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Thread: What is your Oil temp?

  1. #26
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    Funny this was posted... about 4 days ago my stupid parts store thermostat which I put in while waiting for a new Wahler unit to come in failed closed. (I at some point decided to wait and see if the parts store one would actually fail.... SURPRISE!) The car got hot but did not overheat... I think. I pulled over the second the temp light came on.

    In any case, I had never payed close attention to the to the temp gauges on regular drives... and am noticing that after about 30 mins of 70MPH in 5th the oil temp is getting up to 230, ambient air temp here is ~50deg. New t-stat is 88c (which is hotter than the part store one) Concerning or not? (bone stock S52)

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ring Rat View Post
    Funny this was posted... about 4 days ago my stupid parts store thermostat which I put in while waiting for a new Wahler unit to come in failed closed. (I at some point decided to wait and see if the parts store one would actually fail.... SURPRISE!) The car got hot but did not overheat... I think. I pulled over the second the temp light came on.

    In any case, I had never payed close attention to the to the temp gauges on regular drives... and am noticing that after about 30 mins of 70MPH in 5th the oil temp is getting up to 230, ambient air temp here is ~50deg. New t-stat is 88c (which is hotter than the part store one) Concerning or not? (bone stock S52)
    That was typical of my '99 M Rdstr (bone-stock, except cat-back SS exh) when I had a day job back in Ohio; actually, I was probably only 20 min at 70 mph, as total commute was barely over half-hour.

    Adding the S-54 filter/cooler brought the oil temperature down to 210*F during routine highway drives.

  3. #28
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    Yeah, the bottom line is that the S52 really should have come with an oil cooler, and without one the oil runs hot--meaning the engine runs hot. Swapping in an S54 filter housing and cooler is a very basic modification that will improve engine cooling and lubrication.

  4. #29
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    Just wanted to keep everyone in the loop about my oil temp issue. I had the engine purged and they told me the oil cooler cooler was operating just fine. After a SMALL detour on the drive home, I saw that the temp climbed back up to 230/240. Next step will be performing this oil analysis...

  5. #30
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    Good morning everyone. I’m requesting a special call out for anyone owning a Z3 with an S54 motor (‘01/‘02) to do me a huge favor! Next time you take your car out on the road and it is up to operating temp, could you please snap a picture of your OIL TEMPERATURE GAUGE. And post to this thread. I’m trying to gather as much info as possible to figure my problem out. Please include outside temp and driving conditions if possible. I’m going first...

    About 80 degrees outside highway speed.

  6. #31
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    I still think thats (way) too hot for that situation. I havent seen over 210 this year with a refreshed cooling system at the same speeds in 110 degree weather

    Is your cooling system ok? Coolant and oil are both at proper levels?

    Oil filter housing thermostat broken maybe?

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  7. #32
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    Mine is steady below 200 once it is warmed up. Out side temp doesn't matter. The only exception is when on the track and then it can get almost up to 260 for a short time. If you are at 260 with normal driving, you have an issue.

    Edit: Just noticed your outside temp gauge. If the outside temp is 80, then it has an issue too.
    Last edited by khammack; 06-21-2018 at 12:19 PM.
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  8. #33
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    I data log the oil temp on my 3.4L S54, running hard / high rpms on the track with a separate oil cooler and fans it runs around 240 F once up to temp and stays pretty consistent. For a track car this is reasonable. But for a street car under normal operating conditions I would expect to see much lower.

    A spun bearing will cause elevated oil temps but this usually is accompanied by lower oil pressure. The first thing I'd do is check the oil pressure on you engine and see what it's doing.
    Last edited by CMM3; 06-21-2018 at 01:08 PM.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by BimmerBreaker View Post
    I still think thats (way) too hot for that situation. I havent seen over 210 this year with a refreshed cooling system at the same speeds in 110 degree weather

    Is your cooling system ok? Coolant and oil are both at proper levels?

    Oil filter housing thermostat broken maybe?
    Coolant level is fine. Just changed oil about 200 miles ago. Oil level is still full. Coolant gauge is functioning properly

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by khammack View Post
    Mine is steady below 200 once it is warmed up. Out side temp doesn't matter. The only exception is when on the track and then it can get almost up to 260 for a short time. If you are at 260 with normal driving, you have an issue.

