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Thread: Steven's 733i Turbo build thread

  1. #51
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Metairie, LA, USA
    Posts
    406
    My Cars
    1985 BMW 745i, & 635CSI
    Looking great Steve! The thing i could get done in a garage like that! Heck, who am I kidding? I’ll be 60 next year and I don’t exactly bend and reach like I used to. I’m just having garage envy!

    Where did you source your front end parts and what brand did you use?


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

  2. #52
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    The front control arms are Moog. The thrust arms are off brand (Ultra Power). They are the only brand Rockauto had. I would not put these on a car I planned on driving a lot, I probably should have at least bought Meyle arms if not OE from another source, but I was putting together a Rock order and figured I'd try these. I am always tempted by low prices! My experience has been that cheaper tie rod ends and ball joints usually lose their preload much quicker than OE quality parts. This car is probably not going to see that many miles.
    Steve H.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    4,487
    My Cars
    1983/84/85 745i

    Thumbs up

    Meyle boots love to split, even when the vehicle sits...I found a set of Energy universal boots to fit the tie rods. I have not stepped to the control arms yet, but I have my fingers crossed I can figure something out. Mine have MAYBE 2500 miles on them and are cracking quite a bit.

    Were Moogs not available for the other arms?
    I make E23 parts.
    09/1983 745i (stolen spring '13 around Houston, TX Achatgruen on nutria buffalo. 8481080)
    10/1984 745i
    11/1984 745i
    11/1984 735i (10:1-265/6)
    Ford, MB, and GM round out the pack.



  4. #54
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I didn't see Moog as being available for the thrust arms but I also didn't look that hard.
    Steve H.

  5. #55
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I replaced the rear subframe bushings, rear control arms w/ bushings (came off the 85 745i parts car which had recently replaced rear control arm bushings), rear axles (85 parts car had newer axles), added the 745i rear sway bar and rebled the brakes, did a quick alignment and then drove the car to visit my family for Thanksgiving. I am impressed with the work Jorgen Automotive did on my steering gear. It has no lash at all on center and the steering is so direct on this car. Not quite as good as my E39 M5, which I consider the gold standard of recirculating ball steering gear feel, but close.

    The Dinan springs ride well. The rate is so high compared to stock, but not so much that it ruins the ride comfort for trips. The Bilstein HD's control the Dinan springs fine but the rear ride height is way too high. I also am unhappy with how far the rear Dinan springs pull out of the upper spring mount isolator w/ the suspension at full droop w/ the car on the lift. I am going to send a set of Bilstein HD's into Bilstein and specifically request that they remove 1.25" of droop travel from the shocks and to cut perch snap ring grooves at -20, -30, and -40mm. The Dinan springs on unmodified Bilstein HD's rakes the car up about 1.75" in the rear vs the front. I think dropping the rear 1.5" (about 40mm) will get the ride height where I want it to be.

    A few pictures of me rushing to finish the suspension rebuild. I finished this about a half hour before I departed for Thanksgiving, w/ no test drive.

    Original rear control arms and CV axles removed:





    Removing the rear subframe bushings w/ a Sawzall (I do not recommend doing this but I was in a rush. The risk of cutting into the subframe is high, I would have pulled the subframe and done this off the car if I had the time)

    Step 1, cut the center out of the subframe bushing w/ the Sawzall






    Step 2, not pictured, use Sawzall w/ a sharp, fine tooth metal cutting blade to put a vertical cut through the bushing shell that remains pressed into the subframe.

    Step 3, once this cut causes the bushing to lose its press fit, drive it out w/ an air chisel



    Step 4, remove





    Step 5, use a screw jack (or a floor jack if you are on the floor) to drive the new bushing in, with a piece of scrap 2x4 between the subframe and body to allow the bushing to be pressed thru. I used tire install lube to lubricate the rubber bushing OD so it would slide in easier. Tire lube dries tacky so it won't continue to be a lube on the installed bushing. If I didn't have tire lube I'd use dish soap or windex.









    I am not happy that I listened to Bilstein's tech, who told me he strongly advised against bothering to modify the HD's for the Dinan lowering springs. The HD strut piston extends almost an inch past where the spring loses preload. This makes lifting and lowering the car on the lift a pain because I have to get under the car w/ a flashlight and a mirror every time I drop it back down on the ground to ensure the springs don't fall out of the upper seat.



    Screw jacks under the hubs to preload the suspension so that I can tighten the control arm pivot bolts:





    Back together - POR 15 painted donor rear control arms w/ newer control arm bushings, reman CV axles from the 745i parts car, and sway bar from the 745i parts car installed.


    Here is how the car sits on the Dinan springs and Bilstein HD's after a couple hour trip. With a reflection of the home being built across the street from my parents in my shot.



