99 Fern Green - RSI Top Mount - BWs366 - 30-3300 Meth

[328iFun]

I just know I've installed cams in the past with the head on and didn't have any problems.

Hopefully he rotated crank slightly to lower pistons.


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[JPE36M3]

Best to email that over to jordan and have em take a look. or get em to log into team viewer and see the live logs.
also make sure your maf facing the correct way. i had my fab guy weld the bung in the wrong way and he didnt notice

UPDATE!: THE CAR RUNS! and finally it sounds like it should...

I made 1.0 lb of boost today and it felt damn good after all this work. cant wait to hear mid teens.

To Update everyone on the last few posts. no, theres no piston valve contact, I spun it a million times before I locked everything up... IROD and I slapped the cams in on a bench before installing if I was to install in the car yes, id pull the crank back just passed the chain tensioner..

Jordan came through today and worked with me for hours on this project. I realize its not the tuners job to diagnose hardware issues, but I spent a solid 3-4 days chasing my own ass around trying to figure this out and in this case calling Jordan was needed to confirm what was wrong. I still have lots to sort out but it was a combination of my throttle cables being to tight ( TP was 22% at idle ) and also a stuck ICV that needed cleaning (if your doing a build just take the time to clean this no matter what!). IN addition to this yes, the car was not adapting at ALL to any 02 sensors... we tried a few different 02 sensors that seemed to work fine when I was NA but didn't work now, regardless of the 02s being good or bad, Jordan sorted out an 02 that worked with his map or we figured out why the car wasn't adapting. Definitely happy with today and everythings moving along now. I have a decent amount of idling and light light drives now under the car so I retorqued the head and found 3-5 of the bolts out of 85lb spec, one was around 80lbs.. We did not do the 3 day sequence, we did it all in 3 stages in one evening so the original plan was; idling the car, change oil and retorque.


AFRS and -HG NUMBERs
Zero throttle 18+ AFR's with 18-20 -HG VAC (dead idle after a while maybe -17) / light throttle seeing 14-15's AFRS with 14-18 vac / medium throttle bounces to 11.5 and goes to 12.8-14's AFRS with 6-14 vac / no clue at heavy throttle - do these seem ok with a higher 1100 idle?


current issues:
I have a high idle issue now 1200-1400 after a light run, bounces a bit AFRS go up and down and then finally the idle tames to 1000.... is this normal? According to butters and Jordan the idle should "reset itself" after some daily driving and adaption taking place.. Im hoping this brings it down to a manageable 1000 or under... In the mean time im ordering a smoke tester so I can really see if I have a leak since soapy water and 30PSI isn't making it obvious enough for me to find. Clutch seems to be very grabby, im not used to this (Fx stage 4) I do like the engagement but it feels knotchy? like you can fee the pucs grabbing on a slow easy slip engagement? this normal? also I have no brakes.. NONE pedal is super hard with no feedback, I separated the clutch line from the clutch slave during the build to pull the transmission (didn't know you could let it hang aside) I purchased the motive power bleeder and bled the clutch slave, clean of air but DID NOT bleed the brakes. during the build the clutch line was left hanging down and did drip the tank lower then half full.. so im assuming I air in the brakes.



BUTTERZ has Put in some serious time helping me with diagnosing these issues, and thanks to this community for chiming in on all the thoughts and details a rookie builder like my self needs to learn. I started this build late November here it is first week of feb and things are rolling. got to say im happy..


ill get a video uploaded by tomorrow night of a drive. so hopefully I can get a better idea of what to dial in now if anything if the car can learn to bring the idle down on its own, I think total drive time now is still less then 5 minutes...

[JPE36M3]

also running lean from no 02 adaption can also make a car loose proper vacuum readings, correct?

- - - Updated - - -

Not really. The cam turns at half crank speed and while #1 is at TDC so is #6 but #6 is at overlap, both valve are partially open, and if the cam timing is bang on then we may only have 0.080” - 0.100” clearance depending on cam lift and piston valve relief depths. As the piston is approaching TDC it is chasing the exhaust valve and the intake valve is chasing the piston on its way back down. If your cam is rotated 30° from where it should be which doesn’t seem like much,, that’s the same as 60° of crank rotation. That’s all it would take to contact the valves during assembly and bend them.

we installed them with all the pistons dropped (crank rotated way back) and #1 lobes pointing at each other like they would be with cam blocks in

[chikinhed]

Definitely put a bunch more miles on it. If that doesn’t help sort it out then the ICV could still be sticking open a bit. What did you do with the evap line to the intake manifold? Try removing the lines from the intake for the BOV and meth controller and suck on the tubes; you shouldn’t get any air from them.

Say “Hi” to Rod for me, you are lucky to have him helping you on your build.