    Edit: Just noticed your outside temp gauge. If the outside temp is 80, then it has an issue too.
    Haha! Yes that outside temp gauge has been broken for about 5 years! Good catch

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by BimmerBreaker View Post
    I still think thats (way) too hot for that situation. I havent seen over 210 this year with a refreshed cooling system at the same speeds in 110 degree weather

    Is your cooling system ok? Coolant and oil are both at proper levels?

    Oil filter housing thermostat broken maybe?
    My mechanic is changing the temp/ oil level sensor. Hopefully this is the fix. Oil cooler operation has been checked and is functioning.

  12. #37
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    Would be odd for a sensor to go bad and report a feasible temp like that. Normally when they fail they report 0, maximum, or the needle will occasionally wander from the true reading to max (then hitting it gets it back in place) depending on what failed. Not impossible, but if it rises slowly from 0 to that temp as you drive, Id suspect thats the real temp... Throwing $$ at random parts will get $$$$ quickly.

    Oil cooler is "working" - how did they test that? Even if both lines and the cooler are operating perfectly, if the thermostat in the oil filter housing isnt working it can prevent proper flow into the oil cooler in the first place.

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  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by BimmerBreaker View Post
    Would be odd for a sensor to go bad and report a feasible temp like that. Normally when they fail they report 0, maximum, or the needle will occasionally wander from the true reading to max (then hitting it gets it back in place) depending on what failed. Not impossible, but if it rises slowly from 0 to that temp as you drive, Id suspect thats the real temp... Throwing $$ at random parts will get $$$$ quickly.

    Oil cooler is "working" - how did they test that? Even if both lines and the cooler are operating perfectly, if the thermostat in the oil filter housing isnt working it can prevent proper flow into the oil cooler in the first place.
    Not sure how the oil cooler operation was checked and properly diagnosed that it is in fact working. I trust my mechanic. I’m not sure what’s the proper way to go about the fix! Starting with the inexpensive things first, then moving forward!???

  14. #39
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    Correct way is to diagnose the problem and fix that

    For reference, I drove my S54 again today and on the highway it never went above 210
    Last edited by BimmerBreaker; 06-21-2018 at 04:42 PM.

  15. #40
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    I have a s52 with oil cooler (aftermarket), but very close to s54 cooler's capacity. And it usually stays just below 200 +/- range in normal fwy driving (an hour). Before the cooler, it was in 230-240's.

    I'm not sure if anyone already mentioned. Perhaps, do you think thermostat in the oil filter housing might have something to do (i.e., froze in closed position) if you already checked the coolant system? Just 0.02
    Last edited by nevan; 06-21-2018 at 04:59 PM.
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  16. #41
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    Again guys thanks for your responses and ideas/ suggestions for possible solutions. It’s really great to have a community like this who is always willing to help out at a moments notice!
    -Russ

  17. #42
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    Ah, as much fun as cooling systems. You can not compare true S54 gauge readings with S52 gauges grafted to an S54 cooler setup. The S54 reads temps from the pan, effectively pre cooler temp. The S54 oil filter with mods/adapter to work with an S52 gauge reads the temp post cooler. This is why S52s with coolers seem to be rock steady at 200-205. That's the t-stat temp.

    My guess is your oil cooler thermostat is stuck open. While your guy probably thinks he tested the system, the odds are against the procedure and results being valid. I've been dealing with bypassing thermostats in automatics for 20+ years now, and they are VERY tricky to diagnose.

    Or your cooling system is not up to snuff. One sure fire way to send the oil temps screaming up is to have a small air pocket in the head. S54s aren't prone to this like the S52s, but it is still worth using the OBD2 data to verify correct operation.
    Last edited by rf900rkw; 06-21-2018 at 08:34 PM.


    /.randy

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf900rkw View Post
    Ah, as much fun as cooling systems. You can not compare true S54 gauge readings with S52 gauges grafted to an S54 cooler setup. The S54 reads temps from the pan, effectively pre cooler temp. The S54 oil filter with mods/adapter to work with an S52 gauge reads the temp post cooler. This is why S52s with coolers seem to be rock steady at 200-205. That's the t-stat temp.

