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Thread: Best suitable chip for auto to manual conversion

  1. #1
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    Best suitable chip for auto to manual conversion

    Hi guys.

    I am on the way of completing my auto to manual trans conversion on my E32 740i.

    I ve red that the idle speed gets unstable when using the same DME with a manual trans.

    The other electrical issues i think i can fix them after some research on the web and from the wiring manual. (reverse light switch connecting, starting relay jumping, preventing auto trans fault to pop up on the dash, am i missing any??? Enlighten me please)

    Would like to know what is the best chip for that purpose and if it needs the DME to be shipped to the tunner to perform the job.

    Im in Europe (Portugal).

    Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by serbar; 08-30-2018 at 10:05 AM.

  2. #2
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    I ran mine for about a month with stock auto dme only thing I noticed was rev’s hang slightly when shifting, Not really noticeable either. I just bought a chip off eBay for a manual it’s been working great higher rpm and no top speed limiter

    use this for your wiring in the write up to remove the trans fail safe

    http://www.bmwe34.net/E34main/Upgrade/5speedswap.htm

    for your starter they make what’s called a “dummy relay” most e34 before 93 have it in the same location in the fuse box as the e32 (I got mine from a junk yard) you also can just make a jumper wire and bridge the terminals together
    Last edited by e30luv318i; 08-31-2018 at 11:03 AM.
    Me E30 87/ 325i + F25 12/ M-Sport + E32 94/ 740i

    G/F’s E34 92/ 525iT + F48 18/ X1

  3. #3
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    I am also going to be doing a 740 6 speed manual swap soon. For starting the car you need the "dummy relay" from the manual e34's. I forget the part number but you can look it up on realoem. To delete the "trans program" message on the check control you need to ground pin 5 on the X19 connector going into the check control module per the wiring diagram manual for the e34. The signal for trans program error initially comes from pin 25 of the EGS (trans control module). Alternatively you can ground pin 10 of the X506 connector that is under the wood center console by the shifter:

    CCM.jpg

    wire the reverse light switch from the trans to pins 6 and 7 of the X511 connector:

    reverse light.jpg

    I don't know what is needed to turn off the gear selector screen in the instrument cluster. I haven't gotten to that in the electrical wiring manual yet

    As for the DME and chip tune - I've been reading a lot of conflicting information. I'm not sure if a manual tune chip in the stock auto DME is enough to make the driveability 100% correct. Per the wiring diagrams, the auto DME talks back and forth with the auto EGS via CAN bus. I've come across threads in other forums where people are having issues with improper fuel cutoff on throttle close, issues with coming on and off idle, back fire when getting back on the throttle, engine stalling on deceleration, etc., when doing an m60 manual swap. This is with using a MANUAL chip paired with the M60 auto wiring harness and DME. If you remove the EGS entirely you get a CAN bus error 210 because the DME is looking for the auto trans control module. This leads me to believe that the auto and manual m60 DMEs are different from each other; not just the chip itself. I think one way to know for sure if it will work would be to use a manual chip, 404 DME from a manual m60, and maybe even a manual m60 wiring harness without all the auto related stuff. Maybe someone like DUDMD could chime in with more info on this? He provides tunes for m60 DMEs and may be able to give more insight.

    EDIT:

    Adding info for more clarity for those that might reference this in the future.

    Here's the e34 diagram showing ground on CCM pin 5 for manual cars:


    pin5.JPG

    And here's the starter relay for manual cars (I think this only applies for cars with the relay under the hood):

    start.JPG
    Last edited by m60power; 09-02-2018 at 12:25 PM.

  4. #4
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    Thank you for the inputs.

    Alternatively you can ground pin 10 of the X506 connector that is under the wood center console by the shifter:

    Attachment 635971

    wire the reverse light switch from the trans to pins 6 and 7 of the X511 connector:

    Attachment 635972

    I don't know what is needed to turn off the gear selector screen in the instrument cluster. I haven't gotten to that in the electrical wiring manual yet
    I cant access your attached pics unfortunatelly. Would like to be able to track those connector as i was thinking of grounding pin 25 directly from the EGS.

    Ill give a try with a so called performance chip for a -404 dme and ill see if anything else needs doing concerning the abnormal behaviour you mentioned. Chip is cheap enough no to regret later if it doesnt solve the issue.

  5. #5
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    I edited my post. Hopefully the pictures work now. They are screen grabs from the wiring manuals, I don't have pictures of the actual connectors, but they are both right near the shifter so shouldn't be too hard to locate.

  6. #6
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    Thats great. Thanks.