[JPE36M3]

Definitely put a bunch more miles on it. If that doesn’t help sort it out then the ICV could still be sticking open a bit. What did you do with the evap line to the intake manifold? Try removing the lines from the intake for the BOV and meth controller and suck on the tubes; you shouldn’t get any air from them.

Say “Hi” to Rod for me, you are lucky to have him helping you on your build.

I deleted all of the emissions stuff, I think I put screws in all the holes for these items like the old FPR vacuum port and then filled them with marine epoxy.. so with those vacuum numbers does it still sound like I have issues or a leak? I think at this point ill need a smoke machine.


ill check the vac ports, thinking about this... I haven't checked is my meth unit in the back of the car under a boost leak test, hmmmmm thinking about it im not using it right now and I have the vacuum hooked up to it... so, if the machine is turned off I wonder if this is the source of my issue.


Im hoping that simple driving will help dial in the car, I can live with a 900-950 rpm idle but right now it sucks at 1200+..

[328iFun]

I deleted all of the emissions stuff, I think I put screws in all the holes for these items like the old FPR vacuum port and then filled them with marine epoxy.. so with those vacuum numbers does it still sound like I have issues or a leak? I think at this point ill need a smoke machine.


ill check the vac ports, thinking about this... I haven't checked is my meth unit in the back of the car under a boost leak test, hmmmmm thinking about it im not using it right now and I have the vacuum hooked up to it... so, if the machine is turned off I wonder if this is the source of my issue.


Im hoping that simple driving will help dial in the car, I can live with a 900-950 rpm idle but right now it sucks at 1200+..

You don't need to go out and spend money on an actual machine (unless you want too)

I made one for like 5 bucks awhile back. You can to if you have everything lying around.

Just find a can or something similar that has a top to it, screw in a compressor fitting into the can so you can attach air, a regulator to control air pressure, and a black and mild/ some cheap cigar. Drop lit cigar into can, attach compressor to can, attach another rubber hose from can to brake booster port, apply pressure.

Worked great

I've been battling vac leaks for awhile now. If all else fails just have tuner richen up the AFR at idle to smooth it out a bit and forget about it if you can't find them

Ive tried 4 different manifolds on my car it exhibits the same symptoms. When warm rough idle when the O2 starts to pull fuel to stoich. A sensor somewhere isn't working but I haven't gotten a code for it yet. I'll eventually have my tuner richen up the mix at idle or leave o2 disconnected as it idles great that way. O2 is only used at idle anyway.

[SilburE36]

I’ll throw out a real simple idea:

Check the throttle cable bell crank stop screw at the TB. When I put my motor back together with a new throttle cable, I had about a 1250 rpm idle and a high idle code. I backed that sucker out all the way and it fixed it. Cleared the code and it didn’t come back. It’s like a 3 or 4 mm Allen screw.




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[bmw328m52]

You should be at 18-21 -Hg at idle depending on weather. Fully warm idle should be 20-21 though if around 1k rpm. When I had a vac leak at ICV after maf, I was experiencing 16-18afrs out of boost(partial throttle) and then rich condition in boost.

[328iFun]

You should be at 18-21 -Hg at idle depending on weather. Fully warm idle should be 20-21 though if around 1k rpm. When I had a vac leak at ICV after maf, I was experiencing 16-18afrs out of boost(partial throttle) and then rich condition in boost.

I think this may slghtly different for everyone. Depending on location, etc...

I see 18-19 hg when fully warm

M52 with s52 cams

21 seems high

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[bmw328m52]

I think this may slghtly different for everyone. Depending on location, etc...

I see 18-19 hg when fully warm

M52 with s52 cams

21 seems high

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I guess my point is you should be on the higher range of vacuum when fully warm..I've seen people at 21 with s52 motor first hand and the car runs perfect. I am m52 with s52 also and our vac at idle always seems slightly lower.

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[JPE36M3]

I guess my point is you should be on the higher range of vacuum when fully warm..I've seen people at 21 with s52 motor first hand and the car runs perfect. I am m52 with s52 also and our vac at idle always seems slightly lower.

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thanks guys. im stuck working right now away from the car for a week or so im hoping between the smoke test and the idle screw OR just driving he damn thing it will drop to 1000 with higher HG... I could have sworn Jordan said the idle should be 900 right now which its not, but the computer has only had 5 minutes of driving on it, if I don't have leaks then maybe this is just how my car is?

[JOutterbridge]

Try patience and the idle screw first. Mine was 1300 for a few days after doing work. I cleaned the IACV and slowly adjusted throttle screw so my load at idle (tp% ) was around 11. Now I idle at 877. It's been fine since. Also my vacuum stays between 18 and 21 depending on the temp of the car/engine

[SCapelo]

Mine took a week or two of driving and worked itself out. I pulled my hair out chasing vac/boost leaks and eventually just dealt with it until it figured itself out. I think It just needed to get acquainted with boost lol

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[328iFun]

thanks guys. im stuck working right now away from the car for a week or so im hoping between the smoke test and the idle screw OR just driving he damn thing it will drop to 1000 with higher HG... I could have sworn Jordan said the idle should be 900 right now which its not, but the computer has only had 5 minutes of driving on it, if I don't have leaks then maybe this is just how my car is?

