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Thread: anybody running a 5 bar fuel pessure regulator in a S52?

  1. #1
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    anybody running a 5 bar fuel pessure regulator in a S52?

    Hey guys my (current) Dinan FI tune is pared with 28.8# injectors, for what I'm about to do (add more boost) it looks like I'm going to lean out on fuel up top. I have been toying with the idea of bumping up to a 5 bar fuel pressure regulator to jam some more fuel into the cylinders at the pulse width. I'm dropping in a walbro 255 in the tank, so I will have no fuel volume issues, also it can handle the high pressure as well.

    Also I may be approaching 90psi at WOT (75psi at 5 bar + 15# of boost), which I'm a little concerned with.


    Obviously I need to bump my injector size, and tune; maybe next year... What do you guys think?
    Last edited by bubbafett; 10-11-2018 at 11:45 PM.
    Built S52 w/Dinan ISR-3 kit, NickG Stage 2+ Tune, Dinan Vortech V2 Supercharger, Dinan Air to Air Intercooler, Dinan CAI, Porsche 803 HFM, Buldogge 6" crank pulley, Griptec 2.90" blower pulley, Eurosport UD pulleys, Dinan 3.38 Diff, Dinan front/rear Swaybars, Dinan springs, Koni Yellow Sport Struts, Ground Control end links, South Bend Clutch Stage 3 Organic, AASCO Light Weight Flywheel 18.5#, Zionsville Radiator & Oil Cooler, Riot Racing BBTB, Schrick Intake Manifold, 42# Injectors, Schrick cams 264/256, Forged Wiseco pistons 9.0 comp., Forged Eagle rods, Supertech dual valve springs & valves, VAC crank & bearings, Supersprint mufflers, Euro Z3 midpipe, Raceland euro headers, Walbro 255, Bevauto ignition coils, Vortech Mondo bypass, Bailey Diverter DV30, Ireland Rear Subframe Bushings, Mason Engineering Strut Brace, Mason Engineering Clutch Petal, Apex 18" EC-7 Wheels, Full Custom Sound System, two trunk lids (with & without OE spoiler), Hardtop, Trunk full of AK's...

  2. #2
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    I used the 5 bar FPR with the blue top injectors and the
    walbro 255 on my T/S set up.


  3. #3
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    You'd need a proper tune. If you bump up fueling just to get some extra fuel up top, everywhere else below will be very rich and run very poorly.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by 328 Power 04 View Post
    You'd need a proper tune. If you bump up fueling just to get some extra fuel up top, everywhere else below will be very rich and run very poorly.
    I respect your answer but I'm just not sure that is 100% true. The DME is pretty basic, it does not sense the fuel pressure. Only what it believes is the injector size, and what HFM is believes is connected, so it goes by that air/fuel map. My current Dinan tune already was designed with 4 bar fuel pressure in mind. If I go up to 5 bar the pressure increase is 18 psi, and or 14% more fuel give or take at the injector pulse. My current or soon to be problem is a balancing act, I dont think 14% more fuel will throw a CEL, and the DME should be able to adjust a little the mixture at idle and below 3000 RPM. But yes, it is technically hacking the tune. In theory 328 Power o4 you may be right, but just trying to see if any guys here has ever done this swap and if they had any issues. Maybe Lars (Z3 M roadster) and others can share their experience as to what they experienced. Who knows maybe one of the Randys will come by and school me.
    Built S52 w/Dinan ISR-3 kit, NickG Stage 2+ Tune, Dinan Vortech V2 Supercharger, Dinan Air to Air Intercooler, Dinan CAI, Porsche 803 HFM, Buldogge 6" crank pulley, Griptec 2.90" blower pulley, Eurosport UD pulleys, Dinan 3.38 Diff, Dinan front/rear Swaybars, Dinan springs, Koni Yellow Sport Struts, Ground Control end links, South Bend Clutch Stage 3 Organic, AASCO Light Weight Flywheel 18.5#, Zionsville Radiator & Oil Cooler, Riot Racing BBTB, Schrick Intake Manifold, 42# Injectors, Schrick cams 264/256, Forged Wiseco pistons 9.0 comp., Forged Eagle rods, Supertech dual valve springs & valves, VAC crank & bearings, Supersprint mufflers, Euro Z3 midpipe, Raceland euro headers, Walbro 255, Bevauto ignition coils, Vortech Mondo bypass, Bailey Diverter DV30, Ireland Rear Subframe Bushings, Mason Engineering Strut Brace, Mason Engineering Clutch Petal, Apex 18" EC-7 Wheels, Full Custom Sound System, two trunk lids (with & without OE spoiler), Hardtop, Trunk full of AK's...

  5. #5
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    I have been tuning these for 4 years now, after helping define a lot of the data in the tune. The mapping is like the back of my hand.

    The dme doesn't know fuel pressure nor injector size. It fuels a certain written time for the injector to stay open. The fuel map is written for engine rpm and engine load (a factor of air flow). A tune rewrites that injector time, as calibrated for the flow capacity.

    Fuel injection is time open vs. flow. You greatly increase flow for the same time open, DME will still inject the same fuel injector time.
    It uses oxygen sensor feedback to adjust minor percentage, but when it gets to 8% fuel enleanment, and 12% fuel enrichment, you will get mixture codes.

    You're welcome to experiment, but it's highly risky to your hardware.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  6. #6
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    Abel is the go-to expert; I would trust is recommendation without hesitation.
    Tony
    "You can't sign away negligence."

