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Thread: Secondary Air Pump

  1. #1
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    Secondary Air Pump

    1997 z3 2.8
    5 speed
    no engine mods
    157xxx miles

    Hey guys so two days ago I went to put gas in the Z, after, I had to make a phone call, so being the good Christian boy I am I decided to park my car while I made my phone call. After a brief 5 min conversation, I was ready to start her up and drive away when I heard something that sounded like a vacuum cleaner running, someone was in fact vacuum cleaning my engine, I was sure of it. So I open the hood and I notice the sound, very loud, coming from the pass side, the secondary air pump had been running since I parked the car for my conversation.

    I decide to try to start the car and it just cranks but there is no ignition. I try again, same thing, meanwhile I can still hear the pump. After about a minute of crank, ignition off, crank, ignition off, crank, the car finally starts. Idles fine, no problems. I hesitantly shut off the car but now I don't hear the pump running anymore. Try to start the car and I comes to life like normal.

    Fast forward to today, as I'm coming to a red light, I slow down and throw her in neutral, RPMS crash and the car dies. I try to start her back up and she just cranks and cranks away. This time I don't hear the pump running. Throw my hazards on, and just keep cranking, ignition off, crank ignition off and so on. After about 60 seconds of this, she starts. Made it home with no further mishaps. She had died on me once before over a month ago when I was coming to a stop but started right up and I kinda forgot about it.

    Question time, could the secondary air pump be causing the car to die and not want to start. As far as I know it's only for emission purposes and should not affect driveability. Are these two issues not related. I have to tested anything yet, what's the best place to start.

    Cheers guys.
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  2. #2
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    When it doesn't want to start, do you even have the check engine light come on? Sounds a bit like a power supply issue, or a short.
    -Abel

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  3. #3
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    No check engine light, no battery light, just normal cranking then starts and idles and drives just fine.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafa L View Post
    1997 z3 2.8... could the secondary air pump be causing the car to die and not want to start. As far as I know it's only for emission purposes and should not affect driveability. Are these two issues not related....
    I would not think the SAP affects the ability to start.
    I am glad BMW did not give my Z3 a SAP, (or a mechanical fan either).
    Last edited by Vintage42; 01-15-2018 at 09:53 AM.
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  5. #5
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    Abel was looking for if the MIL comes in before and while cranking. If it truly does not, you have a computer problem.



    Check the ground point on the rear of the right strut tower.

  6. #6
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    Honestly I have not noticed, I assumed it did, I will check if the CEL lights up when ignition is switched to "on". It just rained torrential-like here in LA for 24hours, the roadie has a couple of leaks and the interior got wet, to what extent I don't know.

    Is that ground point a known failure point?
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  7. #7
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    The check needs to be done while it's broken.


    Ground point is only a problem when it's been disturbed at some previous point.

  8. #8
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    I see, I will remember to check next time she acts up again.
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  9. #9
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    My SAP on my 2.8 sounds like a vacuum cleaner as well...figured I'd replace it when it dies, but it won't die. It's never affected startup.
    Nathan in Denver

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  10. #10
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    So I went out this morning, turn the key to on and these are all the lights I get. No CEL under regular conditions, car started up just fine

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  11. #11
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    Update, I believe this is gonna be something really dumb, it feels like a loose connection somewhere. I was driving to get some parts for another car I'm working on and I forgot to swerve around two back to back manholes, about 30 feet apart from each other. There was a sudden and abrupt jerk, as if the car lost all power for half a second, and it did it twice as I hit each manhole.

    The car has brand new(less than 3 months old) Bilsteins and H&Rs and LA roads have taken a toll. Checking the battery connections first, will report back.

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  12. #12
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    Update, because of my hooning, the battery was loose since the battery has "some" space to move around, the copper wires were being pulled from the terminal because of the weight of the battery. I really hope that is the end of that...

    however, anything I can do to test the secondary air pump since it's showing signs of going out... ?
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  13. #13
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    The air pump stuck on either because the relay failed and miraculously fixed itself, or because the DME crashed because of a power surge and stuck holding the relay engaged. In other words the pump was a symptom, not a fault.

    I have a problem with a battery connection that is supposedly bad enough to take out the DME but is good enough to support a solid minute of cranking. But whatever.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf900rkw View Post
    The air pump stuck on either because the relay failed and miraculously fixed itself, or because the DME crashed because of a power surge and stuck holding the relay engaged. In other words the pump was a symptom, not a fault.

    I have a problem with a battery connection that is supposedly bad enough to take out the DME but is good enough to support a solid minute of cranking. But whatever.
    I hear you, I will keep my eye on the connections and see what the future holds, maybe the car will eventually catch fire, whoknows?
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafa L View Post
    Update, because of my hooning, the battery was loose since the battery has "some" space to move around, the copper wires were being pulled from the terminal because of the weight of the battery. I really hope that is the end of that...

    however, anything I can do to test the secondary air pump since it's showing signs of going out... ?
    What is hooning?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bingley View Post
    What is hooning?
    From Wikipedia -

    Hoon is a term primarily used in Australia and New Zealand to describe the act of driving a vehicle at high speed and pulling manoeuvres likely to cause excitement and cheers from onlookers. Hoon activities can include speeding, burnouts, doughnuts or screeching tyres.
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  17. #17
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    You might want to replace that battery pigtail if the wire is able to pull out if your current one. Intermittents can be a bitch they always fail when you're least prepared

  18. #18
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    I looked at the wiring diagrams and now have a handle on it. There are two wires in the positive post clamp. The DME and friends are on the smaller. The starter and most of the car is on the larger. You likely had the connection problem on the smaller lead.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafa L View Post
    Update, because of my hooning, the battery was loose since the battery has "some" space to move around, the copper wires were being pulled from the terminal because of the weight of the battery. I really hope that is the end of that...

    however, anything I can do to test the secondary air pump since it's showing signs of going out... ?
    Your battery should have a way to be secured so it doesn't move - not sure how that looks in that year of roadster, on a non-M 2.8 coupe it has a little "wedge" that rests against the bottom lip of the battery and gets bolted down from the top. It seems like a stupid pointless thing, until this happens

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  20. #20
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    The wedge is there and the battery doesn't move for the most part, but there are fractions of an inch of play, and that was enough to over time pull at the positive terminal. I will have to wedge something next to the battery to eliminate 100% of movement.
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