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Thread: Buffalo Leather Questions

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Metairie, LA, USA
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    1985 BMW 745i, & 635CSI

    Buffalo Leather Questions

    I have taken on the task of cleaning and restoring the nutria hides in my 745i from 1985. I started out with some leather cleaner, a towel and a brush. That wasn't really getting anywhere I remembered reading in some other posts about sandpaper but that was for the painted-on type of dye seats. I then got a scouring pad that was abrasive, but certainly not sandpaper, and I started to make some progress. I'm also just rubbing it with slight force. Man are these seats and leather dirty.

    3Bs0HEDiQsit5bEPRAfNsg.jpg
    You can see the difference from where I hit it with the pad and what I am scrubbing off.
    3TQ37sJnQDudEXhOucoGWA.jpg
    Almost done with this one but you can see some spots. Hard to tell once the surface gets wet but once it dries a little the spots I missed show up. What I learned is if the surface is slick, give it a scrub. The clean surface has a very nice feel to it, like a good natural leather bag.

    Of course, the whole interior is Leather so I'll be doing that for a while. I decided to pull it all out where I could work on it at a civilized height and in the A/C of my garage. My questions are, am I right in concluding this is not a leather to re-dye with the normal products but to just oil it? The second question is what kind of oil to use? I couldn't seem to get a clear understanding of whether or not there was a different type of oil for this kind of hide and dye, or if Leatherique would work just fine.

    Taking all the leather out also put me right down a rabbit hole because I was also trying to get rid of an odor I thought was old BMW but just seemed a bit much. When I took out the seats, I realized how dirty the carpet was. I decided to take out the carpet for a pressure wash and found a nice puddle under the pad in the right passenger footwell; out came the padding and that was the smell I was hunting. Well, most of it anyway.

    IACbt8VeRHe3o+ezKyu+AQ.jpg


    That led me to take out the rear seat since I was hunting down an absent antenna wire anyway and then I found another part of the odor which was an old rodent nest, along with a nice collection of red dust, legos, and a whole lot of other trash. I also found a wiring nightmare to sort out. I'll break all of those down to separate posts, but suffice it to say it was a crazy Sunday

    9WCrLF9xR8OU3Al0rxYh5g.jpgTyv2CO8cQiWUzwEzCLq8XQ.jpg

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
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    My Cars
    1985 BMW 735i
    espoe,

    "I feel your pain."
    Just wrapped up a project like this just a few weeks ago. Got my 7 back together and driving it. Still working out a few issues, but thoroughly enjoying it. It is my first e23, after driving e24/e28 for years.

    I used Leatherique on the Buffalo leather interior I put in my 7. I went through an entire gallon and need to purchase more to finish up a few spots. My interior was the full leather and it looks like yours is as well, correct? Meaning full leather on the door panels and leather on the lower dash and center consoles?

    Their process is to put the rejuvenating oil on first, which floats all the crap out of the pores of the leather. Then you clean it off with their prestine clean. It really worked well on my Anthracite interior.
    I would suggest rehydrating the leather before scrubbing too much. I'm not sure how much damage is being done by scrubbing off the surface first. I'd do the Leatherique process and let it do most of the work for you. But be prepared for the leather to soak up a lot of oil. Yes it is expensive, but you can't beat how these buffalo interiors look when they are nourished with plenty of oil.

    Not sure if you have any, but I had the added issue with the leather having mold on it from the seat's previous owner's non climate controlled storage. I used a solution of white vinegar and water to kill the mold. I let it soak in slightly and then followed it with prestine clean, rejuvenating oil, then prestine clean again. So far, I've only had one small section start to come back. I repeated the steps and I think the second treatment took care of it.

    There is also the Colourblock line of products that many highly recommend. They had/have a dye that will bring some of the color back to the leather, but I don't think it is actually a dye. I plan to get some at some point to use on a few areas that are really faded. I do wonder if it is compatible with the Leatherique system. I would think it would be. I know there are one or two board members that have used it; maybe they can add to the discussion.

