Fuel but no spark

[Support528]

On that car, this would be a good place to start.

Alright lets see what tomorrow brings when I get the new sensor.

Today I tried cleaning the connector since it had a lot of oil and residue on it. Still a no go on the rpm signal. Also pulled the sensor and had oil on it. My front main is leaking so I'm sure the rear is too. What a mess this car is

[bmwdirtracer]

I hear an echo....

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...9#post29852479

Deja vu all over again.

[shogun]

2 threads merged

[bmwdirtracer]

Aw, you ruined the fun, Erich!

You know Scott's in Japan right now? (Sorry, don't know where....)

[shogun]

Yes, I know he is in Japan, but this time he cannot visit me like last time, his trip is mainly south of Tokyo. He asked me to take a bit care of his forums, Mayorchuck asked me to merge these 2 threads

[bmwdirtracer]

I was just kidding about ruining the fun....you always take good care of the forums, my friend.

I've heard that there is a volcano erupting in the south, but I have no details. I hope that it's not of danger to anyone, Is it in a populous area?

[shogun]

That is abt 1000km south from where I live, the Japan Meteorological Agency has raised the volcanic alert level from 2 to 3 on a scale of 5. Level 3 warns people to not approach the volcano.
https://japantoday.com/category/nati...4-cities-towns
http://www.jma.go.jp/en/volcano/

[Support528]

- - - Updated - - -

IF the cranksensor works well then mission complete

[MIKYZZ4]

Crankshaft Position Sensor supplies the signal to the DME,
that should have been the vital clue,
hope you replace it with OE or OEM,
If not you may be chasing new anomalies.

[Support528]

Yeah the crank sensor didn't work. The battery is at a flat 12.0 volts now and my scan tool can't even stay connected while cranking. Going to charge the battery up then try again.
Codes that I'm getting
P1189
P1188
P1250
P1183

then another P1250 after the 1183. In that order. Kinda weird it shows the same code twice.

i pushed the car down a hill to try to get it to start and nothing. Still no signal from the cranksensor because I have the live data right in front of me and the rpm stays at 0 while cranking the car. After pushing the car around I did get the codes, P12FF and C1000.

I went ahead and charged the battery back up and nothing, tried using the 30amp boost feature and still nothing. I tried using the jump start connections on the engine and setting my battery charger to cranking amps. Spins but no start, no spark, smell fuel out of the tail pipe. Thought the engine may be flooded so first I pulled a coil and a plug to test for spark, no spark. I then took all the coils out and spark plugs and let it air out. I tried again to start after this and nothing.

At the crankshaft sensor connection, when I probe pin 1 and 3 I get 12v. Probing pin 2 and 3, gives me about 4.9. Pin 2 and 3 yields 7.4 volts. Continuity is next.

[Support528]

Can I check the crankshaft sensor output voltage while manually turning the engine over? I know it needs to be a fluctuation between 0-5v.

I read something on pelican parts that said how to do it but I lost the link.

[MIKYZZ4]

Really bad move.
Now, if you replace it, and the car still doesn't start, you STILL don't know whether the crank sensor is the cause.....so you keep looking elsewhere, spending much more time, and much more money.
I highly recommend that you return the garbage part, and buy a real one, from a reputable BMW specialist supplier.

Crankshaft Position Sensor supplies the signal to the DME,
that should have been the vital clue,
hope you replace it with OE or OEM,
If not you may be chasing new anomalies.

You're really just spinning your wheels with a cheap aftermarket crank sensor. Some will work sporadically and others not at all. Cam and crank sensors do not always throw a P code from an OBD II scanner.

I've seen this time and time again in the E38 forum.

Have you heeded this general consensus concerning replacement sensors?
Purchase of used salvage OE parts would be helpful if budget is a priority.

