night illumination lights won't go off

[RIboater2]

The lights of the cluster and dash, console etc. I pulled both batteries for half hour and touched cables to drain everything. Even when the car goes to sleep, the little light next to shifter goes out but all the night lights stay on. Last thing I touched was pulled out my faulty air bag module (different problem there) and left it out. I tried putting it back in and didn't fix problem.
Possibly related, about two months ago I was having an issue with the opposite, the same lights going off at night. Turn the headlights on and they came on full bright and faded to dark, almost off in mere seconds, but that seems to have corrected itself until now this.

[racer2086]

I'd say check the dimmer near the dash cluster and the wiring and check the LCM for moisture.

[RIboater2]

strange the dimmer does operate some of the lights, like the mileage and trip and the gear selection, but not the gauges. Does dim the monitor but not the buttons around it.
would you believe after 12 years of being on this board I don't know where the lcm is located? and you could be on to something. Noticed it after I washed the car with a powerwasher. hmmmm......

[Jamos]

Interesting, I noticed that when the dimmer line was getting 12v it would mess up the ibus and the lights would go full brightness and not accept the dimmer input. I'd have to cycle the ignition to reset it. My car (not sure if it's a 95 thing) uses PWM on the dimmer line to set how bright things should be, and if you feed it full 12v it figures you want full brightness. Have you done any audio installation work at all that could have some lines crossed? If not it's possible one of the wires is shorting to something. Also possible that the dimmer switch is messed up some how!? Unplug it and see what that does.

Strange situation but again, when the buttons don't dim, it's because something on the ibus has messed up communications. If what I suggested didn't work, I'd start with unplugging the screen first, then if not, the hvac, then if not, the steering wheel controls, my bet it's one of those three "systems" causing the fault.

If it's NOT those, then... possible ignition switch malfunction - take it off, clean up the contacts, put it back...

Hope something helps!

[RIboater2]

I did just get my radio working again. was trying to track down why i kept blowing the fuse. disconnected everything. radio, amp, cd player, nav, a relay in that area, the diversity antenna, even pulled the monitor out of the dash. Just found today that it was the rear cigarette lighter. unplugged it and no more blown fuses. Not sure how that would relate to but it all happened at same time. Unplugged lighter from power, which got radio back on, and washed the car with power washer which racer2086 said check for moisture at lcm. And had taken my air bag module out. Put it back in but that didn't fix it. I don't know which of these things triggered this if any.

[Jamos]

Again I suggest disconnecting things one at a time until you find the problem. Otherwise disconnect the radio, lighter, airbag, etc.. and put them back one at a time until the issue shows up again - just be aware that you can set an airbag light and need to get it coded off if you do it wrong (I don't understand how that part works that's all I know!)

[racer2086]

strange the dimmer does operate some of the lights, like the mileage and trip and the gear selection, but not the gauges. Does dim the monitor but not the buttons around it.
would you believe after 12 years of being on this board I don't know where the lcm is located? and you could be on to something. Noticed it after I washed the car with a powerwasher. hmmmm......

The LCM is located in the passenger kick panel. That area is well known for getting wet if the sunroof drains become disconnected or clogged and water runs down the A-pillar.

Pull the battery, pull the LCM, and check the sunroof drains. Dry the LCM well and hopefully there's not significant damage to it.

If the LCM keeps power to it with water on there, electrolysis and corrosion can occur and that's when electronics get irreparably damaged.

[RIboater2]

I took the lcm out and the lights were still on. Now what? lol

For Jamos, i already have an air bag light on. That's a different problem I"m working on. But did notice the night lights on after I removed my air bag control module, but putting it back in didn't turn them off so not sure if related.

Edit: just went back to the car and now lights are off. Delayed lcm reboot?

[racer2086]

Please make sure you pull the battery before disconnecting things! It's possible there's another module that is bad and feeding power incorrectly out through the nightlight circuit. I picture the lights staying on and going out in time much like a capacitor discharges. Is there any sign down there of water intrusion? Sometimes it will get in and build up in the floor under the passenger seat. There are a lot of electronic connections down there.

Also check the center console, specifically the ash tray, gear shift lights, door lock switch, and hazard button. If someone spilled a drink, it could get in those switches and short things out.