    Since you are already down the "rabbit hole", how is the seal around your A/C box in the firewall? That is what sent me down deep in the "rabbit hole" with mine. I ended up pulling the entire interior out of the 7 except the headliner along with the front and rear glass. If the rear window seal hadn't been NLA, I would have pulled it all. Thought it best to leave well enough alone.

    I put modern sound deadening materials in (which made a huge difference), did a lot of cleaning, painting, rust spot treating, new seals, cleaned up the wiring, added Euro only features, painted the headliner (which turned out great), new sound system and a whole lot of other stuff.

    So if you have any questions or just need someone to say "you can do it", feel free to reach out.

    Good luck!!
    It will be worth it!!!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Metairie, LA, USA
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    My Cars
    1985 BMW 745i, & 635CSI

    Buffalo Leather Questions

    It’s just what you said, Leather everywhere. I am surprised the throttle pedal isn’t leather. As far as the cleaning I have been using a leather cleaner and foaming it, giving it a rub with the little green pad and a damp towel wipe. Judging by how it’s coming out I would say that’s working well. I looked up on Colourlock.com about caring for Buffalo and turns out they have a sanding block for aniline leather care so that eased my concern about the rough pad. See the article here https://www.colourlock.com/tip/furni...o-leather.html

    Right now I have a gallon of Lexol conditioning oil that I haven’t used yet, but from reading I am thinking that is not the right oil. I’ll order up some specially for aniline treated leather, along with the protectant spray.

    No mold issues, just trying to kill off the smell in the horsehair and carpet from the long time that it sat, rodent infestation,and the water issue which i still have to find.

    I just fixed up the tail light gaskets so you can’t see daylight anymore. I bought a trunk lid gasket since they painted over the old one, and I have a new sunroof gasket on hand. I’ll check out the roof drains and see how they do. If it still leaks, then I may have to look at window rubber along with the cowl area openings. I am ratty sure a windshield company can make up a gasket that has the groove for the lock strip chrome.

    I just had all of the cowl stuff out including heater box when I replaced the dash, a/c pods, yada yada. I’ll double check the seals though . I replaced the headliner at that time.

    I will replace the insulation floor pad for sure, man did that stink. I see you used an acoustical product, which one did you use, how do you like it, and how much did you get? Also how thick is it, the factory pad is pretty thick and since I took it out I am thinking about just replacing the carpet and getting the upgraded backing/thermal/sound insulation. Trying to figure all that out.

    Like I said, a rabbit hole. BTW, pictures of your project or it didn’t happen


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
    Last edited by espoe; 05-07-2018 at 09:31 PM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    Edmond, OK
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    358
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    00 MRoadster '83 745i,
    https://colorplus.com/

    My black buffalo interior has been redone with this line of products. Looks almost brand new. Not one flaw.

    I was so impressed, I redid my steering wheel and shift boot, which are just cow hide, and everyone thinks I bought a new wheel and boot.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Metairie, LA, USA
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    1985 BMW 745i, & 635CSI
    I will call them tomorrow. Thanks for the tip.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    TX
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    1983/84/85 745i

    Thumbs up

    I had a Color Plus interior in my old Ljet, looked great for the regular leather. I would still have that car if the PO's kid did not roach the head light harness.



    I was in a car with Colourlock, looked great. It is made for that aniline leather.



    Never tried Leatherique on buffalo, I hear it works well.
    I make E23 parts.
    09/1983 745i (stolen spring '13 around Houston, TX Achatgruen on nutria buffalo. 8481080)
    10/1984 745i
    11/1984 745i
    11/1984 735i (10:1-265/6)
    Ford, MB, and GM round out the pack.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
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    Gilbert, Arizona
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    6/83 1984 745i
    I've had an experience that a few people shared with me, and was initially frustrating, but ultimately was very pleased. First my interior was tan/green and hard as a rock when I received the car. I was even skeptical that the interior was the original anthracite. I wanted it to look good but not new, and was not interested in dying it. I was told by an e24 friend that had buffalo hide requires "gallons of product". Again skeptical at this claim, but I began the preservation with a real good cleaning. I applied Sonax almost weekly, and it would look very dark, but by morning it would return to tan. After over $100 worth of sonax, and no joke a few months, I applied a coat, and in the morning it was anthracite. It was as if it reached a maximum absorption, and it has been the same since.
    alpinweiß on anthrazit buffalo 1984 745i, 2014 Fiesta ST, 1984 635csi 1986 635csi 1987 L6 1999 M coupe 2002 M3 1995 325i 1976 200​2, 2001 996 TT 1994 850 T5 wagon 1998 GTi VR6 1983 scirocco