  7. #7
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    I have no Drive ability issues with my swap. No stalling, back firing, ect... only problem I had before the chip was the hanging revs. I have maybe 20k miles on my swap

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by e30luv318i View Post
    I have no Drive ability issues with my swap. No stalling, back firing, ect... only problem I had before the chip was the hanging revs. I have maybe 20k miles on my swap
    Awesome, that's good to hear! Did you leave the EGS in the car?

  9. #9
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    Yessir! The egs stayed and I removed the wiring from the trans plug up. The only thing I couldn’t find was the clutch switch for the cruise control and my ASC no longer worked but I bought the boot and removed the throttle body ect and pulled the bulb. When I swapped my e34T to manual I had the same problem with asc, I had to use the asc comp from my doner manual car... same part number and everything made no sense but worked.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Here is the asc delete

    Me E30 87/ 325i + F25 12/ M-Sport + E32 94/ 740i

    G/F’s E34 92/ 525iT + F48 18/ X1

  10. #10
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    Good stuff! You can still buy the cruise control clutch cancel switch, should be either part number 61311378210 or 61318360421. Yeah I've also heard about the ASC computer needing to be from a manual car. The e32 wiring diagrams show a lot of inter-connectivity between the DME, EGS, and ABS/ASC. My car does not have ASC, but I wonder if I still need a manual car ABS computer for my ABS to work properly?

    I wonder if the issues of manual swapped m60 cars has to do with whether or not the auto car was equipped with AGS (adaptive transmission control). The very early e34 540 autos didn't come with AGS, and I believe all US e32 740s have the regular EGS instead of AGS. So maybe the m60 automatic programmed DME on cars that came with AGS transmission control is the difference between whether or not you need to use an m60 DME from a manual car when doing a swap?

  11. #11
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    No I have the clutch switch I could not find the pre wired plug in my wiring loom. My cruise works but if I hite the brake over deactivating with stalk I have to restart the car for it to work again. Not a problem but a slight annoyance. For the abs it works property and very well in my car, I still have the original auto abs. I have upgraded to e34 m5 front brakes and the stopping power is superb ! M60power Is your e32 a 93? 94? I believe asc was an option?
    Me E30 87/ 325i + F25 12/ M-Sport + E32 94/ 740i

    G/F’s E34 92/ 525iT + F48 18/ X1

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by e30luv318i View Post
    No I have the clutch switch I could not find the pre wired plug in my wiring loom. My cruise works but if I hite the brake over deactivating with stalk I have to restart the car for it to work again. Not a problem but a slight annoyance. For the abs it works property and very well in my car, I still have the original auto abs. I have upgraded to e34 m5 front brakes and the stopping power is superb ! M60power Is your e32 a 93? 94? I believe asc was an option?
    Ah ok. My e32 has the pre-wired connector for the clutch switch:

    20180807_202201.jpg

    That lessens my worries knowing that the auto ABS works with the manual swap. Yes ASC was an option, although I haven't come across many e32 740s without it. My e32 is a model year 94 (build date 08/93).

  13. #13
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    Where did you find it ?! I have to do a better search for mine
    Me E30 87/ 325i + F25 12/ M-Sport + E32 94/ 740i

    G/F’s E34 92/ 525iT + F48 18/ X1

  14. #14
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    It was tucked up in the space just behind and above those orange connectors in the picture.

  15. #15
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    A bit offtopic but...anyone can tell me how much do i have to lenghten my drive shaft. i dont trust my taken dimensions... What ive measured:
    original driveshaft (auto trans): 1405 mm
    lenght between gearbox output shaft flange to diferential input flange: about 1600 mm (i dont trust this one), taken 36 mm from the gibbo thickness 1564 mm.

    Can someone share information on this one?

    PS: Getting one from an E34 540i from a junkyard is not an option for me, because there are no cars like that from here til france on junkyards, Ive checked.

  16. #16
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    I did a 5-speed conversion on a 2002 in the early 80's and i just measured the length of both transmissions and used the difference for driveshaft mod.

  17. #17
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    I had a shop lengthen mine . I suggest doing the same I’m sure there Is one near you, they had me measure from the output flange do the center support hole in the body. The company was Carolina drive shaft, they were great and very affordable. I’m sure you could ship it to them if you can’t find anyone
    Me E30 87/ 325i + F25 12/ M-Sport + E32 94/ 740i

    G/F’s E34 92/ 525iT + F48 18/ X1

  18. #18
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    I had a shop lengthen mine . I suggest doing the same I’m sure there Is one near you, they had me measure from the output flange do the center support hole in the body. The company was Carolina drive shaft, they were great and very affordable. I’m sure you could ship it to them if you can’t find anyone
    I think ive found one in my country thanks. Gonna do the measurement you suggested though.

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