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Thread: 1991 850i automatic, EML light with no codes from Peake reader

  1. #1
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    1991 850i automatic, EML light with no codes from Peake reader

    I have 125,000 miles on the car and EML came on about 3 minutes after my daily commute started (in the 850). Went into (I think) limp home. I shut the car off for about a minute, restarted and it ran smooth for 30 seconds and then EML/limp home.
    After leaving it overnight, EML comes on with start-up.
    I'm starting with distributor caps and then plugs (the easy stuff).
    I'd like to hear:
    1) some trouble shooting ideas and
    2) the root cause discovered by others on this forum for EML under similar conditions.
    Thanks,
    Tom

  2. #2
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    Eml means engine malfunction light which has to to with the fly by wire throttle body's. In the old days folks would take them apart to clean out the carbon dust from the brushes on the motor. But you need to dx the issue first. Cap and rotor should have no bearing on the eml system so at this point I would not wast your money on that. Plus to read your faults from the round dx plug in the engine compartment your probably going to need a better piece of equipment
    Last edited by jclausen; 07-18-2018 at 09:43 AM.

  3. #3
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    Bad throttles.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jclausen View Post
    Eml means engine malfunction light which has to to with the fly by wire throttle body's. In the old days folks would take them apart to clean out the carbon dust from the brushes on the motor. But you need to dx the issue first. Cap and rotor should have no bearing on the eml system so at this point I would not wast your money on that. Plus to read your faults from the round dx plug in the engine compartment your probably going to need a better piece of equipment
    Thanks...the Peake plugs into the round plug under the hood...are you saying there is more/better information available form that plug with additional equipment?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by dragon850 View Post
    Bad throttles.
    How much for your service?
    How can I confirm this diagnosis?
    How long does this take?
    Last edited by Tomcat BMW; 07-18-2018 at 10:56 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomcat BMW View Post
    Thanks...the Peake plugs into the round plug under the hood...are you saying there is more/better information available form that plug with additional equipment?

    - - - Updated - - -


    How much for your service?
    How can I confirm this diagnosis?
    How long does this take?
    You need INPA or DIS to be able to see EML faults, usually EML light means is 99% bad throttles.
    Many forum members have used my throttle restoration service and are very happy with it, I restore them to factory spec not just clean them.
    I sent you an email.
    Last edited by dragon850; 08-17-2018 at 12:35 PM.

  6. #6
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    Disconnect both throttle body plugs and connect them back.
    To renew the constants.

  7. #7
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    there are many factors which can cause EML, see here the info which parts are all interconnected: EML SYSTEM OVERVIEW https://www.europeantransmissions.co...MW/EML-BMW.pdf

    Of course also the throttle bodies are often the case, if they run more than 2% out of sync, EML light comes on.
    Other things I would check: both distributors and rotors, ignition coils, spark plugs # 6 and 12, donuts, weak CPS signals, etc.
    I remember a case on the German forum, he was chasing a similar problem, in the end it turned out that one of the distributors rotors had haircracks, we also found this on a wrenching buddies M70, pics
    http://e32b12.blogspot.com/2013/10/i...tric-leak.html

    In addition the Peake tester also cannot read any transmission trouble, for example if a speed sensor inside the trans is not good.
    Last edited by shogun; 07-19-2018 at 10:54 PM.
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  8. #8
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    Thanks to all!!!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun View Post
    there are many factors which can cause EML, see here the info which parts are all interconnected: EML SYSTEM OVERVIEW https://www.europeantransmissions.co...MW/EML-BMW.pdf

    Of course also the throttle bodies are often the case, if they run more than 2% out of sync, EML light comes on.
    Other things I would check: both distributors and rotors, ignition coils, spark plugs # 6 and 12, donuts, weak CPS signals, etc.
    I remember a case on the German forum, he was chasing a similar problem, in the end it turned out that one of the distributors rotors had haircracks, we also found this on a wrenching buddies M70, pics
    http://e32b12.blogspot.com/2013/10/i...tric-leak.html

    In addition the Peake tester also cannot read any transmission trouble, for example if a speed sensor inside the trans is not good.
    Why sparkplugs 6 and 12 and what donuts?
    "spark plugs # 6 and 12, donuts"
    Thanks!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomcat BMW View Post
    Why sparkplugs 6 and 12 and what donuts?
    "spark plugs # 6 and 12, donuts"
    Thanks!
    cylinder position sensors are connected to those wires, they are being called doughnuts ... but I have never seen any of that cause eml light, and I have seen ALOT

  11. #11
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    They sometimes do, Even if 6 or 12 plug is loose or not seated properly throws a light.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by 8eights View Post
    They sometimes do, Even if 6 or 12 plug is loose or not seated properly throws a light.
    CEL but not EML, you've seen eml pop up?

  13. #13
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    If plug lead 6 or 12 (the ones with the inductive pickup donuts on them) are disconnected or short, a protection circuit embedded within the Motronic will severely clip the duty cycle of the injectors for that side to protect the catalysts from being drenched in raw, unburned fuel.

