What fluid type and procedures are you guys using for GM and ZF automatic transmissions?
After doing a lot of research and reading, it seems common to change the fluid at least twice consecutively - some even recommend three consecutive fluid changes in order to fully cycle out the old fluid from the torque converter and in the valve body. With this in mind, it is not very cost effective to do three changes with $150 worth of fluid each time.
I've read a lot of accounts of guys in the E46/E39 world using Valvoline Maxlife ATF which meets several BMW specifications including:
BMW 7045E, ETL 8072B, LA2634, LT71141 which as a result covers both spec for the GM and ZF auto transmissions (depending on which one your E39 has).
Of course, there's also the group that says if it's shifting fine, don't touch the original fill of lifetime fluid - it will just cause problems.
So what do you guys say?
I've posted this video for discussion as well:
Video link: https://youtu.be/CTTwF8sjQWc
I replaced with AMSOIL over 120k back and haven't had any mechanical issues at all. I currently have a Trans Fail-Safe but with a P0720 code so it's most likely an input/output speed sensor or solenoid issue. IMHO, I believe that most any fluid that meets the specs for your specific model will work fine...
Last edited by ViolinARC; 04-16-2018 at 08:47 PM.
'00 540iA Sport w/235k+ Original TCG's, Vanos and transmission.*Trans failure at 244k+...FS Now
Amsoil
The decision whether to change the AT fluid is one that I considered for quite a while. My '99 has the GM tranny (Dexron III) but had never been changed. I finally decided to do it (at 102k miles / 17 years). The old fluid was a darker red, but didn't appear burnt. The internals of the transmission looked clean although there was some gunk in the pan and stuck to the magnet. I used the Maxlife and did a drain and fill with a new filter. A month or so later did a drain and fill. Everything seems fine but I wasn't having any issues before.
I haven't heard of anyone that has used the Valvoline product and had issues. BTW, the hardest part of the job was getting the pan off and carefully scraping the plasticized gasket off the housing - you don't want to gouge the metal. Scraping with a small piece of plexiglass/polycarbonate seems to be a safe method.
Thought about using Maxlife, it gets rave reviews in the Audi DIY community (same ZF transmission, 5HP24), but Pentosin ATF1 was reasonable enough from Amazon I went with it since I was doing a drain, replace filter, and fill. Also used a BMW filter and o-ring.
Thanks for the feedback, haven't heard of using Amsoil - did you have the GM or ZF?
Another verified for Amsoil. Did you have the GM or ZF?
Thanks for sharing the details in your response - very valuable here for those reading. Great to hear the Maxlife worked well for you too. The plastic scraper is a good tip as well, and the filter kit comes with new bolts these days.
Thanks for the feedback. It looks like the Pentosin is currently about $52 on amazon for a 5L container (1.32 gallons). The Maxlife one gallon container is $17.
If you were to change your fluid at least twice, it would come out to under $100 using Maxlife for both changes. Using the Pentosin for two changes would come out to just over $200. So not a huge difference.
ZF here...
'00 540iA Sport w/235k+ Original TCG's, Vanos and transmission.*Trans failure at 244k+...FS Now
I use Amsoil ATF.
My thread:
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...on-t-Think-So!
Second thread:
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...*-***!-Part-II
I think you would be fine with the Valvoline Max Life stuff.
Last edited by Jason5driver; 04-18-2018 at 02:38 PM.
Looking for an E39 belly pan , passenger front inner fender liner …
Nice work keeping it up. Would you ever replace it with a non-E39? They're just great cars. Kind of obsessed. (that's why we're all here isn't it?)
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Thanks for adding that data point.
Now who else has used the Maxlife?
Definitely change it. The "DON'T DISTURB THE DIRT!" theories are bull poop... if your tranny condition was that fragile then it was gonna poop out any second anyway. 95% chance the fluid change improves function and extends life. 5% change some freak thing happens where a 'dirt seal' comes loose or something clogs during the change. (Actually I believe 98.9% is more like it but then guys are all gonna pop out of the woodwork with their "but this thing happened to my cousins girlfriend's mother for sure I swear its true it happens all the time..." so I'll throw a 5% bone... )
Dunno about the maxlife. Sounds good, maybe its great. But don't short-change the BMW fluid. It always feels good to get somnething different on the instinct to 'make things even better!' but the factory trans fluids are very high quality. Not saying don't use an aftermarket (I have Redline and RP in my manuals right now...) just sayin'... the BMW fluid is supposed to be very good too.