  8. #8
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    Jun 2010
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    TX
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    1983/84/85 745i

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Freshbread View Post
    I've had an experience that a few people shared with me, and was initially frustrating, but ultimately was very pleased. First my interior was tan/green and hard as a rock when I received the car. I was even skeptical that the interior was the original anthracite. I wanted it to look good but not new, and was not interested in dying it. I was told by an e24 friend that had buffalo hide requires "gallons of product". Again skeptical at this claim, but I began the preservation with a real good cleaning. I applied Sonax almost weekly, and it would look very dark, but by morning it would return to tan. After over $100 worth of sonax, and no joke a few months, I applied a coat, and in the morning it was anthracite. It was as if it reached a maximum absorption, and it has been the same since.


    Dyno yours! I know you have access to one, Kris told me!
    I make E23 parts.
    09/1983 745i (stolen spring '13 around Houston, TX Achatgruen on nutria buffalo. 8481080)
    10/1984 745i
    11/1984 745i
    11/1984 735i (10:1-265/6)
    Ford, MB, and GM round out the pack.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
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    Gilbert, Arizona
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    6/83 1984 745i
    Quote Originally Posted by Hit Man X View Post
    Dyno yours! I know you have access to one, Kris told me!
    Hahaha! I just need to stop f’ing around and finish building the car. Too many projects in my mix. I’m going to shoot you an email this weekend, just want to make sure Maximilian mobile tradition is the best source for the parts I’m looking for.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    TX
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    1983/84/85 745i

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Freshbread View Post
    Hahaha! I just need to stop f’ing around and finish building the car. Too many projects in my mix. I’m going to shoot you an email this weekend, just want to make sure Maximilian mobile tradition is the best source for the parts I’m looking for.


    I usually use Blunttech, they sponsor most of the events I attend. Unsure if Max does.

    Dyno it stock!
    I make E23 parts.
    09/1983 745i (stolen spring '13 around Houston, TX Achatgruen on nutria buffalo. 8481080)
    10/1984 745i
    11/1984 745i
    11/1984 735i (10:1-265/6)
    Ford, MB, and GM round out the pack.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Eureka, CA
    Posts
    14
    My Cars
    1983 745i Silver
    Leatherique has done an amazing job getting my buffalo hide anthracite interior back to life (and yes its everywhere in the car)...although I probably need to do 3 or 4 more bottles of the stuff to and hot box the interior to get it fully done - the stuff really is amazing but takes hours to apply and massage in. I put a radiant heater in the car for a few hours and raised the temp up a lot...that really helped getting it soaked in. Shit was very dried out!!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Metairie, LA, USA
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    1985 BMW 745i, & 635CSI
    Well I have the whole interior inside my garage and that is making it easier to work with it and keep it temperature controlled for the restoration products. Here's what I am realizing. The PO had already cleaned and oiled the interior. I think what happened was he didn't realize just how much crud was in it. When I described the scrubbing I was doing, CFisher535is was concerned I was rubbing off the finish. I thought about that but realized all I had to do was rub my nail over it and it would come off. What I realized it could very well have been some color but it was in the crud.

    I believe the car was in a barn or something for a number of years because under the carpets and seats was all this red dirt. If it was in that dusty of a place for a lot of years, then the leather had to swallow a lot of that. So even though the previous owner had cleaned and conditioned, I don't think it was finished giving up the crud and what I was getting a lot of that plus some of the color I am sure. I really don't think there was anything I could have done about it.