    The front height is good. I do not like the raked out 80s muscle car stance at all, the rear has to come down a lot.
    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 11-24-2018 at 03:46 PM.
    Steve H.

  6. #56
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I put a set of spare wheels I had kicking around on the 733 last night. They are 18x8 front 18x9.5 rear and have 245/40/18 and 275/35/18 all season tires on them. The front wheel is an ET20 and i have a 5mm spacer on it. The tire barely clears the strut w/ the spacer but also seems okay there. The rear wheel is an ET20 w/ no spacer.

















    Edit: After taking the car on a 2.5 hr round trip tonight, I found that the 275's on ET20 wheels on the rear slightly scrape the wheel lip on big bumps. They don't hit by a lot, it didn't damage the tire, but I will need to either roll the lips or choose smaller tires to keep using these as winter wheels. I am not going to drive this car in snow but I am going to keep a dedicated set of summer tires on the M parallel wheels. The 245s on the front TSW 18x8 ET20 wheels w/ 5mm spacers hit the plastic shields at the back of the wheel wells quite a lot
    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 11-27-2018 at 11:33 AM.
    Steve H.

  7. #57
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I changed out the Bilsten e23 B6 rear struts, which were not working well with the Dinan lowering springs (shock piston 1"+ too long, spring perch location 1"+ too high resulting in a raked stance I hated) for e28 B8 sport struts. The piston length and perch height work out much better on the e23 w/ lowering springs. The rear ride height dropped about 3/4" w/ the e28 strut spring perch snap ring on the lowest of 3 grooves. The car sits more level. A 245/40/18 rear tire on 18x9.5 ET20 wheel hits slightly when leaving driveways so I don't think I could get away lowering the rear anymore unless I trim or roll the wheel lip.



    The stance is better. Still too high in the rear for my liking but I can live w/ this for now



    The 245 tire is a bit stretched on a 9.5" wide wheel, which actually helps clearance to the fender, but under significant bump travel the sidewall rubs the lip.







    Now for a few vintage aftermarket parts:

    Here is a refurbished circa 1989 aftermarket steering wheel I bought from Latvia. It was branded as Hella, made by Momo.







    And an e23 front strut brace. I think this might be a Bavauto part but I'm not sure.

    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 12-07-2018 at 08:58 PM.
    Steve H.

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Somewhere,USA
    Posts
    94
    My Cars
    1985 BMW 735i
    That does look like a BavAuto strut bar / brace that I have. Unfortunately NLA.

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    886
    My Cars
    2000 M5, 2001 330i
    Quote Originally Posted by cfisher535is View Post
    That does look like a BavAuto strut bar / brace that I have. Unfortunately NLA.
    The Bavauto and Hartge bar looked damn near identical, I was never able to confirm for a fact which it was. I am pretty confident this bar isn't a hartge as it came off a 250k mile 86 735i. Still does the same job either way.
    2000 BMW M5 Evolve Alpha-N Tune, Evolve Carbon Fiber CAI's, UUC Short Throw Shifter, Dinan Front STB, Dinan Rear Sway Bar
    2001 BMW 330i ​Dynavin N7 Pro

    1985 BMW 745i 18" Style 37's, Team745i Chip, Getrag 265/6, Clutchmasters FX-300, UUC Short Throw Shifter, Strut Tower Bar, Bilstein HD's ("Build" Thread")(SOLD)
    1986 BMW 735i Getrag 265/6 Swap, Strut Tower Bar, Bilstein HD's, Euro F/R Conversion, 3.46 L/S Diff (Scrapped)

    2016 Ford Mustang GT Performance Pack Stock
    2004 Mercury Marauder
    Eaton M112, 3.4 Billetflow upper, Accufab SBTB + Plenum, 4.10's, Stainless Works LT's, 2.5" Exhaust, Borla Stingers, FX-R projectors, Addco F/R swaybars
    2003 Mercury Marauder JLT CAI, SCT Xcal4, Stainless Works LT's, SW 2.5" Catback
    1996 Ford Bronco
    4" lift, 35" BFG A/T's, MH1 projectors

  10. #60
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tangent Oregon
    Posts
    450
    My Cars
    79' 320i 84' 733i
    When you added the rear sway bar did you have to use the 745i trailing arms, or were all the sway bar mounting points already present on the 733i suspension?

  11. #61
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Leland, NC
    Posts
    828
    My Cars
    85 €735i 08 550i/6
    My euro 735i has the mounting points for the rear sway on the trailing arms.

    Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

  12. #62
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    The 733 had the sway bar mounting points already

  13. #63
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tangent Oregon
    Posts
    450
    My Cars
    79' 320i 84' 733i
    Quote Originally Posted by motohunter4 View Post
    My euro 735i has the mounting points for the rear sway on the trailing arms.

    Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by BONDOSPECIAL View Post
    The 733 had the sway bar mounting points already
    Good to know, I was thinking I might have to swap my whole rear subframe assembly if the 733 didn't have the mounts already.

  14. #64
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I hit a major snag during engine assembly. The new block, which I bought fully machined from a friend, had awfully tight main bearing clearances measured at 90 degrees on the crank. I took the main bearings out and checked the main bores w/ my new dial bore indicator and made an unfortunate finding. The main caps I was provided w/ this block do not match the block. They are shifted .003" from the block's line bore, all in the same direction, from being bored to another block. Before I owned this block, it had been through several moves and was machined by a shop out of state from the original owner, so some time during all that the caps must have gotten mixed up with those from another M30 core block. I talked to a few machine shops who told me it was not worth the amount of time and cost to line bore this block to a mismatched set of caps. So now I am going to have the M106 original std bore block from my parts car 745i bored and torque plate honed to fit the JE pistons I have for a 92.51mm bore size. I found a shop about 1.5 hrs away who has a torque plate for an M30 (this is almost impossible and I can't believe someone in my state has one. Not many people building M30's these days). So this will be probably a month setback because of the holidays and having to send a block out. I should have known better than to buy someone else's incomplete engine build, but I thought I was going to be saving time and money (nope, and nope!).



    Steve says, something's not right here...
    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 12-17-2018 at 04:47 PM.
    Steve H.

  15. #65
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tangent Oregon
    Posts
    450
    My Cars
    79' 320i 84' 733i
    Too bad about the block, hopefully you can get the M106 machined in reasonable time

  16. #66
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Astoria, NY
    Posts
    116
    My Cars
    1985 735i
    sub'd

  17. #67
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I ended up finding a specialty machine shop near DC who only does crank grinding and line boring. He took a look at the M30 block I had bought from my friend as fully machined but that ended up missing its original main caps, and indicated he could line hone it to the non-original main caps. I hope to get the block back in a couple weeks so I can get back to assembling the short block. I also received a message the other day that my cylinder head is ported and ready to pick up - I will get that this weekend and work on assembling the head. Hopefully I'll have some progress to post about soon. I am on the waitlist for Hot Rod Drag Week and am using that as motivation to get this build moving so I can get the car tested and tuned before the event in September.

    Edit, just got a call that the block is done from line honing (due to the wrong main caps). That is a relief it was repairable and the turnaround was much quicker than I expected - the shop took only a few days.
    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 02-28-2019 at 01:02 PM.
    Steve H.

  18. #68
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Omaha NE
    Posts
    200
    My Cars
    84' 533i Turbo
    Sorry to hear about the bad advisement from Bilstein. Sucks I ran into the same issue & I'm not willing to pay full price all over again to have shaft travel shortened. If I go down this route again, well... Who knows if I ever will at this point.

    How do you feel the e28 rear valving works with those springs?

  19. #69
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    The rear e28 shocks work excellent. The valving is comfortable and controls the spring rate without allowing any oscillation. I am glad I chose the stiffer of the two e28 B8 sport shocks. These are part # 24-007276. Bilstein also makes a less-firmly damped e28 B8 shock, part #24-00607. I did some spring rate calculations on a napkin for the e23 Dinan/Mtech springs I have based on diameter, wire dia, and # of live coils, and then looked at the spring rates for e28 lowering coils. I found the e23 lowering springs are, not surprisingly, slightly stiffer than any of the e28 lowering springs. So choosing the firmer of the two B8 sport e28 shocks made sense to me.
    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 03-06-2019 at 03:45 PM.

  20. #70
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I got my block back from a specialty machine shop near DC who was able to align hone the incorrect main caps I got w/ this otherwise fully machined block. No one else wanted to touch an align hone job w/ incorrect caps. The main bores are now round and on-size. I need to clean the block w/ soap and water again so I can start assembly. Hopefully there are no more surprises this time.

    Steve H.

  21. #71
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I began assembling the 3.4 over the weekend. This 3.4 block was a core B34 block that my friend had bored and torque plate honed to fit used 92.5mm JE pistons. The crank and rods are from my 1985 745i's original engine. The crank is std/std and did not have any grooving in it.






    ^ You can see after align honing which main cap was the one correct original cap - the one w/ the machined mating surface. It had to be shortened to make that main bore into an oval so it could be honed round. The rest of the non-original caps were already .004" short so they did not have to be machined, just honed.