If you have the money time and patience for a double change that'd be great but I think you'll get a lot of the results from just the first one. I'd suggest judge the stench and appearance of the old oooze to make the call on whether to go for a 2nd change. If its stuper stinky and nasty coming out of there then maybe indeed you want to do the 2nd one after a month or so of driving. In addition to diluting the remaining amount of old fluid you couldn't drain out of the TC, the super magic additive pixie dust will then have a chance to work its magic and loosen up sludge and crap and you'll get more cleaning if you run it for a while before dumping it.
Also follow all the instructos on the change procedure. Even pros can underfill the ZF (needs to be the right temp, run through gears up in the air, etc. etc. - real PITA honestly) by a little. Been there seen that back when I actually had an auto...
2003 M3CicM6 TiAg
2002 540iT Sport Vortech S/C 6MT LSD TiAg
2008 Audi A3 2.0T DSG (the daily beater)
2014 BMW X1 xDrive28i (wifemobile)
Former:
1985 MB Euro graymarket 300SL
1995.5 Audi S6 Avant (utility/winter billetturbobattlewagen)
This thread helped me out, I want to share that the filter and fluid change made a noticeable difference. No more rough 2nd to 1st downshifts.
Now they are seamless but with the occasional much tamed down version of the downshifts before.
Prior to the change, upshifts 1-5 were exceptional with proper TC lockup, still is. Problem was that the 2nd to 1st downshift best described rough/jerky.
This occured all the time after the transmission reached operating temperature. Otherwise smooth 2nd to 1st downshifts at cold startup.
The "lifetime" fluid must've dissipated/leaked over time and was not at the proper level anymore.
Correct me if I'm wrong as I'm no expert and the more info I know the better. Thanks much appreciated.
- 2002 540iaT, 156K original fluid had the look and consistency of used motor oil
- ZF A5S40Z Green label Transmission
- 6,7 quarts redline D4 at mt fluid
- mann filter
- I plan on doing another filter and fluid change in a few thousand miles with new replacement filler/drain plugs
"Lifetime" fill is a crock. It means they expect it to last beyond both the warranty period and beyond the ownership of the original buyer. It doesn't mean it doesn't get dirty and changing the fluid doesn't prolong the life of it. If you've ever been inside a auto box you'd understand why fluid changes are important. Clutches wear and the fluid gets gritty. Grit between the clutches isn't what it was designed for.
Anyway, I obsess over the right ATF as much as anyone, especially since nobody I know of has ever definitively said what the difference is and why. But at the same time, I don't recall any threads about using the wrong stuff and having any issues. And I have at times seen improvement in operation after a change(s). However I wouldn't bother to change the filter again if you just changed it. While it's not bad practice to change it at least once, the filters I've seen haven't really gotten dirty. Maybe 100K later just to make sure, but if it's recently been changed it's good to go. FWIW I use Petrosin in my ZF box, but that's not saying any of the others aren't just as good or better, it's just that it's rated for it and I'm comfortable with it.
98 328is
02 525ita
80 528i
81 528ia
and decades of owning and driving BMWs
A list of ATFs for both the GM and ZF.
https://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1125083
How I do a full ATF fluid change using the cooler lines.
https://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1240813
Need a DME or EGS update?
https://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1081716
Coding 530i after AT->MT Swap
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...ter-AT-MT-Swap
Pentosil ATF 1 Synthetic -- works for all the above trannies and power steering too.
Agreed, I did this to my last e39 zf automatic at 100k. No issues, just for preventative maintenance. It was rewarding that it helped out this time around with the touring. Not having to change that filter again will save me time. I’ll do a p/s flush, intake manifold/tb gasket replacement instead.
Also there’s an oil leak I need to address as well. Dropping the pan, inspect for debris, change valve cover gaskets, and inspect oil filter housing.
I believe it’s leaking slightly at the rear main seal too. But I’ll leave it be till I’m ready to drop the transmission.
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thanks, power steering fluid change is next on the list!
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