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Thread: 98' 740i cranking with no start. Solved for now?

  1. #1
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    98' 740i cranking with no start. Solved for now?

    Attachment 629806Attachment 629808Attachment 629809Attachment 629810

    Well I picked up a 98' 740i green on tan with 89k/mi for $1100 for my daughter. Putting the key in the ignition resulted in blackness. I looked over the car and it was pretty clean and unmolested. It had just been sitting. The battery voltage was 1.5 so I figured it needed a battery. I looked under the carpet on the passenger side and it was dry. I had it towed home.

    First thing I did was put a battery in and hook up a charger, $200. The car came to life and the ODO actually said 89K. When I first cranked it the engine ran for a few seconds. Awesome the engine will run. Now I need to make it run reliability. Next is to get the old fuel out. 15 gallons of old fuel out and 5 gallons of fresh fuel in. A few more cranking attempts with no change. At one point it did start and run for almost an hour. The engine warmed up and all the cooling fans were working. The next attempt was all cranking and no starting.

    At this point it was time to do some research. I have seen many crank and no starts posted in the last 18 months I have owned an E38. I figured I could be in real trouble? To all, Check Timm's web page first! He knows what he knows and has yet to be wrong with his process of troubleshooting. Searching the web I found plenty of information on cranking with no starts and almost all were people just throwing parts at their cars. Based on Timm information I knew it was not a crank sensor because I could smell fuel out the tailpipe so the injectors were firing. I also knew it was not the fuel pump because I could hear it pump up and shut off when the key was turned on. I all so knew it was not the cam sensor because according to Timm it will run with the cam sensor unplugged. Don't bother putting a meter on it unless you have an oscilloscope. Next was to inspect the fuse box and computers.

    I always say if you have an intermittent problem 90% of the time its a bad connection. So why in the hell did BMW put the DME, TWS and EWS in the engine compartment with non watertight connections and the pugs facing up? A-holes! As you can guess by now I found the problem. The relays for the air valve and fuel pump as well as the computers had massive corrosion. Ball park for used computers and coding is $700-1000. for that kind of money I can spend a few hours in tear down mode for a closer look.

    I ended up cleaning all of the plugs and removing the pins that broke off. I identified the pins that were not in use and did not bother to repair them. In the process I found spares to use for my repairs. So inside the back side of the socket I remove the bad pins. I removed the good unused pins and relocated to the ones I needed to replace. I used the solder iron to heat up the pin and melt the plastic socket so that I could pull the pin out. After relocating the pin I soldered it to what was left of the old pin and in one case directly to the board. FYI you can acquire new sockets from mouser by using the PN on the socket. Computers back in but still cranking with no start.

    Next I took apart the relays. They were also full of corrosion. I messed with them a bit but in the end they were not working. One runs the fuel pump and one runs the air valve. So I could hear the fuel pump run but the car would not start. I went out and switched the relays and the car would start and run for a few minutes. I did this several times. So for $30 I'll just buy new ones. New relays in place and Viola! a nicely running 740i for a few hours of research and repair. The smile on my daughters face was all the reward I needed. Now she is driving a flagship BMW instead of some little Sh&$ box.

    Now we will get on to all of the regular maintenance. Oil, filters and tires.
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

  2. #2
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    Nice work!

  3. #3
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    Hampton va
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    95 740i, 89 735i,
    Great I love it...

  4. #4
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    Man, if I'd had an e38 when I was a teenager...!
    I did alright though, in high school and college in the late 90s I had my dream car at the time: a 1986 Nissan 300zx

  5. #5
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    Great work!!!

    Now get her invested in the car by doing some of the work herself.
    Once they put some blood, sweat, tears, and elbow grease into a car,they treat it totally differently.
    They learn something along the way and you remove a victim from the less then honorable repair shops/dealers for life.

    I started 2 years ago with an E46 with my son. I have supplied the parts, he has got the labor. With a little oversight they can do everything.
    When they tell you "Why would anyone pay someone to do this?" you know you are there.

    Plus, there is nothing more intimidating to a teenage guy, then a girl that can fix it.

    Good luck.