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ProductUser View Post
    Abel is the go-to expert; I would trust his recommendation without hesitation.
    I second that as he saved me handful of times caused by VFE's tune. As I am learning more, I'm finding out most of off-the-shelf tunes are just as rough.
    2000 Z3 M Titanium Silver / Imola Red+Black Nappa
    2011 328i E92 Space Gray Metallic / Leder Dakota+Oyster
    Since 1987 12 euros / 2 kdms / 2 jdms
    - Zach

  8. #8
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    Yeah I will third the notion that Abel (328 Power 04) is an expert in this subject. I've experienced first hand his knowledge of these DME's and tunes... he knows his stuff...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by 328 Power 04 View Post
    I have been tuning these for 4 years now, after helping define a lot of the data in the tune. The mapping is like the back of my hand.

    The dme doesn't know fuel pressure nor injector size. It fuels a certain written time for the injector to stay open. The fuel map is written for engine rpm and engine load (a factor of air flow). A tune rewrites that injector time, as calibrated for the flow capacity.

    Fuel injection is time open vs. flow. You greatly increase flow for the same time open, DME will still inject the same fuel injector time.
    It uses oxygen sensor feedback to adjust minor percentage, but when it gets to 8% fuel enleanment, and 12% fuel enrichment, you will get mixture codes.

    You're welcome to experiment, but it's highly risky to your hardware.
    Great reply Abel! Thanks for that. Maybe I will experiment. IDK. Can you tell me the worst thing that can happen in your opinion? Just running rich and throwing a code? Or like breaking an injector or a FPR?
    Last edited by bubbafett; 10-12-2018 at 02:28 PM.
    Built S52 w/Dinan ISR-3 kit, NickG Stage 2+ Tune, Dinan Vortech V2 Supercharger, Dinan Air to Air Intercooler, Dinan CAI, Porsche 803 HFM, Buldogge 6" crank pulley, Griptec 2.90" blower pulley, Eurosport UD pulleys, Dinan 3.38 Diff, Dinan front/rear Swaybars, Dinan springs, Koni Yellow Sport Struts, Ground Control end links, South Bend Clutch Stage 3 Organic, AASCO Light Weight Flywheel 18.5#, Zionsville Radiator & Oil Cooler, Riot Racing BBTB, Schrick Intake Manifold, 42# Injectors, Schrick cams 264/256, Forged Wiseco pistons 9.0 comp., Forged Eagle rods, Supertech dual valve springs & valves, VAC crank & bearings, Supersprint mufflers, Euro Z3 midpipe, Raceland euro headers, Walbro 255, Bevauto ignition coils, Vortech Mondo bypass, Bailey Diverter DV30, Ireland Rear Subframe Bushings, Mason Engineering Strut Brace, Mason Engineering Clutch Petal, Apex 18" EC-7 Wheels, Full Custom Sound System, two trunk lids (with & without OE spoiler), Hardtop, Trunk full of AK's...

  10. #10
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    What MAF and which resistor are you running now? The reason you would "run out of fuel" is that your MAF signal is over saturated (can't measure any more additional air), and a secondary possibility is that your fuel system may not keep up to the measured air. MAF system is key here. The DME needs to know how much air you are measuring, and it will correctly apply the tuned fuel amounts. It will increase fuel 'on-the-fly' when it can measure the air.

    The best way is to jump to quality 40-60lbs injectors, stay with stock 3.5bar FPR (easy to find and replace), and use a MAF system that can actually measure the air, with correct scaling written in tune to match.


    Potential issues that will arise from simply increasing the FPR are difficult starts, especially at high altitude/low atmospheric pressure, rich afr decreases power, fouling of spark plugs/misfiring, a fuel rail/injector that wasn't designed for 5bar of pressure may not like it.

    Keep in mind that when running full throttle (*actually 63% + throttle position), the DME goes into open loop and will fuel without oxygen sensor feedback. It will just be the fuel injector time. You will run it way too rich, without additional benefit. There are not adaptation adjustments in full throttle mode. Full throttle operation mode is also where the engine is stressed the most...


    If your DME is not reading the additional air/boost it keeps ignition advance the same as for lower boost levels, and you will cause dangerous head gasket conditions.
    Last edited by 328 Power 04; 10-12-2018 at 05:18 PM.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  11. #11
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    Currently on the Dinan ISR-3 kit it uses the Bosch # 13621433567 (same as the Z8 Alpina, 740i, X5 and a couple others), as far as I know this is the only Dinan tune with this HFM. The others Dinan kits (including the other SC kits) use the Bosch Euro 3.5" Porsche #806 HFM.
    I admit I do not know the resistor, maybe I can look.
    Last edited by bubbafett; 10-13-2018 at 10:37 AM.
    Built S52 w/Dinan ISR-3 kit, NickG Stage 2+ Tune, Dinan Vortech V2 Supercharger, Dinan Air to Air Intercooler, Dinan CAI, Porsche 803 HFM, Buldogge 6" crank pulley, Griptec 2.90" blower pulley, Eurosport UD pulleys, Dinan 3.38 Diff, Dinan front/rear Swaybars, Dinan springs, Koni Yellow Sport Struts, Ground Control end links, South Bend Clutch Stage 3 Organic, AASCO Light Weight Flywheel 18.5#, Zionsville Radiator & Oil Cooler, Riot Racing BBTB, Schrick Intake Manifold, 42# Injectors, Schrick cams 264/256, Forged Wiseco pistons 9.0 comp., Forged Eagle rods, Supertech dual valve springs & valves, VAC crank & bearings, Supersprint mufflers, Euro Z3 midpipe, Raceland euro headers, Walbro 255, Bevauto ignition coils, Vortech Mondo bypass, Bailey Diverter DV30, Ireland Rear Subframe Bushings, Mason Engineering Strut Brace, Mason Engineering Clutch Petal, Apex 18" EC-7 Wheels, Full Custom Sound System, two trunk lids (with & without OE spoiler), Hardtop, Trunk full of AK's...

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