    A surprise to me was that the pistons stuck up significantly past the deck height -between 0.027" and 0.030" depending on the hole, measured from the piston crown quench pad. I initially panicked, assuming something was wrong w/ the block machine work, as the block had been decked and I was not the one who had this work performed. I then realized that w/ the .070" MLS head gasket I bought, there would be 0.40" quench clearance, which from some internet research I found was fine - people seem to like 0.035" minimum clearance here. My compression ratio calculates to be around 9:1 based on the deck height and piston dish CC, my M30B35 cylinder head w/ 64cc chamber, a 0.070" head gasket and 92.5mm bore, which is slightly higher than the 8.5:1 JE spec'd these pistons for.






    Crank end play ended up measuring approx 0.0025" per my dial indicator, which is tighter than the minimum spec of 0.0033". I made sure to pry the crank forward while tightening the thrust caps. The thrust cap this block was align honed with was not the original cap for the block and I could feel a small lip where the cap thrust face and block saddle thrust face met, so I suspected the thrust clearance was going to be tight. I also did have Lucas assembly lube on the bearings including a light coating on the thrust faces when I took this measurement, so the dry end play measurement would probably be slightly higher - I read taking an end play measurement with a heavy lubricant on the bearings could skew the reading up to .001". I probably should have taken the thrust bearings out and honed them on a flat surface to open this clearance up slightly, but I already have the short block together. I figure the diagonally opposite corners of the thrust bearing flanges are going to wear in from the slight cap misalignment and this clearance will open up soon after running.



    Rod bearing clearances plasti gauged out to 0.0015" and mains measured .002"-.0025"





    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 03-11-2019 at 02:03 PM.
    Steve H.

  22. #72
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I am now touching up the valve job on my M30B35 head. I was not happy with the job a shop did on it. I had asked them to use their Serdi seat machine on the head, but they used stones instead. Which can be fine if the stone holders and pilots are in perfect condition and the operator is skilled, but I could tell from looking at the valve job I got back that the seats were not concentric. They also did not cut 3 angles like I requested. I have stone valve seat grinders with new pilots and stone holders but whatever these valve seats are made out of, they want to load the stones up immediately which grooves the seats. Porsche 928 heads I redid caused the same problem.

    I got tired of dressing stones 50 times per seat and hoping I'd get one lucky bump that didn't groove the seat and bought Neway carbide valve seat cutters. They are not cheap ($200+ per cutter) and I had heard mixed reviews on using them. I am finding that the Neway cutters cut a true, round surface but it is up to the user to finesse them so they don't chatter. I can see as I recut the seats where even the shop's stone valve job left some pretty deep grooves I am removing. I only bought 30 and 45 degree Neway cutters so I am putting the 60 degree throat angle on with a stone. Seat concentricity with the Neway cutters is measuring about 0.001"-0.0015" on the larger intake valve seats and 0.001" on exhaust seats, which is excellent.


    Some stones on holders and one of the Neway cutters on the bench









    3 angles with a primary seat width of about 0.050" on the intake.

    Checking concentricity

    Last edited by BONDOSPECIAL; 03-15-2019 at 05:08 PM.
    Steve H.

  23. #73
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I did the exhaust seats last night using another Neway carbide cutter.





    I made the exhaust seats about 0.060" wide and put a small top cut and throat cut on either side of the primary seat. Exhaust seat concentricity measured about 0.001". I am impressed with how concentric of a seat I am ending up with using hand-turned cutters.
    Steve H.

  24. #74
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    1,652
    My Cars
    BMWs
    Steve, great progress. Keep up with the upgrades. I am gearing up to do the same to my M106.
    Current: '88 E28 ///M5 Schwarz/Natur | '84 E23 745i Arktisblau/Biege | '95 E34 525iT S50/5 AlpineweissIII/Pergament | '11 E70 X5 Alpine/Savannah | '05 G55k Schwarz/Schwarz


    Past: '83 E28 533i/5 Schwarz/Schwarz | '85 E23 745i Diamantschwarz/Buffalo | '95 E34 540i/6 Hellrot/Pergament | '00 E39 ///M5 SchwarzII/Schwarz | '15 RAMME 1500 4x4 Sport Weiss/Schwarz

  25. #75
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    Killingworth, CT
    Posts
    562
    My Cars
    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    I put a ding right in the fire ring area of cylinder #6 while I was preparing to assemble the head. I bumped it into the exposed steel end of my cylinder head stand. This head was freshly milled a few thousandths for an MLS head gasket and now I had to have it milled again. Idiot tax.

    The damage. It was so slight you could barely feel it but I was not going to leave this in the fire ring area using an MLS gasket



    I used a different shop this time, I was not happy with the shop I had used previously for some other reasons. I shipped the head out and had it back in a couple days. The new shop looks to have done a nice job. They took 0.003" off this time. I have the head laying on a bath towel and I will make sure not to dent it again

    Steve H.

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