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Thread: (2.9L Built M20 Turbo) Can you review my tune?

  1. #26
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    2014 Alpina B7
    Quote Originally Posted by Groshuk View Post
    Who is your tuner? I'm in Langley and in the process of building a stroker motor that I will need the ECU tuned for, there's a local place that's been recommended but always good to have options.

    I'm going turbo eventually, only 350ish hp max though and the car may get drag raced once or twice but it'll basically just be a daily driver so I went with a .07 MLS gasket. Getting the head and block properly prepped for it, my mechanic friend says they're bullet proof if you do it properly. Time will tell.
    Racing Greed in Poco is easily the best bet locally


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  2. #27
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    1997 328 convertible
    I remember them from my RX7 days when they split off from ForceFed, I thought they just did Japanese and more race orientated though? Have you heard much about Malone? They were suggested to me as well

  3. #28
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    Never heard of Malone funny enough. Regarding RG, they have done a couple Turbo E36s so it’s somewhat similar. (At least it’s a BMW straight 6)


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  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    The welding of the coolant jackets wasn’t to help the gasket, it is more to strengthen the head from cracking. But I’ve decided to go with O Ring and Elring because there’s a guy local who can lend the Isky tool to me


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    The combustion chamber of M20 head has too many water jacket around it and not enough of a material to hold it in place. Once it warms-up really good it "moves" and it cant hold the HG anymore. This is not a problem at all for stock engine, but start adding boost and it becomes critical. So back in the days it was either welding the jackets for adding strength to this area or go 0-ring. I have tried all combos of o-ringing, but it didnt work for me. After a few laps on the track the gasket will find a way to move. Only after I switched to cutring my problems were solved.
    If your tune is fairly conservative and you dont do long pulls o-ring may work for you.

  5. #30
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    Bump to an old post just to get some more opinions


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  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    Bump to an old post just to get some more opinions


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    Maybe provide an updated maps?
    Capital Driving Club Car # 102
    How to turbo your car:
    Step one. Install ecu and learn to tune and or have it tuned.
    Step two. Install injectors and retune.
    Step three. Install turbo parts and bits. get it running with out leaks. DO NOT DRIVE IT. Idling should be ok
    Step four. Retune car
    Step five enjoy

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by euro2fast4u View Post
    Maybe provide an updated maps?
    It’s the same map


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  8. #33
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    Multi layer sandwich

    Quote Originally Posted by someguy2800 View Post
    That's what we all thought back in the day. People tried all kinds of finishing methods and they just kept failing. There is a reason all the guys here that have had turbo e36's for 10 years don't have them and never recommend them. A few people here and there get lucky with them. My personal theory is that an MLS gasket with that many layers cannot transfer the heat out of the middle layers through the viton coating out to the head and block and the viton coating scorches. They would probably be fine if people were only using .036" thick ones.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Stock head gasket and 11mm studs here. I have a cutring going in due to safety concerns this year.

    I had worked with cometic motorcycle gaskets and they are indeed just some 3 or 4 metal shims, however I just received my 0,140" MLS gasket for my S38 and it has a thick (around 3mm) metal shim between 3 or four metal shims.

    Is this the same arrangement as the M50 0,140" gaskets? I wasn't expecting this at all. I though I would get heaps of layers...

  9. #34
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    So after a retune, apparently this is all I could get away with before it knocks. ~7.5* at 11psi (~175kpa)

    I think something is way off. Either the mechanical timing doesn’t match Megasquirt even thought he confirmed timing, or the timing is so low that the egts are making it knock.


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  10. #35
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    Also I’m now running a 280/274 cam


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  11. #36
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    What do the plugs say

  12. #37
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    Showing slight signs of detonation. Im not sure if the knock is after tuning it or from before/during tuning. Ive got some new ones coming though.


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  13. #38
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    Also, I checked the timing yesterday. Mechanical timing is good, but it seems that Megasquirt is about 4 degrees retarded compared to true timing


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  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    Also, I checked the timing yesterday. Mechanical timing is good, but it seems that Megasquirt is about 4 degrees retarded compared to true timing


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    Seems odd. I checked page 1 quickly but don't see any notes about your turbo setup.

    Possible you're seeing high EBP causing knock?

    IAT's? Bad injectors? Poor ignition system performance?

    Not a lot to go on here.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by NOTORIOUS VR View Post
    Seems odd. I checked page 1 quickly but don't see any notes about your turbo setup.

    Possible you're seeing high EBP causing knock?

    IAT's? Bad injectors? Poor ignition system performance?

    Not a lot to go on here.
    It’s a 6262 t3, wasted spark, 80lb injectors, etc


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  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    It’s a 6262 t3, wasted spark, 80lb injectors, etc


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    Hmmm... well unlikely that ti's the turbo holding you back I'd say.

    You're going to have to keep digging/gathering data though. How are you detecting knock?

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by NOTORIOUS VR View Post
    Hmmm... well unlikely that ti's the turbo holding you back I'd say.

    You're going to have to keep digging/gathering data though. How are you detecting knock?
    Through a stand-alone knock detection device. Tuner nerd knock monitor pro.


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  18. #43
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    E21 M50 Turbo
    How do you like it so far? I read mixed opinions and want some first Hand experiences before ordering it



    Is your ex. mani too restrictive? And what Kind of spark plugs? maybe the are too hot, causing the knock?
    1982 E21 323i
    M50B25 Turbo
    Borg Warner S362 SX-E
    ECU Master Emu


  19. #44
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    Mani is fine, spark plugs are NGK BPR7s


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  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by PowerKraut View Post
    How do you like it so far? I read mixed opinions and want some first Hand experiences before ordering it



    Is your ex. mani too restrictive? And what Kind of spark plugs? maybe the are too hot, causing the knock?
    I’m not sure, since it’s my tuners but the software looked pretty nice tbh


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  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    Through a stand-alone knock detection device. Tuner nerd knock monitor pro.


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    Interestingly enough, I checked an old map from my friends old 2.9L M20 stroker we built and I ended up almost exactly with the same ign. advance under boost (within 1-1.5 deg of yours) over all.

    The car made about 500whp on pump and methanol on a JB 6262 at that time (2012)...

    But I'll be honest, the best thing I ever did was convince him to throw that dinosaur in the trash and move to the 24V.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by NOTORIOUS VR View Post
    Interestingly enough, I checked an old map from my friends old 2.9L M20 stroker we built and I ended up almost exactly with the same ign. advance under boost (within 1-1.5 deg of yours) over all.

    The car made about 500whp on pump and methanol on a JB 6262 at that time (2012)...

    But I'll be honest, the best thing I ever did was convince him to throw that dinosaur in the trash and move to the 24V.
    I’ve got an S52 Turbo sitting at home too but I like the dinosaur

    Also, 500whp and that kind of timing means a lot more boost which is acceptable. I’m at that kind of timing and only ~11psi


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  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    I’ve got an S52 Turbo sitting at home too but I like the dinosaur

    Also, 500whp and that kind of timing means a lot more boost which is acceptable. I’m at that kind of timing and only ~11psi


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    What I meant was I was at the same timing at the same load as your timing table.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by NOTORIOUS VR View Post
    What I meant was I was at the same timing at the same load as your timing table.
    Really, doesn’t that seem a bit low though?


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  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by SGT StudMuffiin View Post
    Really, doesn’t that seem a bit low though?


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    Seems low I agree. Maybe it's the cam. My buddy was running a Schrick 288 I believe at the time.

    I don't remember having ign. values that low with the stock 885 cam... when I have some time to dig through some older logs/maps from when it was just a stock M20 with headstuds around 400whp I can let you know.

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