    RobZR

  6. #6
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    That is some impressive work, congrats! I would fear to death jumping into an unknown, cheap E38... again Only E38 I will every buy again will have service history down to the plastic clips they ever replaced.

  7. #7
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    Great job! How much did Tim pay you for this post???

    Love reading posts like these, "I had a problem, SEARCHED FOR A SOLUTION, and fixed it myself." Not, "I have a problem, I'm too lazy to search, and.. bro fix it for me"

    *Cheers, daughter must be excited!

    || 1995 740i || M60B40 || DUDMD || ̶o̶r̶i̶e̶n̶t̶ ̶b̶l̶u̶e̶ Mercedes Brilliant Blue Metallic || Style 168 Wheels 1" Spacers ||



  8. #8
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    BTW you can get OEM relays from FCP around $8 and genuine ones for approx $18

  9. #9
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    Thanks for the support, I have her do what she can. She has been spit shining the car while I was TS. She pumped the gas out after I helped set it up. She also changed the battery. Her 13yo brother has been has been showing her the ropes too. He's a big time wrench turner. It's kind of turning into a family project which is cool for me because I have always been into cars.

    I could have waited and spent less on a relay but after all of those hours working on the DME and TCM I just couldn't wait.

    You know if Timm is correct he is, the same goes for anyone. I'm an engineer and I can relate to his methods and logic.
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

  10. #10
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    Nice work! Feels good when you get a positive result huh?

    Sent from my SM-N910T3 using Tapatalk

  11. #11
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    Very nice work! The knowledge and intuition imparted to your children will manifest itself immeasurably over their lives.
    And they will remember you for it!
    Some these days can't open peanut butter....

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldroller View Post
    Very nice work! The knowledge and intuition imparted to your children will manifest itself immeasurably over their lives.
    And they will remember you for it!
    Some these days can't open peanut butter....
    Lol, true. My 8 years old girl can check engine coolant temperature and scan for error codes

  13. #13
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    Well like the thread says "solved for now?"

    Well the car had been running and driving just fine after the DME repair and relay replacement. So I picked Emily up from school and we went to transfer the title and register the car. We live in the boonies so no smog. When we got home she started the car and backed it up a bit to put the front plate on. When her uncle and cousin showed up they wanted a ride. They went out to the car and it would not start. I checked and fiddled with the relays and they seemed to be working fine. It was end of the day and the cake and icecream was waiting.

    So I went out in the morning and tried again with all cranking and no starting. I unplugged the cam sensor and bang the car fired right off. I was happy to have found the problem but there goes another Benjamin. I let the car warm up and then shut it off. As I was closing the hood and leaving I noticed that the intake hose was disconnected from the accumulator.

    When I got home with my new cam sensor I showed Emily where the cam sensor was and the disconnected hose. I told her to reconnect the hose and then we would try and start the car. She worked at it for awhile but daddy needed to get the last little bit. I connected the cam sensor and Varoom! The engine ran fine of course without a massive amount of air bypassing the MAF. After the car got warmed up Emily did her first oil and filter change. Then we spent the evening practicing parking and backing around corners. I'm going to hold onto the cam sensor for a few days.
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

  14. #14
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    So I'm back at it. I hope to get a little info out of someone. So twice now it will crank without starting. I always check the relays for the fuel pump and air valve. This is an exception most of the time it runs fine. It did it once after a 60min drive at the filling station and last night when it had been sitting.

    There were two codes this time but I don't think the codes would stop it from running. 139 for the thermostat and 40 I believe is for the cat. It's in german so I'm doing some translation. I'll be looking onto both.

    So here's where I need some input. I pulled the plugs following Timm's write up and they are wet. I can smell fuel at the tailpipe when it will not start. There is an air valve after the MAF that opens and closes when the key is turned on. If it does not work correctly I would imagine no air gets into the engine. I put a few turns on the ajuster but not knowing what the heck it does I stopped there. The other thing I discovered was that the cruise cable was tight and my have been holding the TB open a bit. I put a touch of slack in it as well as the throttle cable. Anyone know how to set these three cables? After my adjustment and a code reset the car fired right off.
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