    I will say now the all the leather and seats feel terrific, though the driver's seat is not in the best shape. There is no more slick, hard top to the leather in any place. It feels like a leather jacket and a bit suede like. I remember the buffalo leather feeling more rustic than the others when I was importing them back in the day. I did have to use those green pads and even a very mild sandpaper to get that crust off but as far as the leather feels and look it's great. The color is splotchy though and I may have to get the dye for it. In fact, as I stated earlier the car was damp inside from some leaks, I may even have some mildew stains but not positive about that. Check out the pics and you'll see.

    Anyway I am confident they will be nice when it's done and I am glad I took it all out to work on it. I also have to say the color plus product is great. The cleaner was a world of difference from the lexol. I think the conditioner goes a long way as well. I did the whole interior with half a can, and even after another quick top sand on some spots, the leather feels oiled after 2 weeks.
    lzyJIxzqRXqUNzMBFqzXSw.jpg
    Cleaned armrest on the right, freshly oiled on the left

    2jA9aR2JQwezJnKVQb2AMw.jpg
    freshly oiled
    JbkjK9NNRdiJIDMO92r2Hg.jpg
    Cleaned on the left, uncleaned on the right

    Wo8Sz%gKQg60QFRXzJOljw.jpg
    Splotchy coloring

  13. #13
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    Jun 2018
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    MT View, HI
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    '80 733i , '76 2002
    What a diff. That looks like a whole lot of work!

  14. #14
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    1985 BMW 745i, & 635CSI
    Quote Originally Posted by TowJamma View Post
    What a diff. That looks like a whole lot of work!
    It is a ton of work, I was forced into removing the interior when I started chasing the water leak and getting rid of the funky smelling padding. Once it's all in from of you and you can work on it at table height, have nice "beverage" handy, and just plug away, it's not too bad. Doing it in the car would be really difficult. I stopped being able to bend that way a long time ago.

    From what I have read, it is much better if you're not starting with it in as rough a shape as mine. There are many posts where the leather has gone from dry and faded to almost new looking once it got oiled up and treated. I have an anthracite executive interior that is basically light silver at this point and is actually pretty attractive. I have started treating one piece to see how it's going to come out and it has darkened up quite a bit, and I think it is going to really look nice. For some reason this nutria interior didn't come around when it got the conditioner on it. I don't know if it was color damaged from sitting in a dusty place for a lot of years, the moistness from the leak, may be some bad treatments years ago; whatever it just didn't respond well and looks really splotchy. Thus the dye I think I am going to do. Have to say though it really feels great now that it's cleaned.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by lynnbilodeau View Post
    https://colorplus.com/

    My black buffalo interior has been redone with this line of products. Looks almost brand new. Not one flaw.

    I was so impressed, I redid my steering wheel and shift boot, which are just cow hide, and everyone thinks I bought a new wheel and boot.
    They are great to deal with. Now we'll see how their dye works.
    Last edited by espoe; 07-11-2018 at 04:46 AM.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    TX
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    1983/84/85 745i
    I will send you my car, let me know. LOL
    I make E23 parts.
    09/1983 745i (stolen spring '13 around Houston, TX Achatgruen on nutria buffalo. 8481080)
    10/1984 745i
    11/1984 745i
    11/1984 735i (10:1-265/6)
    Ford, MB, and GM round out the pack.



  16. #16
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    Dec 2017
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    Jackson Mi
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    E21, E30, E23
    Reviving and old thread to say thanks for suggesting leatherique. I picked up the 32oz and it made a huge difference, 35 year old leather is like new again and much cleaner.

    I didn't think to grab any pictures until I was almost done but you can see the side closest to the camera had been rejuvenated but not cleaned yet. The far side was rejuvenated and cleaned for a great finish.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

  17. #17
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    Looks great! Right now I have my car in the paint shop however the whole interior is here at the house. I'll be ordering the dye soon and see about getting mine back to snuff. As soon as I get the dye the thread will get revived again and I can't wait.

