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Thread: Hard start, stalling starts

  1. #1
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    Hard start, stalling starts

    I've had a hard start issue for a while now which usually takes a second turn of the key before the engine fires.
    I finally got around to sorting it out as new converters installed and the cel hasent went away. Codes are for camshaft position sensor a (I replaced a year ago) 02 sensor pumping circuit high bank 1 sensor 2, and 02 sensor bank 1 sensor 1.
    I just cleared the codes in hopes maybe that the ecu will see the faults gone.

    Is it possible the crank sensor is bad and the ecu sees a camshaft sensor fault?
    Secondly how do I know if the 02 plugs did not get crossed, and could that cause this?
    Nobody would recertify these machines after somebody screwed with them without any visibility into what they did.

    HONK! HONK! Clown car coming through!

    -Oakdizzle

  2. #2
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    Sorry I missed stateing the info. I installed new converters as the front converter had simply fallen apart on the inside as the first post converter 02 sensor replacement revealed the cone was in pieces. So it now has new converters and all 4 02 sensors are new.
    The camshaft a sensor (exhaust side?) I replaced after the code appeared about 6 months ago shortly before I found the converter in pieces. So I doubt any 02 sensors are faulty or the exhaust side camshaft sensor.

  3. #3
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    The code for camshaft position a sensor came back immediately along with p032. Oxygen sensor heater circuit high sensor 1 bank 1. I know the sensor is good as I already stated it's brand new.
    Anyone deal with this?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by spyderg0d View Post
    The code for camshaft position a sensor came back immediately along with p032. Oxygen sensor heater circuit high sensor 1 bank 1. I know the sensor is good as I already stated it's brand new.
    Anyone deal with this?
    A few questions for you.
    1. Vehicle info?
    2. What brand of sensors did you get and where did you get them?

    Camshaft position sensor "a" is the intake side, not exhaust and causes long crank time and stalling when bad. Are your pre cat o2 sensors standard 4 wire sensors or wide band (5-6 wire)? I would swap the o2 sensors from b1 and b2 and see if the fault follows the sensor.

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  5. #5
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    03 325i auto with 130k. Engine swapped last year due to bad crank bearings.
    Passed inspection then shortly after, then shortly after that 02 sensor code came followed by junk cat. New cats, off brand, 02s are off brand also.
    Has 6 wire or square plug 02 sensors for pre cats.

    I just figured out live data, and I matched the 02 sensors to the proper plugs.
    Although 1 precast sensor is indeed a higher average voltage than the other as a median during the wave form.

  6. #6
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    Nobody would recertify these machines after somebody screwed with them without any visibility into what they did.

    HONK! HONK! Clown car coming through!

    -Oakdizzle

  7. #7
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    Swap the sensors b1s1 and b2s1 and see if the problem moves with the sensor. The cheap Chinese ones are unreliable.

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  8. #8
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    This is embarassing. But turns out the 02 sensor was indeed bad. I switched it with an old one I pulled out of the garbage can and the (ma) equalized with the other 02 sensor readings and then the post cat 02 sensor readings leveled out with the other. Immediate throttle response improvement on the test drive. I have learned my lesson with off brand cheap sensors. I should have assumed as much when the post cat sensors didn't even plug in from different internal shape.
    Nobody would recertify these machines after somebody screwed with them without any visibility into what they did.

    HONK! HONK! Clown car coming through!

    -Oakdizzle

  9. #9
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    Lol buy some good ones and try to return the cheap ones.

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  10. #10
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    My rule of thumb, "Only use BMW OE or OEM replacements for all BMW sensors!"
    Eliminates electrical gremlins or electronic anomalies.
    I'm sure you've heard of FCPEuro, great parts supplier.

  11. #11
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    Ok.. so now the cel has not come back on.
    But now there's intermittent issues. When the car first starts and idles there a stumble and what feels like misfires as the car shakes very noticeably. The revs stay at the 700 or so consistantly during this. 1 time the cel lit up, but went away very quickly and the stumble stopped. Also, when it begins to stumble sometimes while at a stop sign and idling , if I press the accelerator peddle the stumble goes away and the car acts fine although seeming as if rev hang. No cel.
    Nobody would recertify these machines after somebody screwed with them without any visibility into what they did.

    HONK! HONK! Clown car coming through!

    -Oakdizzle

  12. #12
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    Scan, scan, and scan again,
    after each intermittent issue!
    The codes display the clues.

    Note,clear codes between occurrences.

  13. #13
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    Cel came on. Came up as p0174 and p0234
    Precast 02 sensor heater circuit shorted with signal and bank 2 to lean. That's the other new off brand 02 sensor so... it would be pretty rediculoues if I put on the other old 02 sensor and it went away. Which is my next attempt.
    Nobody would recertify these machines after somebody screwed with them without any visibility into what they did.

    HONK! HONK! Clown car coming through!

    -Oakdizzle

  14. #14
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    I changed the 02 back to the other old one. So far so good. The (ma) seems to be even closer to the other bank 1 original sensor. Although before the off brand sensor didn't seem to be working improperly when viewing the live data.
    Considering if the heater circuit really is shorted for that sensor. How do I trouble shoot this past the cel code? If a normal 3 wire 02 I would be experienced, bit I have no experience with wideband.
    Nobody would recertify these machines after somebody screwed with them without any visibility into what they did.

    HONK! HONK! Clown car coming through!

    -Oakdizzle

  15. #15
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    As a follow up, all the monitors set. I have 2 new codes. Bank 1 lean, bank 2 lean. So after the vacuum leak check in the intake tomorrow while installing a new starter I should be good to go. Thanks for the help gentlmen.

  16. #16
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    Intake leaks are sometimes hard to locate,
    good luck!
    Update us on your outcome.

  17. #17
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    So I ripped almost the entire intake apart and found absolutely no cracks, leaks, or malfunctions with the exception of the o ring on the cvv hose from the valve cover down, leaking oil at the bottom thanks to a hardened o ring.
    Then, I took the variable tune intake valve off (disa I think it's called for bmw) and the flap has separated from the inner drive shaft completely. I should be able to pick one or 3 up at the junkyard friday for under $30. So that will be that.

    As an unrelated issue. My 2 brand new khumo tires went bald in the matter of 3 weeks and 5 to 600 miles. I got the alignment literally the day before I put the rear tires on. I was furios when I read 2 degrees of toe and 2 degrees of camber was the stock setting. How absolutely idiotic. $350 of tire tread eaten by manufacture idiocy.

  18. #18
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    2 degrees toe is not correct. Should be more like 0.2 degrees

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  19. #19
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    If you've got occasional starting problems, stumbling and a lean condition in both banks, suspect a failing fuel pump. I chased all the above all over the place for several months before finally diagnosing it as fuel pump failure. Replaced it and the car has performed perfectly ever since. It drove me nuts because every time I'd put a fuel pressure gauge on it, it gave me correct pressure - a classic case of the problem going underground when the mechanic is looking for it. A lean condition can either be too much air or not enough fuel; in my case it was the latter.

  20. #20
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    I prefer settings set for tire life,
    some prefer performance settings,
    me, I'll live with 1° of Camber,
    1/16"of Total toe front,
    1/8" Total toe rear.

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