[Mayorchuck]

In the WDS for something else. Here is some info on your car in case you need it down the road. MS42

A6000 Engine control module (DME) Connector overview Number X-pin, color Description X60001 9-pin, black Connector Engine control module (DME) Module 1 X60002 24-pin, black Connector Engine control module (DME) Module 2 X60003 52-pin, black Connector Engine control module (DME) Module 3 X60004 40-pin, black Connector Engine control module (DME) Module 4 X60005 9-pin, black Connector Engine control module (DME) Module 5 Pin assignments at connector X60001 Pin Type Description / Signal type Connection / Measuring notes 1 E Activation Unloader relay terminal 15 Unloader relay terminal 15 2 Not used 3 Not used 4 M Ground Ground point Automatic transmission Ground splice 5 M Ground Ground point 6 M Ground Ground point 7 E Terminal 30 voltage supply B+ E-box junction point 8 E Terminal 87 Fuse F2 9 E Terminal 87 Fuse F2 Pin assignments at connector X60002 Pin Type Description / Signal type Connection / Measuring notes 1 M Heated oxygen sensor ground Heated oxygen sensor I in front of catalytic converter 2 E Back-up light signal Back-up light switch 3 E/A CAN-bus low AGS transmission control module 4 E/A CAN-bus high AGS transmission control module 5 Not used 6 E/A Data link TXD AGS transmission control module 7 M Heated oxygen sensor ground Heated oxygen sensor I behind catalytic converter 8 Not used 9 Not used 10 Not used 11 Not used 12 A Signal, running losses Fuel changeover circuit 13 M Heated oxygen sensor ground Heated oxygen sensor II in front of catalytic converter 14 E Heated oxygen sensor signal Heated oxygen sensor I in front of catalytic converter 15 E Heated oxygen sensor signal Heated oxygen sensor II in front of catalytic converter 16 E Heated oxygen sensor signal Heated oxygen sensor I behind catalytic converter 17 Not used 18 E Heated oxygen sensor signal Heated oxygen sensor II behind catalytic converter 19 M Heated oxygen sensor ground Heated oxygen sensor II behind catalytic converter 20 M Ground Oxygen sensor heater Heated oxygen sensor I in front of catalytic converter 21 M Ground Oxygen sensor heater Heated oxygen sensor II in front of catalytic converter 22 M Ground Oxygen sensor heater Heated oxygen sensor I behind catalytic converter 23 M Negative activation Engine control module relay 24 M Ground Oxygen sensor heater Heated oxygen sensor II behind catalytic converter Pin assignments at connector X60003 Pin Type Description / Signal type Connection / Measuring notes 1 E Hot-film mass air flow sensor signal Hot-film mass air flow sensor 2 E Camshaft position sensor signal Camshaft sensor II 3 Not used 4 A Power Throttle potentiometer 1, driver's wish 1 Throttle valve 5 E Camshaft position sensor signal Camshaft sensor I 6 Not used 7 A Power Throttle potentiometer 2, driver's wish 2 Throttle valve 8 E Crankshaft position sensor signal Crankshaft position/RPM sensor 9 E Signal, driver's wish 2 Throttle valve 10 E Signal Throttle position sensor I Throttle valve 11 Not used 12 E Voltage signal, terminal 30h Starter 13 E Generator D+ (terminal 61) signal Generator 14 M Component ground Throttle potentiometer 1, driver's wish 1 Throttle valve 15 M Camshaft position sensor ground Camshaft sensor II 16 E Signal, driver's wish 1 Throttle valve 17 M Hot-film mass air flow sensor ground Hot-film mass air flow sensor 18 M Camshaft position sensor ground Camshaft sensor I 19 E Signal Throttle position sensor II Throttle valve 20 M Component ground Throttle potentiometer 2, driver's wish 2 Throttle valve 21 M Ground Crankshaft position/RPM sensor 22 E Temperature sensor signal Intake air temperature sensor 23 M Ground Intake air temperature sensor Intake air