169/ > and looking at my car, I think the windshield gasket runs down the A-pillars, and the ends of its tubes then plug into the tops of the door jamb gaskets, which take the water down the door jambs to the outer door sills.

The gasket over the top of the windshield is like a soft gutter, where a little water can be forced past the front edge by wind pressure, but then moves into the gutter. The rear edge of the gutter is relieved of wind or water pressure on it, and so completes the seal.

The gutter is small, probably even smaller after the top is clamped down on it, and the openings into the downtubes at each end are small. The gutter and its A-pillar drains are just to carry away the small amount of water that is forced into the gutter of the gasket by velocity.

If a hose stream drives a serious flow of water through a corner onto a seat, I think the top is not sealing there because either it is not clamped down hard enough, or the gasket is in poor condition. Or maybe the plug is not sealed at its top, or maybe the blocked drain tube has filled with water up into the plug.

[z3forlife]

I found that if you cut a thin piece of rubber in the shape of the plug and attach with a small amount of black rtv that it will fill the gap between the seal and the top and greatly reduce the amount of drips from the corner. It made my last Z watertight after many attempts at adjustment by the dealer.