  15. #15
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    If the car is not starting and the plugs are wet, that would indicate either a compression issue or ignition issue. The compression we can probably rule out due to low miles and car running fine. Sure all of the DME pins are clean? Get some Deoxit and give the plug and DME pins a good spray down and then insert and remove the plug a bunch of times. Also, be sure the thermostat wiring is not wicking coolant up to the DME from a failed thermostat. The Deoxit is great stuff that I use on my vintage audio equipment to remove oxidation from contacts.
    '98 740il | 9/97 build | schwarz 2 | sandbeige | 5AT | 270k
    '04 330i ZHP sedan | Mystic blue | Alcantara | 6MT | 120k
    '00 540i sport | Titanium silver | Black | 5AT | 152k
    '85 Mustang GT convertible | Medium charcoal metallic | Gray | 5MT | 216k | one owner, all original

    mods: m-pars | Bilsteins & B&G springs | ValentineOne | StealthOne
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  16. #16
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    Jun 2018
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    hanna, in
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    Who is Tim please that you mention I have a similar issue with a 2000 740i messing in the trunk now no start could use a pic of the trunk fuse layout cant find one...

    Well done with your project!

  17. #17
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    Here is the final update. After a ton of TS and research I have discovered the problem. The DME-EWS sync. According to Bentley's if the EWS is not happy with the key the car should not even turn over. In my case the car will turn over and intermittently start. There is a bug with the rolling code in the EWS 3.3 that won't let the car start. After contacting Dudmd the EWS on my 5.2.1 DME can't be deleted. Updating to the 4.3 EWS will not help because it is also buggy. The only possible option is to virginize a ne DME and sync it to my EWS and keys and hope for the best?

    As for now my daughter will have to pack around a laptop with INPA and if the car acts up she can reset the EWS. I hope this thread helps to prevent someone from throwing parts at their car when they have a crank but no start problem.
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

  18. #18
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    Well, we know that it normal circumstances the EWS system works really well - the only time we see the problem is when the key has been left in the ignition as the battery goes flat. The reason for that is that the EWS only sends a new key-data (change code) to the key once the engine has started - so if you just stick the key in the ignition (to listen to the radio) and then the battery goes flat you haven't got the new key data ready for the next start - and you need to re-align the transponder and EWS to get it going again.

    The reason I mention that is that if you have a faulty induction loop you will get the same problem - and obviously the connections between it and the EWS. So, that's where I would start!
    Timm..2007 E64 650i Individual Sport..1999 E31 840ci Individual Sport..ex owner of 2000 E38 740..1999 E38 740i V8 M62..1998 E38 735i V8..1993 E32 730i V8..1988 E28 518i


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  19. #19
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    Here's another update. I guess this is why I put the question mark in the title. After fits and spurts of running the car finally died. After all of the normal wiring and relay checks it was time to just replace the DME. I found a few more pins that looked suspect.

    Took the key and EWS to DUDMD. He provided a new 5.2.1 DME, virginzed and synced it to the EWS. After install I got a crack with no start. Checked and cleared the codes in the DMW and EWS. After that the car fired right up. We have driven it several times and performed many more driveway starts with no failures. Fingers crossed.

    Helped my daughter service the transmission yesterday. Next is the water pump(noisy) and the corresponding belts and hoses. Even though it has low miles it's still 20 years old. Maybe when we get it all polished up we will try some of that crack pipe pricing and see if we get lucky?
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

  20. #20
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    06 BMW 320d | 95 BMW E38
    Lets hope it is fixed now😁

  21. #21
    Join Date
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    And here's how the story ends. Or maybe just moves on to the next chapter,

    https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...o-start-solved

    It was bad contacts in the ignition switch feeding power to the unloader relay which powers the coils.
    01' 750il Chromeline
    95 M3 LS swapped
    07 M5 Manual
    06' M5, Spartan wheels and a 507hp V10
    00' 740il Dinan, CAI, Romulus exhaust, Stage 5 engine and transmission tune, 750 brakes, camber plates, strut tower brace. Sold
    00' 323i wagon for daughter
    03' 525i wagon for the wife, sold
    98' 740i for the daughter, wrecked
    92' 525i with over 200k, wrecked
    02' R1200 CLC, hit by a bus and broken in half. That one made the news!
    It's like herpes there is no cure but if treated properly you can live with it for the rest of your life

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