Man that sucks!

Spending all time/money and then cant drive. Its only a week though you'll be good

Im starting to learn to live with the few imperfections my E36 has and manage them accordingly.

But yeah, your car probably needs to adapt

[Chaz17]

Hey man glad to see the build is up and running!

Another quick couple of questions for you - which aeromotive FPR did you go with and where did you order from? and what wastegate & bov springs are you running and how did you decide on them? I'm not sure how to decide on them before the fact.

[JPE36M3]

Sorry for no update guys im still stuck working my ass off right now running my guide services here in Washington, once it starts pissing again I can go home and get some miles on this thing and hopefully some adaption!



J


not a boosted top mount e36 m3 but it is the largest steelhead in Washington state this year and possibly for a few years - I probably have another week.5 before im able to run the car!!! its killing me!

[Mklock]

That is a big ass steelie. I like doing walleye fishing and smallmouth. Grats on that catch though.

[E36Mylo]

Nice build. Love the green e36s

[Darth Maul]

I remember going to your house back in like 05-06 for Euro Nights for a pre-meet haha

[JPE36M3]

IM BACK


steelhead season is done and in the books, normally I get lots of breaks due to weather but this season was hell on earth 3 months straight... oh well lots of cash.

after countless calls to BUTTERz (thank you for everything) and Jordan who has worked with me numerous times with remote log in sessions to dial in the car. we are close.

car is running, I got a lot done the last few days, found out my lean issue was a hole in my brake booster from a late night trying to rush my meth installation I drilled into the booster causing extreme lean VAC conditions. this would explain why a boost leak test didn't find this because of the check valve installed wouldn't allow positive pressure (The test) to check the booster itself. This is funny, now my issue is extreme rich conditions due to no lambda engagement, ive replaced my 02 sensor, let the car warm up to 200+ to hopefully get the 02 to trim the fuel down and still no data/percentages so basically the car idles great 14.5's 14.7's in open loop and as soon as the car his closed loop it goes way rich 11's 12's..... under normal driving the car is 14's 13's, under medium throttle the car goes 12's 13's and .2bar and under the car hits 11's and 12's if im getting on it.. my 02 system is basically non-existent.

IMG_0117 by joe princen, on FlickrIMG_0118 by joe princen, on Flickr

[JPE36M3]

butterz told me used m3 boosterz normally don't fail so I sourced one off ebay.. 80$


good old bench bleeding the slave




moving the ABS pump and cracking all those lines was a PITA, I wouldn't wish it on anyone...





idle condition In closed loop, no lambda, its like the 02 system isn't working and trimming.. (02 is brand new NTK)





a few other things I redid, I pulled my manifold and re-enforced my maxpsi hoses so they wouldn't suck shut under vacuum, I built coils using welders rod around a 12mm socket and stuck them inside the hoses letting the ICV float freely outside of its OEM position. wish I would have done this before installing the engine. upgraded my interior lighting fuse to 15A because all the new gauges popped the 10A fuse. ALL my VDO oil temp, oil pressure and water temp are working well now.


clutch engagement is dialed! fx stage 3 is a rough enagegment clutch at first but its smoothing out now and feels great at 100 miles on the car, ive kept the boost and driving under 2PSI and 4000 rpms while breaking in this clutch, I have no idea what the car can do yet. I evidently have a 3psi spring installed in the car, im hoping truboost will let me run 10-12psi once the clutch reaches 300 miles of city driving.



I just need to figure out this fuel trim issue and the car is set! daily driving sure is fun, my god does it get attention.. Next week I have a paint booth appointment and ill be installing the GTR hood and front bumper with GTcup lip. Hopefully will have this fuel issue sorted..

[JPE36M3]

IMG_0949 by joe princen, on Flickr




and this is a new 02 sensor after a 30 minute drive....

[Chaz17]

Good to see you back at it man. Car looks great and seems like its just the last few little kinks that need to be ironed out!

[JPE36M3]

(click for video) still braking in the clutch, cant really get on her, ive kept it under 2psi and 4000 rpms city driving for a while now im at 150 miles, car is really rich at idle but RK has some log files and we are going to tweak the idle today. heres going up a hill hardly any throttle.



man it feels good to hear that whistle even under normal driving conditions

[328iFun]

that low load/ rpm turbo sound is great

I ran my meth reference line though the hole near the brake pedal has a rubber grommet on it and then through the frame hole on the bottom of the car. No problems with it