    Catalytic converter protection function - Ignition circuit monitoring

    The ignition circuit is monitored by the cylinder detection sender (pin 16) on ignition line 6 (or 12). If it detects no ignition signal on ignition line 6 (or 12) , the fuel supply to to the relevant cylinder bank is cut out by shortening the injection signal. The sender monitors the entire primary side of ignition, and cylinder 6 or 12 on the secondary side. catprotect

    https://bmweba.com/eba-01-29-9-782-108/
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  14. #14
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    I see that one of my DKs does not move with throttle movement. How do I unplug this plug? (picture)
    Attached Images Attached Images

  15. #15
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    Figured it out...thanks!

  16. #16
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    Thanks all and especially Dragon850 for the DK rebuild and responsiveness...SOLVED!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomcat BMW View Post
    Thanks all and especially Dragon850 for the DK rebuild and responsiveness...SOLVED!
    My Pleasure!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragon850 View Post
    My Pleasure!
    DK mailed back yesterday. I could not wait until the weekend to get this resolved! :-)

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomcat BMW View Post
    DK mailed back yesterday. I could not wait until the weekend to get this resolved! :-)
    Awesome! Thanks!

    Sent from my SM-G892U using Tapatalk

  20. #20
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    EML light intermittent 1992 850i E31

    Hi Everyone, I need some help here on my 1992 850i E31. I completed the DK motor removal and reconditioned by following the instruction provided online (by George Fontes). After putting it back and starting the engine, my EML lights up. I waited for the engine to warm up a little and press on the gas; however, the rpm will not go over 2,000. If I stop and restart the engine, some time the EML will not show up right away but after a minute or so, it will light up. About 2 months ago I put in STA-BIL Storage Fuel Stabilizer in the full gas tank. I wonder if that fuel stabilizer has anything to do with my EML light.

  21. #21
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    so the problem started after you removed the DK's and reconditioned them? Then I would test them once more, here is a detailed file with all test data for the DK's https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...ng-calibration
    do the throttle valves move when you switch ignition on? As soon as the ignition is switched on, the throttle valves move to the position they learned during the last synchronization.
    also check fuel pumps, do they work?
    Last edited by shogun; 07-12-2023 at 07:49 AM.
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  22. #22
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    Cleaning the throttles is just part of the issue, the bigger problem especially on early E32 750il and an indication of what's to come on all M70 and S70 powered cars at some point is the failing throttle body encoder plate.
    It fails in 2 ways:
    1) Encoder surface is too badly scorn by the encoder brushes, result is gradual decline in responsiveness over the years and then dead throttle and eml light.
    2) Second, there are several resistors molded into the encoder plate body under the encoder plate itself, after 30+ years they fail and the resistor value either shows infinite or very high resistance, again dead throttle.
    There is no solution to this problem other than buying new throttle from BMW at $4200 or finding a used throttle.
    Good news, solution was developed by E31-V12throttle and is in production currently. It will be available end of the year....

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragon850 View Post
    Good news, solution was developed by E31-V12throttle and is in production currently. It will be available end of the year....
    [/B]
    Say whaaaaaaaaaat :O

  24. #24
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    that advertisement for future products does not help him with the present problem. But he can measure the DK if it properly works or not. Maybe he just made a wrong assembling/adjustment after cleaning, but that can be double checked by measuring, how to in detail in the link of my post # 21, nominal values are shown there, here a direct link 21 pages detailed DK refurbishing, testing https://e32.1806.info/DK_M70_en.pdf
    I have made a detailed file together with another member from the E32 forum of all world wide available info of Bosch DK repairs in the internet and made one concentrated folder, free of charge available, we did the work for you, this includes the procedure for adjusting the encoder wiper, enjoy studying the file
    Last edited by shogun; 07-12-2023 at 10:03 PM.
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun View Post
    that advertisement for future products does not help him with the present problem. But he can measure the DK if it properly works or not. Maybe he just made a wrong assembling/adjustment after cleaning, but that can be double checked by measuring, how to in detail in the link of my post # 21, nominal values are shown there, here a direct link 21 pages detailed DK refurbishing, testing https://e32.1806.info/DK_M70_en.pdf
    I have made a detailed file together with another member from the E32 forum of all world wide available info of Bosch DK repairs in the internet and made one concentrated folder, free of charge available, we did the work for you, this includes the procedure for adjusting the encoder wiper, enjoy studying the file
    Well from my understanding he did not touch the encoder wipers during the cleaning, that means either carbon brushes are not pressed in or he has a dead encoder plate..... not a big surprise, I have a box of 20+ dead encoder plates with burned out resistors from my throttle rebuild service over the years. Also it's not really an advertisement, more of providing hope that our M70 S70 E31's and E32' will have a solution and will not be lawn art in the future due to dead throttles.

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