    My guess is your oil cooler thermostat is stuck open. While your guy probably thinks he tested the system, the odds are against the procedure and results being valid. I've been dealing with bypassing thermostats in automatics for 20+ years now, and they are VERY tricky to diagnose.

    Or your cooling system is not up to snuff. One sure fire way to send the oil temps screaming up is to have a small air pocket in the head. S54s aren't prone to this like the S52s, but it is still worth using the OBD2 data to verify correct operation.
    I didn't know the the s54 oil temp sensor was located in different place. And that makes much more sense.

    For oil thermostat, is it the open or close that flows oil to the cooler unit (my apologies for such a novice question)?
    I think I might have understood it oppositely (which is probably incorrect). So I wanted to ask the expert.

    Thanks and always much appreciated, Randy!
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  19. #44
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    The oil thermostat is closed initially, so that the oil goes back into the engine. When it warms up enough the thermostat opens, allowing the oil to flow through the oil cooler before it goes back into the engine.

    Marty

  20. #45
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    Sorry, but no. The thermostat is a bypassing design, not a blocking one. The flow path to and from the cooler is always open. The thermostat bridges the two paths providing a bypass point. Thus the thermostat is open cold allowing the oil to loop through the bypass port, and closes hot to force the oil to take the long way home through the cooler. And like the cooling system, if things are working correctly the thermostat will be somewhere in the middle regulating state with some flow through the cooler, some through the bypass.

    Think of it as a capital A. The two legs on the bottom are the in and out, the top point is the cooler, and the crossbar is the thermostat.

    And this is why they are so damn difficult to diagnose. There will always be full oil pressure at the cooler. If you take a line loose, you will have oil gushing out. Gushing out of both sides of the connection. And since there is always some flow, even cold, there will be a temp gradient across the cooler. Thus looking for flow or doing temp measurements might make you think the system works, but they tests are not valid. The only way to test the system is with temp probes and an inline flow gauge. A flow gauge will require making a custom adapter, or cutting and splicing the cooler hose. Like I said, I've been dealing with these thermostats on transmissions for 20years. I have the flow gauge and have made many an adapter over the years. Diagnosing them is not a simple straight forward task.


    /.randy

  21. #46
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    @Randy, thanks so much for the explanation with details in comprehensible terms! I was able to follow and understand them And I stand corrected now!! - I knew I had gotten it wrong somehow when you mentioned the stuck open thermostat in your reply.
    Last edited by nevan; 06-23-2018 at 01:10 AM.
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  22. #47
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    Wow, in all my years I have never seen one that works this way! My apologies for putting out bad info, I just listed how every other one I have seen worked. This is interesting, because it relies on the added resistance of the oil cooler to make the bypass work.

    I will be more careful in the future; thanks, Randy.

    Marty

  23. #48
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    FWIW,
    my stock 99 S52 runs 230 in normal driving in NC weather
    my 2000 S52 with 3 row Mishimoto coolant radiator and Stewart water pump....runs the same. no difference before or after changes.
    while i was there, I drilled the head for an independent coolant temp sensor, and added an oil-pan drain plug temp sensor, as I am curious about my unbuffered coolant temp and the difference between measuring oil temp "up" and "down". haven 't hooked up gauges yet....

    lastly, my 91 E30 with 97 S50B30US swap runs oil at 180-190 for 20 years now. at VIR, it would hit 240 in spring/ summer / fall (no winter track time), as measured at the drain plug.

    my 89 E30 325is M20 track car runs the same temps as the 91, WITHOUT the factory oil cooler, measured at the drain plug. it is stripped down to around 2300 lbs.

  24. #49
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    I'm experiencing this same behavior. I've had the car for 5 years now, and the first three years it wouldn't ever go above 200 during normal driving. Last summer I started noticing the higher temps sometimes in hot weather, and this year it's been worse, even exceeding 200 in cool weather. Here's a photo I took yesterday after a 10 mile drive most of which is highway:
    IMG_20180626_151610.jpg

  25. #50
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    My car is still down at the shop. My mechanic was able to call in a favor to one of his friends who has an S54 M Coupe as well with similar mileage. He swapped oil coolers and that seems to have fixed the high temp. Will advise y’all when I get a final answer from him.

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