[RIboater2]

Just to update, there was no sign of water around the lcm or under passenger seat. it seemed like one time I got them to go off by jiggling the light switch, so I replaced it but no luck and haven't been able to duplicate that for them to go off again. Even with the light switch removed they stayed on, just like removing the lcm and they still stayed on. I also unplugged the dimmer and they stayed on. Next I guess is to open up the console but not sure what I'd be looking for.

[Timm]

As they stay lit when the LCM is disconnected that really only leaves an errant splice for an after-market addition somewhere - alarm system, radio, radar system - something that has joined the 'always hot' circuit to the night illumination circuit. What you are looking for will not be an OEM BMW part.......

[racer2086]

Timm makes a perfect point. Also, I'm assuming you got the actual LCM and not a module you think is the LCM

[RIboater2]

The only aftermarket on the car was a Viper alarm system but that was disconnected years ago. I just pulled every fuse in the engine compartment, including the alarm fuse that viper was part of, and lights never went out. I'll try the trunk another time.
Any clues on what else would be an always on circuit?
Is there any other module in the passenger foot well that says LCM on it?

[racer2086]

Nope that should be it lol.

Where did the Viper alarm tap into the car for power and ground? Why would they put that on there in addition to the factory alarm??

Did you check the center console? You need to look at the wiring in there for shorts. There is power to the cigarette lighter and there are wires going to the ash tray for night lighting. There's lighting in the hazard switch, door lock switch, and shifter lights. If something is feeding power through those or there is an internal short on a circuit board in a switch you could be getting your issue. (My hazard switch dims and brightens on its own while the car is running. Bizarre, but not important, but there is circuitry in those switches (as does everything with a night light in it, but the switches are most commonly spilled on and shorted).

[RIboater2]

The viper was for remote starting. By default it had to be wired into the oem alarm. It was actually installed by the PO back in 2003. It was a long story. He went to an authorized Viper dealer who had the car two weeks and couldn't get it to work. So they had it towed (yes car was totally immobile from whatever they pulled apart) and the BMW dealer had it two weeks but got it to work.

I have not pulled the console out yet. What am I visibly looking for? Just keep disconnecting things until the lights go out? Pulling fuses should have done that. But I will pull it apart to take a look.
It's lights in the door handles, the seat memory switch, the rear heater controls, radio dials and buttons etc.

[racer2086]

I would pull the plugs to all the things in the console that have night lighting. The switches can be opened up...I've done it before to clean coffee out when it started making the switches intermittent.

[RIboater2]

I pulled out the console and unplugged everything. lights stayed on.
I was away for the weekend and car wouldn't start this afternoon from dead battery.

[racer2086]

Something is definitely shorted then. Unfortunately, this is not going to be an easy diagnosis.

Let's think about this...you pulled fuses and the lights stayed on. But you didn't pull any trunk ones. So that would at the minimum the PDC system, nav, phone, radio, and board monitor powered. Pull the trunk fuses also and see if the lighting goes out.

Then the next thing I would be thinking about is checking common areas for shorts to happen -- i.e. the door looms between the body and door where it bends. If some of the insulation is cracking, you could be shorting wires to the nightlighting that goes into the doors. Same goes for the wiring up by the sunroof, but that would only be if aftermarket stuff is installed up there. I did have an issue with my sunroof module that would cause all kinds of electrical problems with the car (doors locking, windows not working, etc). The module would go bad in the heat of the sun.

I'm afraid you may need to start unplugging things and exploring wiring to narrow it down...

[RIboater2]

Found it..
a few months ago I had a post about problem with a 30amp fuse in the trunk blowing and couldn't figure it out. It runs the radio, amp, mk3, monitor, and strangely, the rear cigarette lighter outlet. There was nothing in the outlet so didn't suspect it. But then I Needed to take out my air bag module for that problem and had to take that rear panel all apart and decided to unplug the lighter outlet anyway and try a new fuse. It didn't blow. Had my radio back. But I never connected the idea that my illumination lights started acting up at same time I got my radio back since you can't see them on in the daylight. I pulled that fuse and the lights went out. Ah HA! It isn't the lighter outlet itself that was blowing fuses as it was still unplugged, there is a lose wire in there somewhere. Just wiggling them the illumination lights went out. Didn't have time to dig in further and find the exact wire but at least I found the source. lights are off and radio still on. I got lucky. Maybe don't touch a thing! lol How is it that wires that never get moved or tugged or see the light of day could develop a short?