  18. #18
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    havertown pa
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    1985 745i
    Your my hero Eddie! God you have some drive. I love seeing the progress on this car! It would’ve been another ten years before I got any of this stuff on the old girl! I’m glad she’s in good hands. I can’t wait to see the car all spiffed up!

  19. #19
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    After much cleaning and oiling, the leather just wasn’t coming back properly. It was really blotchy, like it had mold spots is the best way I can describe it.

    Brought a leather expert to the house and basically I had no choice but to send it our for a Re-dye. Was hoping to bring back some of that buffalo rusticness but it’s going to at least look new.

    Pictures as soon as I get it back.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

  20. #20
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    Quadratechtown, PA
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    Looking forward to the results. Since the buffalo is dyed without leaving a topcoat of color, aniline dyed. The leather is more a painted product with that top layer of color. Wondering what the leather pro is going to do and how it comes out.

  21. #21
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    Got some of the pieces back today. Funny when I went to pick them up he had them spread out in the sun drying and I thought they looked ok but a little milky. Now that I’ve gotten them home and started mooching them up in a little less direct light, they look good.

    Now to figure out what to do with the wood. Seats come Tuesday.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

  22. #22
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    Killingworth, CT
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    '84 733i, 01 X5 00 750iL
    Oh man, they are pigmented. It's a shame to see the Buffalo hide completely covered up
    Steve H.

  23. #23
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    Yes I thought the same but there was some spotting in it that wasn't resolving. I think it was mildew or moisture damaged. At least that was what I looked like cleaned up. Also had a few gouged here and there so full treatment was the option. I have a full executive anthracite interior I thought about putting in but the back seat mounts would take modifying to make it work. It's going to look good in the car, just not that original-ish ambiance I was hoping for so it will be a little more rest-mod than I thought.
    Last edited by espoe; 11-25-2018 at 08:56 PM.

  24. #24
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    So continuing with this the more I look at the nutria interior, the more it’s not sitting right with me. It looks good but it looks more like Ford LTD good. Smooth, even, pigmented as Steven says, and just blah. Loses it’s vintage edge. It’s more than usable just not something I am excited about putting back in a car I have gone this far with.

    Just so happens I have a donor car in the drive with an anthracite buffalo interior that is in really good condition. The carpet is also really good and I have all of the Blue interior trim pieces. Last time I actually had the car operational was 5 years ago and everything worked.

    The only flaws are the gray is faded but I think this one is a prime candidate for oil rejuvenation or just living with the patina. The rear headrest are hard but not split so I wold hope they would respond to the oils. The lone flaws are at the tops of each rear seat on the inside corner, the stitching has split in about the size of a quarter on each. I am think the interior guy, a good one, could work a solution. And like any other vintage leather seat, the drivers armrest need to be recovered. I will post pics of it later after I get off this plane.

    The carpet in the donor car is in good shape and I even have a new gray set in a box I never opened.

    My question is around the fitting and the wiring. I know the seats will go back there, I see the top hook it would need and I think that’s easily doable. The bolts that go through the back are there already. The bottom front mounts in the same holes as the existing seat. Not sure about the rear mounts for the bottoms.

    As as far as wiring, the recliners would need to have a place to plug in to their switches but I have the harness. I have the rear radio control, harness, and a matching front unit though I don’t know if either work.

    I replaced the cracked nutria dash with a crack free black one a while back. I am really starting to like this idea and am looking to see if there are any things I am not thinking about, or installing things I would need to consider.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

  25. #25
    Join Date
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    The Buffalo Nutria looks good in the correct color car, when it is new or well maintained over its life. I can see how it can become less than impressive as it ages, fades and wears.

    The Leather Nutria is fine as it is just like any of the other leather interiors, a painted color on the leather. But this is a different color completely. Good for my gazellenbeige car which would also look good in Buffalo but I've got what I've got and I'm sticking with it as it is in good shape.

    Your plan seems like a good way to go if the black buffalo comes back in good shape.

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