temperature sensor 24 E Temperature sensor signal Dual temperature sensor 25 M Ground Dual temperature sensor Dual temperature sensor 26 E Signal Oil pressure switch Oil pressure switch 27 A Signal Oil temperature sensor Oil temperature sensor 28 M Ground Oil temperature sensor Oil temperature sensor 29 E Sensor 1 signal Knock sensor 30 M Sensor ground Knock sensor 31 E Sensor 2 signal Knock sensor 32 M Sensor ground Knock sensor 33 M Negative activation Cyl. 1 fuel injection valve Cyl. 1 fuel injection valve 34 M Negative activation Cyl. 2 fuel injection valve Cyl. 2 fuel injection valve 35 M Negative activation Cyl. 3 fuel injection valve Cyl. 3 fuel injection valve 36 M Negative activation Cyl. 4 fuel injection valve Cyl. 4 fuel injection valve 37 M Negative activation Cyl. 5 fuel injection valve Cyl. 5 fuel injection valve 38 M Negative activation Cyl. 6 fuel injection valve Cyl. 6 fuel injection valve 39 E Signal Oil level sensor Oil level sensor 40 A Injection signal VANOS inlet valve VANOS inlet valve 41 A Injection signal VANOS exhaust valve VANOS exhaust valve 42 A Injection signal Evaporative emission valve Evaporative emission valve 43 A Throttle actuator Throttle valve 44 A Throttle actuator Throttle valve 45 E Signal Thermostat, characteristic map cooling Thermostat, characteristic map cooling 46 A Idle speed control - closing winding Idle speed control valve 47 A Idle speed control - opening winding Idle speed control valve 48 M Shield, knock sensor Knock sensor 49 M Injection signal Valve, individual control intake system Valve, individual control intake system 50 Not used 51 Not used 52 M Injection signal Secondary air injection pump valve Secondary air injection pump valve Pin assignments at connector X60004 Pin Type Description / Signal type Connection / Measuring notes 1 A Charge indicator signal (terminal 61) Instrument cluster 2 A Voltage signal, terminal 30h Instrument cluster Integrated instrument cluster control module (IKE) 3 A Activation, secondary air pump relay Secondary air injection pump relay 4 E Signal Electric fan Electric fan 5 Not used 6 Not used 7 Not used 8 Not used 9 Not used 10 A Activation, fuel pump relay (EKP) Fuel pump relay 11 A Oil pressure indicator Instrument cluster 12 Not used 13 Not used 14 Not used 15 Not used 16 Not used 17 A Engine speed signal output (TD) Data link connector 18 Not used 19 E Signal Back-up light Instrument cluster Integrated instrument cluster control module (IKE) 20 Not used 21 A Signal Oil level sensor Light module 22 E RH rear engine speed signal ABS/ASC control module ABS/DSC control module 23 E Signal Clutch pedal position switch Clutch pedal position switch 24 E Brake light switch signal Brake light switch 25 Not used 26 E Voltage supply, terminal 15 Fuse F14 27 E Data link MFL Coil spring 28 E Brake light test signal Brake light switch 29 E A/C compressor signal Heating and A/C control module 30 M Ground Leakage diagnosis pump 31 Not used 32 A Diagnosis signal TXD Data link connector 33 E/A Communication link (EWS) Electronic drive-away protection control unit (EWS) 34 A Signal, leak diagnosis pump Leakage diagnosis pump 35 Not used 36 E/A CAN-bus high CAN link 37 E/A CAN-bus low CAN link 38 M Ground Coolant outlet temperature sensor 39 E Signal Coolant outlet temperature sensor 40 Not used Pin assignments at connector X60005 Pin Type Description / Signal type Connection / Measuring notes 1 A Terminal 1 signal Cyl. 3 ignition coil 2 A Terminal 1 signal Cyl. 2 ignition coil 3 A Terminal 1 signal Cyl. 1 ignition coil 4 Not used 5 M Ground Ground point 6 M Ground Ground splice X6900 7 A Terminal 1 signal Cyl. 6 ignition coil 8 A Terminal 1 signal Cyl. 5 ignition coil 9 A Terminal 1 signal Cyl. 4 ignition coil

Ohms should be 550 or close to that between pins 1 and 2. Seen them bad right out of the box.


Back to the ball game for me.

[328 Power 04]

It's MS42, but it does apply.

The little fuse carrier in dme box is worth checking too.

[Mayorchuck]

I just went by what he put in post #7. If the harness was cut, wouldn't be at all surprised if one, or more, of the carrier fuses are blown.

[bmwdirtracer]

It seems to me that the testing is badly flawed. And so is Pelican's, by the way.

First, the OP's:
Pin 1 of the plug is 12 volts. Pin 3 is ground, provided by the DME. Pin 2 is signal...FROM the sensor to the DME. There's not a testworthy voltage at pin 2, with the sensor unplugged, engine not rotating. (You've also given two different voltages for your test of pins 2 & 3, but not to worry, because that is not a valid test.

The Pelican test, which is of a cam sensor, says that you should see the voltage spike twice every revolution of the engine. That is wrong. On a cam sensor test, you would see the spike ONCE every TWO revolutions. Also, their photo 10 disagrees with the caption for photo 10; the meter does NOT show 5 volts....which is good, because the sensor would be bad, if the voltage did not change, from picture 9.... (I have sent them a comment)


Personally, I'd guess that the wiring harness is shorted, but that's just a guess.

[Support528]

thanks for the pinout but it's ms42.I feel like that one rick and morty episode where they split into different realities and that's just me with all my car problems now haha.

It's a $30 crank sensor I got and in 2017 I wouldn't dought it's a rip off. There's still no rpm signal but I'm getting a reading from all other sensors. I'm about to replace it with oem and like I should anyway because I'm still driving this car, I'm still going to need a trusted sensor because I drive hundreds of miles away from my house at times.


Im going to run the pelican test on the crank sensor today, like Chris described. I should see the voltage go to zero on some degree of the engine and not stay consent. Let's see what that brings

i tested the old sensor between pins 1 and 2 and got 5.4 ohms. Idk who said that it should be 550ohms

[Support528]

no codes today stored in the computer



I have one question that NEEDS to be answered.

When turing the car over, in a no start situation, should the engine RPMS be shown? Saying that it's a good sensor.

I have no engine RPMS being shown in the live data on my scan tool when I crank the car

[bmwdirtracer]

"i tested the old sensor between pins 1 and 2 and got 5.4 ohms. Idk who said that it should be 550ohms"

The guy with the correct numbers. Are you sure your multimeter is set at the correct range? Because 0.54 kilo ohms equals 540 ohms.

And, yes, IF you have a good scan tool, you should see engine rpms with the starter turning. (It's usually about 250 rpm until the engine starts) However, many poor scan tools have a very poor "refresh" rate, and you may not see a reading because of your scan tool, not necessarily because the DME isn't seeing timing info.

[MIKYZZ4]

If the DME is receiving the signal from the sensor, your dash tach should display rpm.

[Support528]

It's a fluke I just set it to ohms and that's it. I know the correct value is 550, that's the old sensor any way. I tested it on another vehicle and it takes about a second for the rpm to show up. It's a craftsman.

This is is exactly what I just did to test the new crankshaft sensor I put in

1. Found the crankshaft signal wire going into the DME on the 54 pin black connector. It was PIN number 8

2.Spliced into the wire,not cutting it, wrapped another wire around it so I can connect to my multimeter.

3. Turning the engine over manually, I saw 0.066 volts to 5v with every slight movement I turned the engine. Like it was reading every tooth on the fly wheel

did I do this test correctly? Is there another test I can preform? The sensor is definitely not dropping down to a complete 0 volts. I used the "strut tower ground" and the ground the DME uses

[Support528]

My OBD to USB cord gets here on Monday so we will be able to really see what this DME is saying.

Lets not not forget the idiot who grounded power lol


What a good software for this kind of DME? I have tuner studio and NCS viewer.

there is no spark so the DME and EWS could be out of line.

Im dealing with like three different issues and normally don't source help but I really need more minds on this one. Thank you everyone for help up until this point

[Mayorchuck]

It's a 2000...e39
M54
Ms43


just hit 200,000 miles

Went off this info.

[Support528]

Went off this info.

Idk why I said ms43 it's ms42 oops

[328 Power 04]

I am not sure if a basic OBD scanner will offer it, but a BMW oriented scanner would immediately tell you of an immobilizer problem.